With A Flick of The Wrist, By Chris Zink, DVM, PhD - German Shepherd Dog Forums

Increase font size: 0, 10, 25, 50%

GermanShepherds.com is the premier German Shepherd Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 11-04-2009, 01:12 PM   #1 (permalink)
Crowned Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 5,162
Default With A Flick of The Wrist, By Chris Zink, DVM, PhD


I had not heard of this before, but found it interesting.
http://www.angelfire.com/nc2/Mestena/dewclawsInjury.pdf

Does anyone know if there have been any other studies documented about dewclaw removal causing carpal arthritis in performance dogs?

Mostly I am interested in the Border Collie breed. All my past Border Collies had their dewclaws removed, but am aware of a few breeders that do NOT remove them, and voice the reason why is because of the carpal arthritis concern.
TMarie is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 11-04-2009, 01:29 PM   #2 (permalink)
Crowned Member
 
Chicagocanine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 6,400
Default Re: With A Flick of The Wrist, By Chris Zink, DVM, PhD

That's new to me. I've heard of the reason for not removing them being because dogs use them in agility, running, etc but this is the first I've heard about arthritis. Interesting.
My agility dog (Golden Retriever) had carpal arthritis but she had her dewclaws intact.
__________________
Chicago Canine
Bianca HIC CGC TT (GSD) 4/24/04-10/23/12
Chicagocanine is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-04-2009, 01:40 PM   #3 (permalink)
Crowned Member
 
3K9Mom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 7,575
Default Re: With A Flick of The Wrist, By Chris Zink, DVM, PhD

Tammy,

Thanks for sharing. Meri has her dewclaws removed. I asked the breeder to leave them on (since I really didn't plan to do much fox hunting with my beagle ) , but she removes them at birth, and we didn't know which puppy I would get, so there's no way that she could really comply with my request unless she left them on for the whole litter...


I have a friend that trains herding BCs. I'm sure that most of the ones she sees are working BCs and have theirs. But I'm going to run this by her and see if she knows more. I'lll let you know if she does.
3K9Mom is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-04-2009, 06:54 PM   #4 (permalink)
Knighted Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 2,176
Default Re: With A Flick of The Wrist, By Chris Zink, DVM, PhD

Interesting...I always thought the dewclaws were there so the dog could scratch his snout with a front paw.
__________________
Silence is Golden ~ Duct tape is Silver.

FO UCD ARCHX RLVX3 RL1X RL2X Joobie Toozday VCD1 HT RA OA OAJ NF CD-H JJ-N CTL1 TT CGC
sleachy is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-04-2009, 06:57 PM   #5 (permalink)
The Agility Rocks! Moderator
 
MaggieRoseLee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Bushkill, PA (The Poconos!)
Posts: 26,280
Default A Flick of The Wrist, By Chris Zink (dewclaws?)

__________________
*****
MACH3 Bretta Lee Wildhaus MXG MJG MXF MFB TQX HIT CGC TC
Glory B Wildhaus AX, AXJ, XF
plus Miss Osin Blue Wildhaus

"How is it one careless match can start a forest fire, but it takes a whole box to start a campfire?." ANONYMOUS
MaggieRoseLee is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-04-2009, 08:08 PM   #6 (permalink)
Crowned Member
 
3K9Mom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 7,575
Default Re: A Flick of The Wrist, By Chris Zink (dewclaws?)

Tammy, I saw Mer's holistic vet/chiropractor today and asked her.

She said that she's seen the article and has talked to Chris Zink herself about this. She agrees with me that some of the stuff that Dr. Zink writes up is a little odd, but says that she believes Dr. Zink is right on the mark with this. My vet has a dog that doesn't have dew claws that's her agility dog and she has seen that her wrists have been weakening over the years. She does a lot of motion/flexing/rotation work on her dog's wrists to keep them as healthy as possible.

(She showed me how... basically, it's just working on range of motion to keep the wrist nice and loose. She had showed me for Zamboni, who had osteoarthris from her advanced age... simply little flexing and bending at the wrist that we did every day or so)

She said that the reason for the breakdown is that on really sharp turns (like agility dogs do), the wrist flexes sideways so much that the dogs are actually using the dew claw to brace the wrist. She suggested that I watch my GSD -- who has his dew claw -- when he's tearing around the yard and watch his front paws -- I should be able to see it.

Without the dew claw for support, the internal wrist structure has to bear all of the force itself. There is no external brace. So the wrist breaks down more quickly.

Finally, she said that she has discussed this with orthopedic surgeons who poo-poo the whole theory...

Whew! I think that's everything we talked about. I tried to rush home and type it all before I forgot!

I'm meeting with our surgeon tomorrow about Mer's knee. I'll try to remember to ask him what he thinks about this too. (My vet said she hasn't discussed this with my surgeon, so we're curious what he has to say.)

3K9Mom is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-04-2009, 08:23 PM   #7 (permalink)
Crowned Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 5,162
Default Re: A Flick of The Wrist, By Chris Zink (dewclaws?)

Wow Lori, Thanks so much for that info. I will have to watch Jarie while she is running and turning, and see if I notice.

I read there is a lot of debate on the subject among many breeds, but I never heard this until I was speaking to one of my Border Collie friends, and I had noticed all her dogs had their dewclaws.

I am not really sure how I feel about the subject, I guess because I am use to Borders and Aussies without the dewclaws, it is difficult for me to picture my puppy with them.

Please post what your surgeon says, I am very interested on all takes on the subject.

Thank you, Thank you.
TMarie is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-04-2009, 09:33 PM   #8 (permalink)
Crowned Member
 
Chicagocanine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 6,400
Default Re: With A Flick of The Wrist, By Chris Zink, DVM, PhD

When my Golden was a senior, she could not fully straighten her wrists due to her arthritis.
I did notice she used her dewclaws in agility and she also used them a lot to hold and grasps bones and things when chewing on them.
__________________
Chicago Canine
Bianca HIC CGC TT (GSD) 4/24/04-10/23/12
Chicagocanine is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the German Shepherd Dog Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:39 PM.



Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SEO by vBSEO 3.3.2
PetGuide.com
Basset.net DobermanTalk.com GoldenRetrieverForum.com OurBeagleWorld.com
BoxerForums.com DogForums.com GoPitbull.com PoodleForum.com
BulldogBreeds.com FishForums.com HavaneseForum.com SpoiledMaltese.com
CatForum.com GermanShepherds.com Labradoodle-dogs.net YorkieForum.com
Chihuahua-People.com RetrieverBreeds.com