Luke's ACA registered (reputable?) can we get him AKC registered?

[mrsartz]

When we picked Luke up we didn't care if he was registered with any club. He was obviously a purebred GSD. We met his parents and they were both obviously purebred GSDs.

When we picked him up the family told us that they had an ACA registration paper that we should send in as soon as we had a chance. They showed us both of their dogs birth certificates and we sent out the form right away.

Now I know this isn't the same as AKC registered and when you call them they claim to be the 2nd largest canine association in the US. My first question is, just how reputable are they? My 2nd question is, can I register my pup through the AKC at this point since he is purebred?

[angelas]

Originally Posted by mrsartz

My first question is, just how reputable are they? My 2nd question is, can I register my pup through the AKC at this point since he is purebred?

Short answers before I leave for work?

No and no.

[Rerun]

seconded

ACA and CKC (continental, not canadian) are two of the biggest BYB registries

You do not know he's purebred, because those registries will accept a picture of a dog and if it looks pure enough, it gets papers. Then when the parents are bred, the pups automatically are eligible for papers. In short, people can take a dog out of a shelter or off the street and if it looks enough like a GSD, it can get registered. Lots of mixes can end up looking very pure, even though infact they aren't.

[Emoore]

However, if the reason you want to get him AKC registered is so that you can compete in AKC-sponsored events, you can get a PAL number which will let you compete with him in any AKC event except conformation. You'd need to send in proof that he is neutered, a photo of him, and some paperwork.

[MaggieRoseLee]

Emoore is correct. You can't register your dog for breeding with the AKC (but you've probably spayed/neutered already) ..

BUT if you want to get the PAL number thru the AKC (do they still ILP??) you absolutely can. That way you can enter pretty much any and all of their competitions except for conformation events. http://www.akc.org/reg/ilpex.cfm <-- click that for info

[msvette2u]

Many puppy mills use those faux registries, so people actually purchase the dogs from the petstore thinking they've got a gold mine because they are "registered dogs"! You'd be amazed at how many people (even with AKC papers) will think they can't, or shouldn't, alter their pet because, after all, "he/she has PAPERS!"

You can register your dog with AKC but you'll need a vet certificate stating the animal is spayed/neutered.
You can then compete in anything AKC offers, except conformation, because it doesn't matter how "pretty" (to the standard, anyway) he or she is, they cannot pass along their genetic information to another generation.

[Liesje]

Just to clarify the ILP/PAL is not an AKC "registration" it's a "listing". It's an alternative for purebred dogs who aren't and cannot be AKC registered.

[mrsartz]

Thank you everyone for the replies. I wasn't so sure that it meant anything either but thought that I would ask.

We don't plan on breeding him as we took him in as a pet and not a money maker but we do not plan on having him neutered. Not anytime soon anyway. We're not totally against it but if we do it won't be until he's about a year a year and a half. We would like him to have natural aggression and not quite sure if he will lose that once fixed.

When I think of BYBs I think of those people who literally raise their dogs in the backyard or a garage or a barn...whatever the case may be. They don't treat their dogs and puppies as if they're part of a loving family they treat them STRICTLY as their meal ticket and they don't show them any love and affection hardly at all. None of the dogs are properly socialized which can lead to problems.

We got Luke from a very loving family with other pets and children. They treated the dogs and pups as members of their own family. All of the dogs had great dispositions and were very happy to be there. They had them pretty much house trained (we skipped the newspaper and or puppy pads) and knowing a few basic commands. This was their second litter.

I admit that I did make a spur of the moment decision when I looked in a local paper and called a number in an ad. We paid $500 for him but like I said we didn't care if he came with papers or not so we didn't even ask.

Usually quick decisions like that can go awry at times but I truly think we made a good choice. He's a great dog. He learns so quickly and he's so eager to please. Of course since he's only 14 weeks old he's still acting like a puppy chewing and biting. We always redirect him and he is getting much better.

[Freestep]

When I think of BYB's I think of people who breed dogs and do not know or care about bloodlines, OFA or other health certifications, etc. A classic sign of a BYB is ACA or CKC "papers". Why do you want papers, anyway? If it's to compete in AKC events like obedience, you can do that with an ILP number... but the dog must be neutered.

I won't get into the "natural aggression" point, but someone else probably will. Suffice to say I don't think the kind of aggression he may have from greater amounts of testosterone will be of any benefit to you.

[selzer]

Why do you want for him to be registered AKC?

Sometimes people get a dog sold as a pet with limited AKC registration. They realize that they cannot produce registered puppies, but they breed the dog anyway, usually pretending it was an accident. Then they prove the dog is indeed purebred when they sell the puppies. People give them 1 - 500 thinking that they are really not supporting back yard breeders.

If you sell puppies from available dogs, without any significant background, purchased cheaper or without papers, do no health screenings on them, do not bother to work with them to the point where they can earn titles, and do earn titles and sell the for $500 a pup, you will make money. In fact, you will probably make more money in all than the breeder who pays for their bitch, pays a decent stud fee, pays for training, pays for shows to title, pays for health screening, and charges three times what you spent on your dog.

Furthermore, those people will generally wait until their bitch is old enough to to health screen and thus mature enough to whelp and raise puppies properly without damage to herself, and do not breed the girl ever single time she comes into heat, and only breeds the dogs that have reached their personal goals for temperament and conformation.

I would expect that 9 out of 10 people who sell dogs with no papers are actually doing it for the meal ticket moreso than those people who are selling them for more money and doing it right. Profit margin is probably better too.

But whatever. If you do not intend to breed your dog, papers mean absolutely nothing. If you want to compete in AKC events other than conformation showing, you can get a PAL number, but the dog must be spayed or neutered, which makes sense. If you want the dog to be fifteen to eighteen months old before spaying or neutering, train the dog for such events and just hold off titling until you have him neutered and the paperwork submitted.