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Old 08-07-2014, 10:07 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Talking Welcome to the Dog World!

Gee wiz I am kind of in a state of shock here.

I was in contact with a breeder because they were selling Julius K9 training gear and equipment as I was interested in the harnesses/side-bags and a hoodie. We were discussing possible sizes for the harnesses when my pup eventually reaches his adult size and the breeder asked where I got the pup from. I gladly told them, thinking that there's no harm in saying so and then the breeder emails me back saying:

"I owned the sire. Not a very good dog. Be careful."

A bit miffed, I emailed back: "Thanks for letting me know. What's not good about him?"

Then the breeder gave me a long email apologizing to me that they did not mean to knock back my puppy, saying that they once owned the sire and that he was not breed worthy, a very average working dog with low drives, thin nerves etc. They also owned the sire's brother who was a superstar. They also said that my breeder was being dishonest and was trying to make as though their litter was a super litter to unsuspecting buyers because they were related to the the breeder I was talking to at the moment. My breeder is apparently a xxxxxxx artist. Then the breeder said welcome to the dog world!

I don't know whether I should believe this or not. But really! Is the dog world really like this where people are dishonest and bash on one another? It sounds like a nasty place! I can't believe that some people knowingly rip people off, knowingly misrepresent what their dogs are, say wonderful false things, all for a quick buck??? Whatever happened to the good of the breed and matching a pup to the right home for the good life of the puppy. Just scoundrel.

Last edited by JeanKBBMMMAAN; 08-08-2014 at 10:48 AM. Reason: pseudo
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Old 08-07-2014, 10:13 AM   #2 (permalink)
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It is not always like that, but yes it is a Dog eat Dog world we live in
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Old 08-07-2014, 10:18 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Sounds like some personal issues in the works. Good breeders don't bash other breeders. Seems pretty petty to me.

Even if the sire was not world-level working dog caliber, I'm sure your pup will be just fine for your purposes and will make a great dog for you to do most anything you would like to try with him.
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Old 08-07-2014, 10:36 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Most good breeders aren’t going to bash each other…but I wouldn’t consider what that breeder sent to you as bashing. The breeder is giving you what sounds to be an honest opinion about the sire. Not sure what the sire’s titles/accomplishments are…but in most cases, when an untitled dog gets sold/rehomed, it’s more for a negative reason than for a good one. Most breeders aren’t going to be selling their good stock to others when it could be used to breed.

A lot of breeders will not lie to potential owners, but they’ll embellish the truth. At the end of the day, 95% of buyers have no idea what they’re looking at. They see a nice, calm dog (sire/dam) maybe do a bit of obedience, maybe show some protection, and are very impressed. The breeder talks a little about what all that means, how their dogs are better than others, and they make a sale. Unless that dog ends up having huge temperament issues (uncontrolled aggression) or a terrible genetic disease of some sort…the buyer is going to be very happy. It doesn’t have to be the ultimate world champion working dog, it just has to be a good dog.
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Old 08-07-2014, 10:46 AM   #5 (permalink)
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to me some things in your original thread didn't sound right. so I'd believe this guy. but i guess you wait and see. I have a dog from a puppy mill. he's amazing.

that whole police dog thing is way overplayed. sounds like a sales gimmick when there's nothing else to brag about. just my uneducated opinion as usual
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Old 08-07-2014, 10:52 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Yeah, not sure if it's exactly bashing or not but this is what was said.

'hi
first let me apologize. I wasnít trying to knock your puppy. sorry.
to clarify;
I owned (SIRE) and sold him as he is a very average working dog, low drive, thin nerve. in my opinion not breed worthy. however a very nice family pet.
to quantify;
I owned and trained (SIRE)'s brother (BROTHER), who is now a mwd. that dog is a superstar.
I've worked most dogs from (SIRE)'s litter as well as his mother. and multiple other dogs that she has produced. (SIRE) wouldnt rank in my top 10 dogs shes produced.
(SIRE) was bred by my good friend.
so my opinion of (SIRE) is a true one.
lastly, I also owned trained and sold (DAM)'s litter brother, now pd sert.
I had several people contact me re (SIRE)'s litter, as they stated that litter was allegedly being spruked as a super litter coz (SIRE) is (BROTHER)'s brother and (DAM) is pd sert sister.
in fact, only 2 mths ago (SIRE) was for sale coz (MY BREEDER) said he was indeed a very average dog.
I donít like breeders who bull**** unsuspecting buyers. but note all of the above is just my opinion.
welcome to the dog world!!
I am just pointing out facts that u may or may not wish to know. I hope I didnít offend, but my opinion of working dogs is highly respected and I believe people shouldnít be sold the dream in order for a breeder to make money.
cheers"

I edited out the identities and replaced with the capitols surrounded by brackets. But this is word for word.
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Old 08-07-2014, 11:40 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Look at the dog in front of you.

Work with the dog in front of you.

If the brother was a superstar -- per them, the genes are there.

I would not necessarily believe them. Do not allow what they said to affect how you view your puppy. It is possible that they have personal or professional issues with the current owner of the dog, and are getting back at them in a mean way.

Yes, dog people can be as crazy as, or crazier than the rest of humanity.
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Old 08-07-2014, 12:10 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoshi View Post
Yeah, not sure if it's exactly bashing or not but this is what was said.

'hi
first let me apologize. I wasn’t trying to knock your puppy. sorry.
to clarify;
I owned (SIRE) and sold him as he is a very average working dog, low drive, thin nerve. in my opinion not breed worthy. however a very nice family pet.
to quantify;
I owned and trained (SIRE)'s brother (BROTHER), who is now a mwd. that dog is a superstar.
I've worked most dogs from (SIRE)'s litter as well as his mother. and multiple other dogs that she has produced. (SIRE) wouldnt rank in my top 10 dogs shes produced.
(SIRE) was bred by my good friend.
so my opinion of (SIRE) is a true one.
lastly, I also owned trained and sold (DAM)'s litter brother, now pd sert.
I had several people contact me re (SIRE)'s litter, as they stated that litter was allegedly being spruked as a super litter coz (SIRE) is (BROTHER)'s brother and (DAM) is pd sert sister.
in fact, only 2 mths ago (SIRE) was for sale coz (MY BREEDER) said he was indeed a very average dog.
I don’t like breeders who bull**** unsuspecting buyers. but note all of the above is just my opinion.
welcome to the dog world!!
I am just pointing out facts that u may or may not wish to know. I hope I didn’t offend, but my opinion of working dogs is highly respected and I believe people shouldn’t be sold the dream in order for a breeder to make money.
cheers"

I edited out the identities and replaced with the capitols surrounded by brackets. But this is word for word.
Anyone who uses u instead of you and coz instead of because wouldn't be highly respected in my books, but I'm fairly... picky.

Keep in mind, however, while maybe your breeder could be questionable, this new breeder you are speaking with is in competition with your pup's breeder. Therefor, I'd immediately question his trustworthiness unless I've seen proof otherwise. Everyone else here is perfectly right though, your dog is in no way devalued. You will do great things with him and love him all the same.
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Last edited by ApselBear; 08-07-2014 at 12:15 PM.
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Old 08-07-2014, 12:11 PM   #9 (permalink)
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yeah, that's why I said I have a puppy mill dog who's amazing. it's not just my opinion. I haven't heard one bad thing about him and heard many good ones, from trainers too.

you might very well end up with a good dog. but your breeder still sounds like a bs artist and I thought so before I saw your post here.
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Old 08-07-2014, 12:22 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoshi View Post
Yeah, not sure if it's exactly bashing or not but this is what was said.

'hi
first let me apologize. I wasnít trying to knock your puppy. sorry.
to clarify;
I owned (SIRE) and sold him as he is a very average working dog, low drive, thin nerve. in my opinion not breed worthy. however a very nice family pet.
to quantify;
I owned and trained (SIRE)'s brother (BROTHER), who is now a mwd. that dog is a superstar.
I've worked most dogs from (SIRE)'s litter as well as his mother. and multiple other dogs that she has produced. (SIRE) wouldnt rank in my top 10 dogs shes produced.
(SIRE) was bred by my good friend.
so my opinion of (SIRE) is a true one.
lastly, I also owned trained and sold (DAM)'s litter brother, now pd sert.
I had several people contact me re (SIRE)'s litter, as they stated that litter was allegedly being spruked as a super litter coz (SIRE) is (BROTHER)'s brother and (DAM) is pd sert sister.
in fact, only 2 mths ago (SIRE) was for sale coz (MY BREEDER) said he was indeed a very average dog.
I donít like breeders who bull**** unsuspecting buyers. but note all of the above is just my opinion.
welcome to the dog world!!
I am just pointing out facts that u may or may not wish to know. I hope I didnít offend, but my opinion of working dogs is highly respected and I believe people shouldnít be sold the dream in order for a breeder to make money.
cheers"

I edited out the identities and replaced with the capitols surrounded by brackets. But this is word for word.
I don't think it's all that bad. They just feel in "their" opinion, the other breeder did not describe the sire completely leaving out information. I mean depending on what you're going to do with the pup, it may be crucial and then it may not.

I just think the person did what he said, gave you his opinion. Opinion is just that, an opinion. Like selzer said, work with what you got.
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