is there a separate retreive drive??

[x11]

most people will do it as a basic pup test and will in fact select (or not) a baby puppy that will fetch an object and run it back to the person that throws it. dogs that lack this i think will not be favoured by selecters - allowing for the many other tests people do - a baby puppy fetching stuff back to person i KNOW is highly prized by many puppy buyers. these dogs becuse they are selected may be more likely to be worked and returned to the gene pool for breeding (this is theorising) so are we unkowingly adding in a actuall "retrieve drive" of sorts.

can there be such a thing on a biological level like prey drive, what survival mechanism would it serve.

all just theorteical musings...thoughts

[Liesje]

I've joked about this. One of my dogs LOVED retrieving so much (and I'm not just talking fetch, but formal SchH retrieves, flyball, etc) he didn't need any rewards. Often I use formal retrieves as his "jackpot" reward after a long obedience session. He just loves to retrieve. The only problem with this is that if he makes a mistake it can be hard to fix because the retrieving itself is self-rewarding. He doesn't need to come back for a ball or other toy and if I withhold the toy because he did something "wrong" he doesn't really know or care.

[x11]

can you believe that competition retreivers (gun dogs) as i understand are all force retreived??

not sure if true or not.

[Liesje]

Maybe competition ones are. My uncle's is not a "competition" retriever but she actually hunts with him (not field tests but just going hunting) and she was not forced, my uncle is a terrible dog trainer and wouldn't know how to do that. She's wild and crazy and as my uncle says, who cares all she has to do is retrieve birds which she does.

[x11]

my dogs would only get 50% of the points, go out with great gusto......keep going with duck in mouth in same direction and eat it far from handler....gotta be sumthin in a comp right?

[robk]

I do believe there is some sort of retrieve drive. My inlaws lab will retrieve until he drops dead for the sheer joy of it. Ruger on the other hand will retrieve because I ask him too. The joy for him is in pleasing me. The lab doesn't really care to please me. He won't even sit on command but will retrieve all day.

[onyx'girl]

That is why part of their name has retriever in it!
Bird dogs are forced trained to do this exercise so that they understand that retrieving is the *only* option.
I don't see a reason for it(forced) in real life hunting, as it is instinctual. For trials/tests it is about the points.

[huntergreen]

my kyra loved to retrieve her yellow tennis ball. she would always bring it back so it would thrown for her again. i was told this was ball drive. very useful when training.

[jocoyn]

Engagement and ball drive were two of the parameters we were told to use for selection as well as hunt drive.

We put names on what dogs do but we wanted to see for SAR/Detection a dog willing to use its nose to locate an unseen object, persistence, and a desire to work with the handler.

Cyra had to be taught the retrieve part. She was "chase and kill" girl and I had to convince her it was more fun to bring it back by two ball - I got Grim as an adult so I don't know if it was natural or trained and Beau is a natural retriever. He was retrieving things grown into brush and out of sight and returning them by 11 weeks old. Very engaged but he still does seem to have a tendency to test the limits.

It does help a lot with training. Even when he gets a tug toy for reward for making a find, he comes back to me and pushes it at me to engage me in a game of tug.

[doggiedad]

lets say the pup doesn't retreive the object. when the pup
is older it's taught to retreive. what does that say about
the puppy test?

Originally Posted by x11

most people will do it as a basic pup test and will in fact select (or not) a baby puppy that will fetch an object and run it back to the person that throws it. dogs that lack this i think will not be favoured by selecters - allowing for the many other tests people do - a baby puppy fetching stuff back to person i KNOW is highly prized by many puppy buyers. these dogs becuse they are selected may be more likely to be worked and returned to the gene pool for breeding (this is theorising) so are we unkowingly adding in a actuall "retrieve drive" of sorts.

can there be such a thing on a biological level like prey drive, what survival mechanism would it serve.

all just theorteical musings...thoughts