Female with domanance issues.(Long post)

[ed1911]

I used an e collar and was able to stop it before it started. After two days we have peace in our home again. Thanks to all who took the time to answer.

[codmaster]

Wonder why so many folks seem to think that female to female dog aggression is so much worse than male - male or uncommonly male - female agrgession?

I am not talking about the frequency of the type of fight - just when it happens.

I wouldn't enjoy breaking any of them up, but I would rather have to break up a fight between smaller dogs than bigger dogs generally (amd male dogs usually are significantly bigger than females).

I also have never seen any evidence other than people giving anecdotal stuff to back up any claims of sex and dog fighting. How about any reasons anyone has ever heard of this supposedly different in the fighting instincts of males and females? And does it hold true also for spayed females?

Any behavioral studies of sex/aggression?

BTW, I have seen my male GSD in some serious aggression toward another male GSD - and NEVER want to see that again! Didn't recognize my fun loving good natured dufus!

OTOH, have seen my then female also in a serious fight and wouldn't want to get in the middle of that either!

ALL GSD's can be very serious fighters.

[wolfstraum]

Males fight for dominance - not to kill....they will often co-exist afterwards

Females will kill other, I remember a thread on another forum where 2 who were raised together from pups started to fight....the dominant one almost killed the submissive one, then owner separated them. S one in a bedroom still with stitches and drains in, D in a crate in living room - D broke the crate, broke the door and went after the S one again, almost killing her...they ended up euthanizing one or both - can't quite remember..

A breeder in either NZ or Aus also posted about a female who tore up her kennel run, and got into another female's run and killed her. A breeder I know here in the states had a female who would climb over or rip holes in chain link to get to another female and targeted a particular one to kill....I believe that was the female sold to another breeder.

Females go on a mission to kill another one. Males to establish pack order.

Lee

[codmaster]

Originally Posted by wolfstraum

Males fight for dominance - not to kill....they will often co-exist afterwards

Females will kill other, I remember a thread on another forum where 2 who were raised together from pups started to fight....the dominant one almost killed the submissive one, then owner separated them. S one in a bedroom still with stitches and drains in, D in a crate in living room - D broke the crate, broke the door and went after the S one again, almost killing her...they ended up euthanizing one or both - can't quite remember..

A breeder in either NZ or Aus also posted about a female who tore up her kennel run, and got into another female's run and killed her. A breeder I know here in the states had a female who would climb over or rip holes in chain link to get to another female and targeted a particular one to kill....I believe that was the female sold to another breeder.

Females go on a mission to kill another one. Males to establish pack order.Lee

Lee, what you are saying is exactly my point.

What real objective evidence do we have about your first statment about males and females fighting? Are you saying that females will always try to kill each other when they actually fight? That certainly can't be good for a species.

And males never fight to kill each other? (not true just from what I see in my guy and not seemingly true from when a male pit bull jumped on my friends male GSD in a parking lot - sure seemed to be to the death till they were sparated)

Would female dogs never fight just to establish pack order? That would seem kind of odd to me.

And once males fight, then they live peacably afterward? Doesn't seem like that to me - what if neither dog is the kind to submit (for pack order if you will)?

Too much opinion about this and little or no objective evidence.

[msvette2u]

cod, google has amazing powers.
If you're truly curious about this and not just being obtuse, then look it up.
It IS well documented.

BTW, I do believe people who haven't experienced true inter-bitch aggression find it hard to believe, but that doesn't mean it isn't true, it simply means you haven't lived though it yet, in your own home.
I have, and I do not want to own another female again.
Not all females are that way (out for blood - of other females!) but when you have one, you will know it.

[codmaster]

I will look again. But the "references" in the past were purely anectodal (just like the personal stories of dog fights here - true no doubt but just a limited personal history) and not real objective. I guess that you didn't know of any true objective studies either?

For example I have had has many as three adult female GSD's living together - and peacably for the most part with a few fgights over toys, food once in a while and probably a couple over rank as 2 of them were very dominant personalities and one was about 5 years older. No "to the death" battles (all females) and they played again after the fights.

Does my experience disprove the theory about female GSD's "fight to kill" and never can be trusted?

[msvette2u]

Girls hold grudges. To the grave.
If you have ever lived in a multi female (human) household you already know this.
Dogs are no different.

[codmaster]

Originally Posted by msvette2u

cod, google has amazing powers.
If you're truly curious about this and not just being obtuse, then look it up.
It IS well documented.

BTW, I do believe people who haven't experienced true inter-bitch aggression find it hard to believe, but that doesn't mean it isn't true, it simply means you haven't lived though it yet, in your own home.
I have, and I do not want to own another female again.
Not all females are that way (out for blood - of other females!) but when you have one, you will know it.

Thanks - I looked on the Internet and I found the reference that you may have been telling me about that proves your theory about female fighting.

Here is a quote from it -
"Female dogs are more likely to fight to the death than males because females have a harder time working out a stable pack order. Spaying the females can help, and neutering the males can help, but plenty of dog fights in the home involve spayed or neutered dogs."

So that article gives a reason for why females fight to the death - they simply have a harder time to agree on the pack order! And all we have to do to ease the problem with the females is to spay all of them.

And i did actually find a number of articles that explained it in a similar manner (of course the ones I saw were like this one - no objective proof but a lot of good explanation).

[msvette2u]

your theory

So pleased you believe it was me who came up with it, but sadly, I can't take the credit.

I really don't care if you believe female-female aggression exists, it's your house and home, but again, when you have one such bitch that can't tolerate other girls, you will know it. You won't be sitting around here running people down, people with much much more experience with multiple females than I have, and more experience than you, apparently, will ever have.

Yours is an extreme case of "yet", and more power to ya on that

[shepherdmom]

Originally Posted by codmaster

And i did actually find a number of articles that explained it in a similar manner (of course the ones I saw were like this one - no objective proof but a lot of good explanation).

I don't know that there is any objective proof, it is one of those things that females know and males should figure out quickly. Males may be more aggressive initially but we will fight to the death to protect what is ours, we never forget and we will always hold grudges. Males don't seem to have that hold grudges part. Once you have decided the winner your done.