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#1 (permalink) |
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Member
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Wis
Posts: 59
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In my city there are two restaurants that I used to frequent, before I started using a Service Dog for mobility/hearing. Several people I know have been denied access to these restaurants by the owners who state "absolutely NO dogs because of owners religion".
I would like to go back to these restaurants, but want to be fully prepared to present a calm and assertive front. In addition to my dog being impeccable groom, having a vest with SD signage, and having the printout from the DOJ, what else can I prepare myself with? Or, can the owners absolutely refuse all dogs because of religious beliefs, as they state? I appreciate ideas others can provide me, as I want to be able to present facts. If I have a confrontation, (which I fully expect)what do I do? Just leave as others have done, or call police and file a report to document the event? I don't want to cause a hassle, I just want to be able to go to the restaurant to meet with friends like I used to. |
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#2 (permalink) |
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Crowned Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: NH
Posts: 4,413
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I thought all places had to let a SD dog in?? Am I just ill informed?
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Allie owned by: Athena 5/4/08 http://www.dogster.com/dogs/925796 Lexi 6/1/07 Puggle of some sort |
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#3 (permalink) |
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Knighted Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 2,831
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Why go expecting to have a confrontation?
I would check with your City/state/Municipality licensing and business departments now to see if they are violating access rules and let them have the confrontation. Then after the authorities handle it, you can go in with a "oh did the big bad officials slap your hand" mentality and enjoy your meal with your friends.
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#4 (permalink) |
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Crowned Member
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 9,357
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TJ or someone will provide better legal clarification, (technically, the SD's access would be permitted if it meets ADA and any state statues regarding access/ID cape/vesting etc.) but here's a practical concern for you to, perhaps, (or perhaps not) think about:
Restaurants are the one place I never wanted to force a confrontation, especially when the battle was over cultural issues regarding dogs. Having been in a similar situation, I remember that my food hygiene/safety concerns overrode my consideration of my right to have my dog with me, and I did choose another restaurant. If I fully expected a confrontation, I would be aware that those preparing my food may not be especially pleased with me at the time of my food preparation. (gosh, I am being subtle here..)
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Patti Frauchen von: Grimm van den Heuvel, aka "The Doofinator" My strong-minded, very loving boy |
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#5 (permalink) |
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Crowned Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: NH
Posts: 4,413
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Good point Patti,
If they are like that I would figure they don't need my business anyway and take it else where.I've stopped going to certain places because I didn't like the service but loved the product.
__________________
Allie owned by: Athena 5/4/08 http://www.dogster.com/dogs/925796 Lexi 6/1/07 Puggle of some sort |
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#6 (permalink) |
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Member
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Wis
Posts: 59
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Wow, Patti, good points. Perhaps I wouldn't want to eat that food!
![]() A person on another forum said that we must respect others religious/cultural differences, even though legally they must provide access. I guess I really don't want to go there, after seeing the replies here. I find this rather strange in a town where there are alot of students at the School for the Blind, and quite a few of them being paired up with Guide Dogs. Apparently, everyone just leaves after being confronted at the door of this restaurant. There are two in our town, I believe owned by the same family, and both refuse ALL dogs. I just wish there was a nice way to educate them, and make it easier for the next unsuspecting person with a SD who goes there. |
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#7 (permalink) |
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Moderator
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: North Central FLorida
Posts: 8,296
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This is a question that really can't be answered in a few words. Some would say call the local police and some would say sue them. The answer is not that clear and easy.
Some background first: The ADA (the Americans Disability Act of 1990) was a <u>statutory law </u>(passed by the legislature) signed into effect by the senior President Bush in 1990. As a law you can not call the ADA or speak with the ADA since it is words on paper. Congress mandated different Government Agencies to oversee different aspects and sections of the the ADA. The agency put over the section dealing with Public Access was the DOJ (Department of Justice). When a regulatory agency such as the DOJ makes laws those laws are called <u>regulatory law</u>. These agency laws are added to the Codes of Federal Regulation or the CFR. Another point: The ADA does not address Service Dogs or Service Dogs in Training. It was the DOJ that spoke on and clarified that Service Animals (again notice that Service Dogs in Training/SDITs) are not addressed by the DOJ either. It was in the <u>DOJ regulatory law 28 C.F.R. 36.104 Definitions </u>that we are told what a service animal is. (The definition is scheduled to be modified this year.) Quote: Service animal means any guide dog, signal dog, or other animal individually trained to do work or perform tasks for the benefit of an individual with a disability, including, but not limited to, guiding individuals with impaired vision, alerting individuals with impaired hearing to intruders or sounds, providing minimal protection or rescue work, pulling a wheelchair, or fetching dropped items. Besides regulatory laws published in the CFR, the DOJ from time to time issues technical letters and in greater detail technical manuals. In the Americans with Disabilities Act, ADA Title III Technical Assistance Manual, Covering Public Accommodations and Commercial Facilities we see what areas are considered Public Access and where Service Dogs are allowed. Quote: III-1.2000 Public accommodations. The broad range of title III obligations relating to "places of public accommodation" must be met by entities that the Department of Justice regulation labels as "public accommodations. " In order to be considered a public accommodation with title III obligations, an entity must be private and it must -- Own; Lease; Lease to; or Operate a place of public accommodation. What is a place of public accommodation? A place of public accommodation is a facility whose operations -- Affect commerce; and Fall within at least one of the following 12 categories: 1) Places of lodging (e.g. , inns, hotels, motels) (except for owner-occupied establishments renting fewer than six rooms); 2) Establishments serving food or drink (e.g. , restaurants and bars); (Bolding is mine to highlight area used in this discussion.)
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TJ Karl's Kids Program Inc Animal Services 2000 Education * Community & Emergency Services Member of Assistance Dog Advocacy Project (ADAP) ADAP Blog |
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#8 (permalink) |
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Moderator
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: North Central FLorida
Posts: 8,296
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(cont.)
Also from the above technical manual, Quote: III-1.8200 Other Federal and State laws. Title III does not disturb other Federal laws or any State law that provides protection for individuals with disabilities at a level greater or equal to that provided by the ADA. It does, however, prevail over any conflicting State laws The above gives protection to SDITs in SOME states which give the same Public Access rights to the handlers or trainers of SDITs as are granted to SDs. But this is best left for a different discussion as the OP stated they have a SD. Also from the technical manual under review is the following: III-4.2300 Service animals. A public accommodation must modify its policies to permit the use of a service animal by an individual with a disability, unless doing so would result in a fundamental alteration or jeopardize the safe operation of the public accommodation. Service animals include any animal individually trained to do work or perform tasks for the benefit of an individual with a disability. Tasks typically performed by service animals include guiding people with impaired vision, alerting individuals with impaired hearing to the presence of intruders or sounds, providing minimal protection or rescue work, pulling a wheelchair, or retrieving dropped items. The care or supervision of a service animal is the responsibility of his or her owner, not the public accommodation. A public accommodation may not require an individual with a disability to post a deposit as a condition to permitting a service animal to accompany its owner in a place of public accommodation, even if such deposits are required for pets. ILLUSTRATION: An individual who is blind wishes to be accompanied in a restaurant by her guide dog. The restaurant must permit the guide dog to accompany its owner in all areas of the restaurant open to other patrons and may not insist that the dog be separated from her. A number of States have programs to certify service animals. A private entity, however, may not insist on proof of State certification before permitting the entry of a service animal to a place of public accommodation.
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TJ Karl's Kids Program Inc Animal Services 2000 Education * Community & Emergency Services Member of Assistance Dog Advocacy Project (ADAP) ADAP Blog |
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#9 (permalink) |
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Moderator
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: North Central FLorida
Posts: 8,296
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(cont.)
And now with that background we can get into the answer of how to enforce the DOJ's regulatory law. Again from the technical manual, quote: III-8.0000 ENFORCEMENT Regulatory references: 28 CFR 36.501-36.508. III-8.1000 General. The ADA establishes two avenues for enforcement of the requirements of title III -- 1) Private suits by individuals who are being subjected to discrimination or who have reasonable grounds for believing that they are about to be subjected to discrimination. 2) Suits by the Department of Justice, whenever it has reasonable cause to believe that there is a pattern or practice of discrimination, or discrimination that raises an issue of general public importance. The Department will investigate complaints and conduct compliance reviews of covered entities. Do State or local civil rights agencies have any role in enforcing title III? There is no provision for State or local civil rights agencies to directly enforce title III of the ADA. They can, however, enforce State or local laws that incorporate the standards of the ADA, or they can set up alternative dispute resolution mechanisms (see III-8.6000). (Again bolding is mine to highlight a point.) This brings out the fact that calling the local police dept. will not settle the issue based on ADA/DOJ (civil right laws). Law enforcement at the local level can only enforce those laws (criminal statutes) that are have been empowered to them be it city, county, or state. To bring charges or a lawsuit against a business that refuses Public Access with a SD someone must go through the avenues put into place by the DOJ. Some cases may not be of interest enough to the DOJ to follow through on and in those cases the individual most bring the charges at their own expense and time. Much more information than anyone thought they would get. But now you see why when someone says "Call the cops" or "Sue the socks off of that business" it is something that is not always so very easy to do. To read the above mentioned manual yourself or to look up the process to bring charges against a business --> LINK
__________________
TJ Karl's Kids Program Inc Animal Services 2000 Education * Community & Emergency Services Member of Assistance Dog Advocacy Project (ADAP) ADAP Blog |
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#10 (permalink) |
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Member
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Wis
Posts: 59
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Thank you so much for the information, and the link. I guess I need to decide if I will just "let it go" (which is the easiest), as everyone else has done, or to try and talk to the people.
I do respect their culture, but how does anyone know when going to a family restaurant what their beliefs are? It isn't something posted on the door, nor do I expect it to be. I do believe that if you are open for business, that should include everyone. It makes me angry when my friends gather there and the only way I could join them is to leave my dog in the car, and use a SP(service person) to walk into the restaurant. At this point, I have not done this yet, if my dog isn't good enough to go in...neither am I. ![]() I wish I had the energy to push the issue, but I am happy to be out and about, fairly independent with my SD, and don't need the stress. |
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