Searched the site for Colitis/bloody diarrhea threads but...

[selzer]

Originally Posted by Heidigsd

You really need to knock it off with these posts putting down veterinarians

Oh I don't know, it is pretty refreshing when they are bashing someone other than breeders. I actually like my vet, all the vets at the place I go to. But I see a lot of times when vets push procedures and products that are not necessarily good for dogs, like over-vaccination, early spay/neuter, and foods like Iams and Science Diet.

I could go through a whole list of situations where veterinarians should have or should not have done something.

And I got a pup back last year whose vet had plastered over the top of every invoice, "Your Pet's Health is our Only Priority" and in three months, they charged this person over $800 in well-puppy visits without even spaying the bitch. Insane. If you think there are no vets who are actually more concerned with the dollars and cents, then you are being blinkered by some sort of bias.

[sparra]

Originally Posted by selzer

If you think there are no vets who are actually more concerned with the dollars and cents, then you are being blinkered by some sort of bias.

Likewise...if you think there are no vets who are actually more concerned with your pets well being, then you are being blinkered by some sort of bias...not pointing a finger at you selzer......but there are some with a real chip on their shoulder when it comes to vets.

[AJT]

So uh...um...yea...did I forget to mention that Ava is feeling better?

Not wanting to really contribute but rather diffuse this tension on the thread but I'm sure there as just as many human doctors that are happily describing god knows what to the masses cause of a nicer paycheck. You just hope that these vets and doctors or anyone providing a service are the minority.

So Ava is feeling better! Yeaaaaaaaaaaa

[selzer]

Yay! Ava is feeling better.

I was serious about my dogs' colitis attacks completely stopping after switching dog foods. So if this happens again, and again, you might want to consider changing foods.

[GatorBytes]

Good Job owning your thread

Yay for Ava!

Caution however...please consider never vaxing again re: heart, and no heartworm prevention, at least until you read up on the likelyhood of catching it depending on your area (have to have 2 weeks consistant temps of 56F day and night - then after a heat wave you treat, not before)..will forward the articles regarding.

and the post/jab about vets is not about all vets, just vets that over script for minor issues, and only because I CARE about dogs...as one says on this thread....they aren't humans w/fur, which means they also shouldn't be fed processed food or be drugged to DEATH!

Cheers

Originally Posted by AJT

So uh...um...yea...did I forget to mention that Ava is feeling better?

Not wanting to really contribute but rather diffuse this tension on the thread but I'm sure there as just as many human doctors that are happily describing god knows what to the masses cause of a nicer paycheck. You just hope that these vets and doctors or anyone providing a service are the minority.

So Ava is feeling better! Yeaaaaaaaaaaa

Also want to make a suggestion to have on hand in case of bouts in future 1) Activated Charcoal - this can help absorb toxins and sweep out of the body (used in over dose in hospitals to assist in preventing absorption in the blood and can be used in emerg. situations if pup eats something and after (if) vomiting is to be induced - you would also need hydrogen peroxide to induce), 2) Slippery elm, this is like an internal band-aide, coats the gi track from end to end, re: mucousal lining

[harmony]

Originally Posted by AJT

So uh...um...yea...did I forget to mention that Ava is feeling better?

Not wanting to really contribute but rather diffuse this tension on the thread but I'm sure there as just as many human doctors that are happily describing god knows what to the masses cause of a nicer paycheck. You just hope that these vets and doctors or anyone providing a service are the minority.

So Ava is feeling better! Yeaaaaaaaaaaa

[BowWowMeow]

So glad to hear that she is feeling better, drinking on her own and has an appetite! I'm glad to hear that her blood work came out ok and wish you the best with the cardiology appt.

I second the suggestion to keep activated charcoal and slippery elm on hand. They have gotten a couple of my dogs (and me!) through some really nasty GI stuff.

[Anubis_Star]

Originally Posted by GatorBytes

Good Job owning your thread

Yay for Ava!

Caution however...please consider never vaxing again re: heart, and no heartworm prevention, at least until you read up on the likelyhood of catching it depending on your area (have to have 2 weeks consistant temps of 56F day and night - then after a heat wave you treat, not before)..will forward the articles regarding.

and the post/jab about vets is not about all vets, just vets that over script for minor issues, and only because I CARE about dogs...as one says on this thread....they aren't humans w/fur, which means they also shouldn't be fed processed food or be drugged to DEATH!

Where are the clinical findings backing that vaccines have any effect on a dog with an enlarged heart? And heartworm preventative has NO contraindications in a dog with cardiac disease, in fact the opposite is true! If a dog is already fighting one form of heart disease, you do NOT want that dog getting heartworms and just adding to the cardiac problem!

It is unlikely that a heart would be enlarged in conjunction with heart disease unless there was a murmur or other symptoms of heart disease. It may be over-interpretation of the films by the veterinarian. At my clinic we ALWAYS send out films to a board-certified radiologist for additional interpretation.

If there are no other signs of heart disease, such as a murmur, then I would first want said radiographs to be sent to a radiologist FIRST. It may very well save a cardiology exam fee, if they say "No, we do not feel this is an enlarged heart, and there are not other indicators of cardiac disease". I'm not saying your vet is wrong, or your vet "sucks". But xrays, it's a skill to read them. That's why we have board-certified radiologists that do nothing but sit all day and read radiographs.

As far as a link between an enlarged heart and the episode of diarrhea, I see none. Yes, there MAY potentially be a link (parvo can affect the heart), but it is VERY VERY unlikely. Most likely, two separate problems here, as posted above.

I am finding your posts to be very DANGEROUS, the more I see of them. I'm sorry, I am speaking out from a professional standpoint. I have agreed with you before, I DO think in many cases we over-vaccinate. But to REPEATEDLY warn people against vaccination, and to link every problem under the sun to vaccination? NO. You are doing every member on this board a disservice, and that is my professional opinion.

WHEN, not if but WHEN someone listens to you, and WHEN they don't vaccinate against rabies, and WHEN there dog either kills a raccoon or gets out and bites someone or something else happens, there will be LARGE consequences. Or WHEN that person, who takes there dog to the dog park every single day, doesn't vaccinate and their dog gets distemper, there WILL be consequences.

Every person needs to look at their risks and exposure levels. We just euthanized a 1 year old intact mastiff that was NEVER vaccinated, and it had distemper.

[Anubis_Star]

Originally Posted by selzer

Alrighty then, so are ya saying that hemorrhagic gastroenteritis is the same thing as colitis? Well, I guess some vets just call it that to scare the crap out of people then.

Yes and no.... diseases can be hard to comprehend, it took me a while. Many things, like kennel cough and HGE and colitis, are more descriptive terms than actual specific diseases.

I am at work right now, I just had a long talk with the DR about this. At first, per both our understanding, HGE included bloody diarrhea AND vomiting. Hemorrhagic Gastroenteritis, the gastroenteritis implying both vomiting and diarrhea, hemorrhagic obviously bloody. Looking at the very words, it's simply a description (BTW per this case, I disagree with the vet, I think this very much was HGE because it was bloody diarrhea and vomiting, with an unknown cause, but that's neither here nor there. YAY Ava for doing better, THAT is the important part). Colitis is a thickening and irritation of the intestine wall, (Col - intestine, Itis - inflammation), causing diarrhea. Once again, just another DESCRIPTION and not an actual specific DISEASE.

Per the understanding of the two, every HGE case WOULD have colitis, because the intestine would obviously be inflamed and irritated. However, not every case of colitis would be HGE, because not every case of colitis includes vomiting or the presence of blood.

We did however just search on a veterinary forum database, and it looks like the consensus is that HGE DOESN'T always have to include vomiting, just bloody diarrhea alone could be termed HGE.

Someone asked earlier, HGE is vomiting/bloody diarrhea usually of UNKNOWN cause, therefor my Dr and I both agree Parvo wouldn't really be considered a type of HGE because there is a known cause. But I guess theoretically you could consider it HGE caused by the parvo virus.

[msvette2u]

Originally Posted by Heidigsd

You really need to knock it off with these posts putting down veterinarians

Thank you!

AJT I'm so glad Ava is better. What a scare!
We learned a lot in this thread, about HGE and gastroenteritis, etc.
We have a rescue and I believe your vet followed perfect protocol; in the face of non-specific bloody diarrhea, you'd treat the symptoms and give antibiotics specific to gastro (metronidazole), fluids, either IV or subcu, and that's exactly what she did.

I find the continual vet bashing disappointing; when someone's best advice is "avoid the vet office at all costs", it's really alarming and potentially deadly for your pet.

If you don't like your vet or don't trust them, find a new one.
It's that simple.

We've vet shopped a number of times over this past year; the vet we've settled on costs a bit more than our "usual" one and he's further away, but I love his care and treatment of our dogs. He'll find us even when we're there with fosters, to ask about how our personal pets are doing; and he looks really nice in jeans