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Old 12-19-2012, 11:02 AM   #11 (permalink)
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You cannot compare human incident of cancer to that of dogs, nor spaying/neutering to humans.
Dogs live 12-13 yrs. Humans live into their 80s and beyond if lucky.
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Old 12-19-2012, 11:17 AM   #12 (permalink)
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You cannot compare human incident of cancer to that of dogs, nor spaying/neutering to humans.
Dogs live 12-13 yrs. Humans live into their 80s and beyond if lucky.
Not comparing human incident of cancer to dogs.

Cancer VET

and comparing hormone imbalances - humans can talk - dogs cannot.

and not 1 in 4 dogs get mammary cancer, it is an increase of 26% "chance"

When your dog is having hormonal imbalances and itchy skin and hair loss - this will not be connected to the spay from your vet...

Your dog will end up on a cycle of drugs for "possible" bacteria infection from scratching, steroids, diet changes, baths, topical's...as your dog gets older....well that's when cancers rear their head

Hormones play a huge part in development.

Also note that the Immune system has NOT fully developed, the dog will have gone through a series of vaccines - further lending an assault in the already fragile immune system, the denatured kibble diet, pesticide treatment to de-worm, prevent fleas and heartworm....then you put a 6 month old PUPPY (baby) under anesthetic drugs and take out their hormone producing gonads...

What's not to consider. One thing you can bet on, is your vet will always be there for you
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Old 12-19-2012, 11:20 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Look up the new thread titled "questions about pregnancy." If you're willing to deal with things like that, don't spay. If you aren't, just spay her and live a long happy life together. The health risks/benefits have not been proven to be CORRELATED, but CORRELATION doesn't equal CAUSATION. There are too many factors when it comes to health problems to throw it all on spaying/neutering.

This forum really pushes keeping animals intact without thinking about who is on the other end of the leash. If you could tell us more about your lifestyle, what you like to do with your dog, people would be able to give you a better idea of what some of your limitations would be due to having an intact animal.

Like...if you like going to the dog park, probably should have her spayed as she might go through a silent heat and get mounted really quickly. Or if you take her to daycare, most of them do not allow intact animals after they are 6 months of age. If you ever plan on kenneling, many kennels don't allow intact animals. If you leave your dog with a friend and they have an intact male, you might end up with an accidental litter that can put your dog's life in jeapardy.

There is definitely health to take into consideration, but you also have to think about how having an intact animal is going to affect your life and what you are able to do with that animal.

By the way...I'm not pro/anti neutering/spaying. I have an intact male and its definitely more work to keep him than if he was neutered. I've stopped going to the dog park, had to find other places to take him for exercise, when I do have a yard I'll never leave him out there unsupervised, and when we do get a female she'll go through one heat cycle and then be spayed. I think 95% of the pet owning population should spay/neuter. If all you want is a loving pet, there is no reason to add the extra stress of what comes with an intact animal.

Last edited by martemchik; 12-19-2012 at 11:23 AM.
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Old 12-19-2012, 11:21 AM   #14 (permalink)
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My neighbours husband died from bladder cancer.

Would you remove the ovaries of a 12 yr old girl? Think about women who have hysterectomies at child bearing years...forced into early menopause and the side effects of.
Then what does your neighbor's husband dying of bladder cancer have to do with spaying a dog


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This title tells me all I need to know about the biased website to which you link
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Old 12-19-2012, 11:23 AM   #15 (permalink)
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My neighbours husband died from bladder cancer.

Would you remove the ovaries of a 12 yr old girl? Think about women who have hysterectomies at child bearing years...forced into early menopause and the side effects of.
Then what does your neighbor's husband dying of bladder cancer have to do with spaying a dog


Angry Vet
This title tells me all I need to know about the biased website to which you link.

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Originally Posted by martemchik View Post
Look up the new thread titled "questions about pregnancy." If you're willing to deal with things like that, don't spay. If you aren't, just spay her and live a long happy life together. The health risks/benefits have not been proven to be CORRELATED, but CORRELATION doesn't equal CAUSATION. There are too many factors when it comes to health problems to throw it all on spaying/neutering.

This forum really pushes keeping animals intact without thinking about who is on the other end of the leash. If you could tell us more about your lifestyle, what you like to do with your dog, people would be able to give you a better idea of what some of your limitations would be due to having an intact animal.

Like...if you like going to the dog park, probably should have her spayed as she might go through a silent heat and get mounted really quickly. Or if you take her to daycare, most of them do not allow intact animals after they are 6 months of age. If you ever plan on kenneling, many kennels don't allow intact animals. If you leave your dog with a friend and they have an intact male, you might end up with an accidental litter that can put your dog's life in jeapardy.

There is definitely health to take into consideration, but you also have to think about how having an intact animal is going to affect your life and what you are able to do with that animal.
Very good post
Many people simply do not want to deal with the messiness of a girl in heat.
I can barely tolerate it when we have a foster come in while in heat, and our vet will do spay-terminate and spays in heat (or shortly after heats end).
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Old 12-19-2012, 11:25 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Then what does your neighbor's husband dying of bladder cancer have to do with spaying a dog


Angry Vet
This title tells me all I need to know about the biased website to which you link
Well then clearly you have to read it instead of prediposing your bias'

and my neighbours husband suffered greatly - dogs can be PTS, people cannot - the only difference
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Old 12-19-2012, 11:26 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Human cancers have nothing to do with dog cancers.
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Old 12-19-2012, 11:33 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Most dogs reach sexual maturity at about twenty-four months, approximately at the fourth heat in females. At this point in their development, dogs have received the protective benefit of adult sexual hormones and are at a decreased risk for the cancers mentioned above. This recommendation is not one size fits all. Consider your breedís risk for cancers. I recommend you consult with your vet to make a decision on a case-by-case basis.
What is the definition of sexual maturity? I am sure that WD at 10 months old is happy to breed any female who wants to.
Regarding females: isn't this at their first heat? I raised a foster litter from a dog that was bred on her first heat, resulting in 10 vigorous pups.
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Old 12-19-2012, 11:35 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Human cancers have nothing to do with dog cancers.
Gone off track again.

OP, dogs SUFFER from cancer, just like people do. Dogs get chemo, chemo kills the good and bad cells - just like in humans - dogs like humans get cancer

Dogs can be humanly destroyed UNlike humans

That's it

As other poster says, it's up to you, at least you now have something to weigh your decision on.

Vets are general practitioners - they are not versed with the knowledge and sceince behind all illness - that's why there are "specialists" - specialists "further" their education.

That's why I gave you the Dr. Sue CANCER vet link. Angry Vet is a "catchy" title to which he notes in his blog as the ONLY reason for it.
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Old 12-19-2012, 11:59 AM   #20 (permalink)
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okay then Passionate - Frustrated vet
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