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OB progress

3K views 34 replies 9 participants last post by  huntergreen 
#1 ·
I enjoyed my prong thread so much I think I am going to start documenting our OB training as well. I am starting off simply with Zeeva doing pushups (we are learning sit, stay and down all over again and trying to perfect it).



Yesterday I took Zeeva quickly through a busy Target parking lot. I felt unsafe with the cars driving around so we might not be ready for this. We only spent about 5-7 minutes there. She stayed in a good 'with me' position even when people walked by (no growling). But she is easily startled (she ducks and looks behind her; I think this is the body language of a dog that is startled?)--by cars, ruffling bags, people, honking horns. She is very alert and maybe unfocused. Am I overwhelming her? She needs to be focused on me, right?

I do not want drive by strokers. We will get a vest that says 'in training' (posted recently on here :))

I will take Smokey trough the same parking lot today (after it cools down a bit) and observe his demeanor.

This thread is also to push myself to do what I promise and not slack off...
 
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#2 ·
Don't repeat exercises that much. It's not necessary to do up down up down up down. I've noticed my dog gets extremely bored when we practice those things. He even looks at me like, "what the **** am I doing?" I don't think you need to practice in parking lots or around stores, that is way too much distraction if you're just starting to really get into hardcore obedience. Find a forest preserve or park where you can have your dog safely on/off leash, trust me no one in the Chicago area will care unless your dog does something stupid.

My dog is 2, hopefully I'll get his CD this weekend, and a RA as well, and I try not to heel or do repetitive simple obedience exercises for more than 5 minutes at a time. I'm starting to work on hand signals so once in a while we'll sit there and do sits and downs, but usually I do, sit, down, front and then we do something else. At most I repeat it twice. They're smart dogs, they aren't going to keep repeating exercises just to get a treat or a ball.
 
#4 ·
I do OB when we're playing or on a walk so it's not too boring for them. For example, on the walk, we start with sit, wait, then heel, then sit (while I keep walking) then down, sit, come, heel, walk walk walk, down (while I keep walking), then sit, front (she comes to my front), heel, walk walk walk, etc. It's faster paced and she responds quickly and engaged and seems to enjoy it (or maybe it's the treats that she enjoys). If there's a dog coming, I ask her to do OB. If there's a biker, she downs and stays and ignore. If there's a squirrel.... "leave it" with leash popped... haha. I only use inside to teach a command. After that, we do it outside or during play.
 
#6 ·
I really liked this idea of practicing OB while walking so I totally tried it! We simply practiced, sit, stay (till end of leash), and come when called. Here is our short spin on it:



We also practiced stay with her back to me and then I walk past her and in front of her till the end of the leash; then call her to me. We failed the first time in this video but I think the second time she did fine...



I think we will increase duration of her time for stay soon.

She is good with bikers, skateboarders, people walking by etc (not so much dogs though). But I will check her focus for sit, stay and heel with these distractions on our walks.
 
#5 ·
Something to remember when you go on "field trips" as my boss calls them; Shopping centers, etc.
Standing out front of a place like Target/Safeway or whatever your big grocery stores are called are great exposure to weird things.

Five to seven minutes is not too long to start. You want to work up to a calm acceptance. You don't want a panicky dog, and they are good places to work up your confidence as a handler. Don't go places where you are out of your comfort zone as the dog will pick up on it.
`
We are pretty lucky because we live really close to our big county hospital. Alice got to see ambulances, firetrucks (on full siren mode) people in walkers, wheelchairs, sheriff's car and because of where we live people from other cultures that to a dog dress REALLY scary. Turbans, saris and sarongs.
Alice actually got to sit in the back of a retired K-9s car and now she thinks ALL the sheriffs will let her do it...:rolleyes:

My rambling point is: What are your goals for you and your dog's relationship?
Personally, I like to have a confident, happy, mentally balanced dog.
It's ok to get startled, but how fast she recovers is what I'm looking for.
 
#7 ·
Something to remember when you go on "field trips" as my boss calls them; Shopping centers, etc.
Standing out front of a place like Target/Safeway or whatever your big grocery stores are called are great exposure to weird things.

Five to seven minutes is not too long to start. You want to work up to a calm acceptance. You don't want a panicky dog, and they are good places to work up your confidence as a handler. Don't go places where you are out of your comfort zone as the dog will pick up on it.
`
We are pretty lucky because we live really close to our big county hospital. Alice got to see ambulances, firetrucks (on full siren mode) people in walkers, wheelchairs, sheriff's car and because of where we live people from other cultures that to a dog dress REALLY scary. Turbans, saris and sarongs.
Alice actually got to sit in the back of a retired K-9s car and now she thinks ALL the sheriffs will let her do it...:rolleyes:

My rambling point is: What are your goals for you and your dog's relationship?
Personally, I like to have a confident, happy, mentally balanced dog.
It's ok to get startled, but how fast she recovers is what I'm looking for.
My goal is to train her to listen to me. I want her recall, stay, loose leash walking and heel rock solid. I want her socialized both with people and dogs. I want her to be able to ignore the things I ask her to. This especially means ignoring our neighbors. Is that too much to ask for for now...?
 
#8 ·
Here is our sit, stay/recall work for today. These were taken after Smokey had about a 3 mile walky dog session and Zeeva about a 2 mile walky dog session (that's why I think they are panting so much; they are tired). Several failed attempts, especially with Smokey (I think it's the breed in him; he just doesn't have the focus or the understanding...). Do you think he'll learn? Or am I right to say his breed won't learn this type of work? None the less I will keep trying with him. But based on these videos, maybe you can make some suggestions to us?


(Zeeva does well. I don't think I have any videos of her failing, but she did a few times.)


(Smokey fails)


(We got distracted by another beautiful GS in this one. Am sorry if this is any of you out there but holler at me if you see us working!)


(He really doesn't get it. Even with a treat)

P.S. I'm sort of glad I didn't completely throw away that retractable leash. Is this a bad way to work? I fished it out of the trash can last minute...

P.P.S. I'm kind of a doh doh for taping some of these sideways. Sorry :(
 
#9 ·
With Smokey maybe try doing it at home first with shorter distance, no distraction and his favorite treat or toy, if he has one.

I can't hear any sound for some reason. The first Smokey video made me laugh when he just kind of started going to his rest/sleep mode.

Are your dogs always this calm and chill? Just thinking about what would excite them so they are more motivated to work. My dog can get a bit edgy or overly excited when we do OB. Yours just seem very opposite! The treats doesn't get them going either?
 
#10 ·
Are your dogs always this calm and chill? Just thinking about what would excite them so they are more motivated to work. My dog can get a bit edgy or overly excited when we do OB. Yours just seem very opposite! The treats doesn't get them going either?
Yes, they are always this calm about training. Nothing really excites them unless it's our poor sweet neighbor or other dogs (especially small ones :()

Zeeva does not work for treats at all. I think I've trained her that way. She doesn't expect a treat every time she does something right. In fact sometimes I think she get startled if I give her a treat (doesn't associate the OB with the treat).

Smokey loves these new treats I bought. But he will not work for them...

I wonder why the sound isn't working. I know listening to it would make a big difference...My verbal diarrhea of commands is probably going to get some bashing :) I am working on that part...
 
#12 ·
Lol...I wish 3 miles of walking tired my dog out. Where in Chicago are you (PM me if you'd like) I grew up in the Northwest Suburbs and go home quite often.

You need to find something your dogs react to, tug toy? ball on string? To get them a little more excited. They just don't have the drive to obey lol. I'm not sure what kind of obedience you want but I noticed you didn't do "fronts" you just did come and your dog came to your general area. What you should do is have an exact place where your dog has to come to, not just stand around you somewhere. So a front is where they come and sit right in front of you or you can get them to come right into a heel position. If you plan on trialing...you need to teach a front.

Its going to be tough training them if they really aren't in it for a reward of some sort. Maybe train before you walk so they think that the walk is the reward?
 
#13 ·
We actually did a walky dog session each before the training (biking = more intense so IMO they were pretty tired :))

I'm curious about drive. I don't want my dogs to become excited every time I reach for a treat or a toy etc. Is that ok while training? Or will this deter them from our simple goals? I want solid recall, loose leash walking and dogs that listen to me in distracted situations (so if our neighbor goes into her backyard, the dogs listen when I call them and allow me to redirect their barking). No plans on trailing.

Anyway, I really like this concept of fronts. I will have to research it a little more to train it. Thank you for introducing me to it.

You laugh?!? :) Do we really look that strange/silly/novice practicing? I'm not looking for titles. Just manageable and obedient dogs and IMO we can get there with simple training...

I PM'd you!
 
#15 ·
We had a social regression today as I'd think it should be called.

I took Zeeva to the pet store with me this morning. I went in confident, happy and strong. But as the customers poo pooed around her and the pet store rep asked me if she bites, my entire facade withered :( I asked him why and he said she might be a fear biter because her tail was in between her legs. I took one look at her and although I couldn't see what he was talking about (she walks with her tail in that position. In fact don't most/all GSDs have low sitting tails?) I knew we weren't ready for this type of place. I quickly collected my belongings and left.

We are not to go to the pet store for a while. I know Smokey does well at the pet store as he is a person loving doggie and I don't have to worry about him being a 'fear biter'...

Two things I must keep in mind: 1) I'm very sensitive 2) so is Zeeva. With these things in mind I must learn to use my own judgement to control my sensitivity so Zeeva doesn't pick up my negativity.

I must stop overanalyzing things. It's driving me nuts. I need to learn to relax. This constant anxiety is no good for any of us...

I'm so sorry I failed you today Zeeva :'o( I know you've forgotten already but it's going to bother me for the rest of the day...
 
#16 ·
Sent this to Zeeva as a PM earlier today, Zeeva wanted it on the thread, here it goes :)

"Hey

Saw the videos in your thread, really enjoyed them, if you are up for a few suggestions...

1) find something your dog enjoys as a reward so OB is fun for the dog, reward, reward, reward, so the dog thinks OB is a game, not a chore. A trainer told me in the past that he wanted to see wagging tails and ears up during OB

2) do OB training when the dog is energetic (before physical exercises, not when the dog is sleepy/tired/full), energy during OB work is good. The drive/energy/desire to work for you will eventually help the dog to overcome bigger distractions in the future

3) Consider marker/clicker training, an easy way to communicate/teach dog new exercises

Just want to share a marker training video I did with my foster dog last week,



I am a newbie as well, and I made a few mistakes :blush: during the video but just wanted to share with you that energy during OB work is good, regardless if the dog is a working dog/pet, shows the dog is having fun :)

Keep up your good work!"
 
#18 ·
Zeeva did well today when I took her out to meet the neighbor lady :) Zeeva was on her prong and a leash. Not once did she bark so she got a bunch of treats :)

Smokey on the other hand, got riled up. He lounged at the fence and wanted more treats. I told neighbor to tell him to sit but he wasn't having any of it. He wanted treats :( He got some in the beginning. Then got riled up...

This inconsistant behavior with my neighbor is what scares me. The inconsistency that one day Zeeva can be good and another day bad; same with Smokey. My neighbor's old mom is coming to live with her and uses our fence to walk up to her door. She also likes to sit on the porch outside. I'm concerned because I don't know how to deal with the proximity here. Everything is so condensed and close where as where I used to live everything was so spaced--no one was all up in our grill. I don't want to use my neighbor or her mom as guinea pigs for my dogs...

It is suggested to take neighbor out with dogs on neutral ground and ask the dogs to conform...But again I'm concerned about them jumping on my neighbor etc. I'm concerned all around as I don't want to use my neighbor as a guinea pig for my dogs.
 
#19 ·
Good job Zeeva!!!
Try having the neigbor completely ignore whichever dog (in one case Smokey) even turning their back on him if he's lunging around and being a fruitbat. When he calms down, then greet and treat. This kind of lets the dog know that uber excitement and bossy demanding of attention gets him avoidance and no attention.
Then do that EVERY TIME. Huskies aren't dumb by anymeans but they are pretty stubborn/willfull even.
That little trick took us four years to teach our human friends...the dogs got it in two visits.....;)
In fact, we still have one idiot that gets mauled by Alice (not in an aggressive way)...

We actually had to fix our gate with our last dog as he figured it out waaaaay before our human visitors.
*sigh, yep....I know some dumb humans*
 
#20 ·
Huskies aren't dumb by anymeans but they are pretty stubborn/willfull even.
That little trick took us four years to teach our human friends...the dogs got it in two visits.....;)
Yes, I agree with everything you said but this stuck out the most :) Everything I've read (after I got Smokey) discussed how stubborn they're and how they're genetically programed to be that way.

I'm planning on writing my neighbor a new letter discussing the suggestion you gave me about turning around and ignoring Smokey. I realized after you'd told me about that little trick that I'd learned it in our OB class. Hopefully he'll get it as quickly as he learned some lame tricks that I taught him (he learned maybe 10 tricks in 3 weeks no exaggeration!). I'm also going to brainstorm and see if I need my neighbor to do anything else so maybe the letter will be put out a couple days from now.

Anyway, I've another topic to brainstorm on this thread. LOL. Thanks for tuning in to us! I really do appreciate it :)
 
#21 ·
I put Zeeva on a tie out in front of the house in stay while I did some sit, stays with Smokey. I think that was asking Zeeva for too much. She can stay for a solid minute now! I even got her to stay while I went around a bush (inspired by San and her video--she does a stay with Eli where she goes to look out the door while Eli is in her corner in a stay :)) and out of site for 10 seconds (maybe 30 total). I thought she might be ready for a tie out stay while Smokey and I practiced, but not yet.
 
#23 ·
Simpler toy...that then you exchange for something better. You said she's not very treat oriented so it will be very hard to trade the toy for food. You have to have something else she really really wants and then you trade. If you can, start playing with just one toy (yourself) throwing it to yourself and just holding it when you're not doing anything around the house and just watching TV. She might pick up on the fact that its a great toy and she really wants that one since you really want that one.
 
#24 ·
Bark stopper question. When Zeeva barks and I don't want her to, I basically tell her sit, down and wait for her to be quiet for about 30 seconds then treat. If she starts to bark again, I redirect by putting a treat in front of her nose and telling her 'hush'. Will she get this redirection and reward?
 
#26 ·
I apologize, I had a response to this a few days ago but I have been having computer issues.

Is Zeeva barking at you? Or, is it just reactivity to outside stimulus....mailman, kids skate boarding, etc?

If she's looking right at you and demanding your attention, I'd put my iPod in and pick up a book and block your face from her view. If I'm standing up, I'd just turn around and ignore her until she's quiet. If she circles around (GSDs figure that out pretty quick), put the book in front of your face so you don't have to spin around like a ballerina on a jewelry box.
Personally, I'm more of the line of thinking that the dog figures whether it's good attention or bad attention...."heck! I'm still getting attention"
Fortunately, I have pretty understanding neighbors.
Once when Alice was in her "poo-face" period I timed her while sitting on the sofa ignoring her. Eight minutes!! Almost ten minutes of standing in front of me barking. (I LOVE my iPod)
My ABC student co-worker at the time was floored I let it go for so long, but I needed a threshold in which to start with.
I was going to outlast my dog.
When she finally gave it up and layed down, I got up and gave her some petting and attention.
 
#27 ·
That box thing... I tried it. Thought it'd be fun. Dog figured it out under 5 seconds. After that she started to use the system to her benefits for more treats so I had to abandon the game. Maybe I didn't do it right... I assumed the goal is that the dog gets into the box on their own? After she got in on her own (and even sat and looked at me like she's trained to do), I linked it to a word "in" so that she only goes in when I say so. That was another 2 seconds.

For barking - I don't use treats. She started to bark (not at me, she knows better!) and when I say "quiet", she eagerly comes.... for treats as I originally used that for redirection. I felt uncomfortable with her being rewarded for a bad behavior and her liking that too much so I stopped treating. Instead I used an aversive - her disgust with the spray bottle. I don't spray and can't spray anyways since the bottle is broken. I just hold it in my hands when she won't quiet after I say "quiet." She got it, pretty quick. Now the word "quiet" can actually stop her most of the time. All along, she knew what "quiet" meant, just weren't "motivated" to do it.
 
#28 ·
Dropped a singles cheese slice. Told Zeeva and Smokey to 'leave it!' and they did :) So proud of them.

Progress with neighbor is slow but going well. She tells them to 'sit' then treats if they aren't barking. She is still scared of my doggies but she is brave and hard working :). A few days ago she did some gardening while my two were outside. My two didn't bark at her at all and in fact pretty much ignored her. She said they're like children; they have their good days and their bad days and she's right...

Zeeva is working on 'look' at that. I don't think she gets it yet. I use a treat which she follows then tell her to 'look' at me, say 'yes' once me make eye contact and treat. I will have to video tape us practicing this soon.

Smokey is regressing in terms of loose leash walking. I figure I'll have to keep him on a prong whenever we go for a walk. It may be my mistake that he doesn't understand or it may be in his genes that he is simply meant to pull...
 
#30 ·
Today we taught neighbor lady to tell Zeeva to 'sit' before giving her a treat. Worked splendidly. Not only did Zeeva not bark but she listened! She was praised and treated :)

I have a feeling Zeeva doesn't enjoy walky dogging while Smokey could run FOREVER. In any case is there a way to train dogs on a walky dog? For example, not to chase squirrels? I've been using 'left' and 'right' and other such commands and they've learned those splendidly. But squirrel butts continue to be a problem while walky dogging :c

It's weird (to me at least) how some dogs like my husky are built to run and GSDs? At least in Zeeva's case, not so much. I never thought that breed could make such a big difference with this kind of stuff *so naive*. I've been wanting to build Zeeva's stamina up but I really do agree with Woolfy Dog in that Zeeva most likely gets bored whereas since Smokey is built and meant to run, he simply enjoys it more. Must find another way to exercise and wear out my Zeeva bear...

I bought Zeeva a new harness! She looks absolutely stunning in it. Her previous one she chewed on and was worn down. I was afraid that it would snap while walky dogging her so we needed a new one. I absolutely have to take a picture of her modeling it :) It's pink and I love it! Fits much better too...
 
#31 · (Edited)
I had a trainer over today.

He told me that instead of sit stay I should do down stay, because sitting is not so easy for a dog-- it is the equivalent of standing on one leg to a person.

As for the running, I always thought GSDs were more trotting than running dogs. When they herd, they trot, change direction, stop, trot. Not full out run for long periods of time. Isn't a Husky a sled dog, bred to pull a sled at full speed for miles?
 
#33 · (Edited)
Pictures!!!

I didn't want to make a new thread. I've a video of Zeeva walking on a flat collar. We're weening off of the prong. Smokey isn't there yet. I think I'll keep him on a prong for walks forever. Is that ok?

Sweet neighbor lady is doing well with the pups. Zeeva still barks at her but when sweet neighbor lady asks her to sit, Zeeva obliges and quiets down. She gets a treat c:

Anyway, the weather was beautiful today so I sat out in the sun and did a short photo session with both of them. I know I'm not the best photographer and they're celly pictures but I hope you all enjoy them.







I for some reason have always adored Smokey's paws. They're petite and cute. Zeeva's are big and her nails grow so quickly. I've NEVER had to cut Smokey's nails which is pleasant for the both of us.








My comical attempt at stacking Zeeva...LOL. Wish I had 2 other people to help me so I could have her critiqued (not that the critiques we got were bad c:)
 
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