Herding Children

anjum · 01-03-2012, 06:38 PM

GSD Friends, I need some help sorting this one out.

So it seems that Jinny might have some pretty good herding instinct. My bf's niece & her two children (ages 2 & 4) are going to stay with us for a while, I'm hoping no more than 3 months. I don't think Jinny's ever seen a sheep, but she's taken to following the children around, nipping at their heels & lower legs. She seems very confused & agitated, not in an aggressive way, but in a worried way. I really think she just doesn't know what to do w/ this ingrained instinct.

Now, here's the rub. I actually want to try herding w/ Jinny. So I'm at a loss as to what to do about her behavior around the children. I feel like if I just get after her to quit herding the kids, it'll squash that drive some & she won't feel like she's allowed to when I get to work w/ sheep. If I could work w/ sheep right now, I think that'd be great. It might show her sheep are for herding, children are not. But I really don't see that happening right away. I don't even know what I have available to me in the area.

So in the mean time, should I just keep the dog & kids separate most of the time, so as to not give Jinny enough opportunity to herd the kids? Or should I keep working on Jinny to try & get her to quit herding the kids?

And if anyone knows of possible herding resources in western WA (Seattle area & beyond), please share!

**JakodaCD OA** · 01-03-2012, 06:53 PM

I would work on her to NOT herd the kids, you don't want her randomly nipping at kids heels/legs , not a good thing especially if she decides to do a full grip.

As for squashing her drive for herding, I doubt it, if it's there, it's there, she needs to learn what is appropriate and what is not.

By not correcting her, she is going to think anything moving is fair game..

With that I'd keep her on a leash/long line around the kids, and start correcting her behaviors..Something else to think about, you might want to 'train' the kids to.

No racing around/screaming while the dog is around..That can set some dogs off as well..

I have a very high drive aussie, who goes bonkers when it comes to sheep (in a good way), she does NOT however herd kids or people,,she will herd the other dogs at times, but she knows humans are off limits and they hold no real interest for her.

anjum · 01-04-2012, 02:44 PM

Thx for that Jakoda. I will keep working on the dog, and the kids! The 4 yr old is pretty good, she can imitate what I show her. But the 2 yr old, not so much. But we'll continue to work on it.

I still want to introduce the dog to sheep ASAP . . .

Stosh · 01-06-2012, 07:10 AM

Stosh has been herding for a while and he's never nipped or even attempted to nip at the heels or legs of the sheep so Jinny might not do that with sheep either. Could be that she's just excited about being around the fast moving little kids and not 'herding' them but only playing- which obviously she shouldn't be allowed to do. If you do get into herding she'll learn the difference between working [moving the sheep] and playing [chasing the sheep]. Go to the AKC website and look for herding instinct tests/trials in your area

anjum · 01-06-2012, 09:24 PM

I don't know that she's playing; I get the distinct impression that she's worried or weirded out.

GSDElsa · 01-07-2012, 08:29 AM

Worried or weirded out can escalate VERY quickly. STOP HER NOW! Dogs need to know that it is unacceptable to lay teeth on kids. Try redirecting and if that doesn't work, a correction is definitely in order. Don't make a big deal out of it, but she needs to stop. Herding kids and herding sheep should not even be associated with each other and if her drive isn't there to herd sheep it will have nothing to do with being stopped from nipping at kids.

**JakodaCD OA** · 01-07-2012, 08:38 AM

Short story

I once had a male gsd, Jake, best dawg ever..I don't have kids, but at the time my nephew was around 5-6 years old and would come over often..Jake LOVED kids and was the big "momma bear" when they were around..

The nephew had an older brother who was around 10, they would chase each other around the yard, and the older one would tackle his brother..Jake would get upset when anyone was messing with a kid...He would be in the thick of it, grabbing the older boy by the seat of the pants and yanking him off the younger one..He did it very calmly and matter of factly, like "this is not good behavior boys!".

Once the younger one was flopping around in Jakes doggie pool, I honestly think Jake thought he was drowning, he'd go in, again, grab the kid by the seat of the pants and yank him out of the pool,,the kid thought this was the 'greatest'

Probably not a good idea, but I knew what this dog would and wouldnt' do when it came to kids, he'd body block kids from falling down stairs, he mothered a litter of stray kittens..He was such a gentle dog but if you were 'hurtin' a kid, he was rightthere..

So I'm not encouraging this behavior at all especially in a younger dog just wanted to share a story,,Jake was out of old grafental / bodo lines,,such a good rep of the breed back in the 80's..

anjum · 01-07-2012, 02:19 PM

Thanks ladies. Believe me, I'm not just letting Jinny do whatever she wants. I AM apprehensive about this behavior, and have stopped it as soon as possible in every instance. For now, I'm keeping the kids & dog separate most of the time. I will only bring them together in small doses, trying to increase Jinny's exposure to them, while controlling her behavior. It's a work in progress . . .

Dooney's Mom · 01-07-2012, 06:25 PM

My nephew is 3 1/2 and we just moved in with him . I have had Dooney around him since I got her, but I used the long line on her for a while when she started this behaviour. Since a 3 1/2 year old can't really be vocal and give commands (at least not this one) I taught her that OW meant you are hurting me- so if she went after him too rough he knows to say OW (i do correct her asap, but i want him to learn too)

She is a bit nippy with him in the mornings when he first gets up, which is getting better. but they play all day long now and she has gotten VERY protective of him. Also, the leave it command comes in very handy.

Good luck!

anjum · 01-13-2012, 03:18 PM

Little update: I had Jinny in the house w/ the kids yesterday. I had taken the dogs for a run/walk earlier in the day, so she got some of her energy out. She wants to follow the kids around everywhere, and after several "Leave It's", I just put her in a down/stay next to me while I was doing dishes. She tried to get up a couple times, but then she settled in. She did really well! The kids mom was also helping keep the kids somewhat subdued (no running, squealing around the dog). But they still provided plenty of distraction & temptation. So I think this will be the way we go about it for a while.

I also found a place to do herding lessons, so I'm hoping to make it over there before the end of the month.

I'm encouraged! Thanks to all for your help.

01-03-2012, 06:38 PM	#1 (permalink)
anjum Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Everett, WA Posts: 42	Herding Children GSD Friends, I need some help sorting this one out. So it seems that Jinny might have some pretty good herding instinct. My bf's niece & her two children (ages 2 & 4) are going to stay with us for a while, I'm hoping no more than 3 months. I don't think Jinny's ever seen a sheep, but she's taken to following the children around, nipping at their heels & lower legs. She seems very confused & agitated, not in an aggressive way, but in a worried way. I really think she just doesn't know what to do w/ this ingrained instinct. Now, here's the rub. I actually want to try herding w/ Jinny. So I'm at a loss as to what to do about her behavior around the children. I feel like if I just get after her to quit herding the kids, it'll squash that drive some & she won't feel like she's allowed to when I get to work w/ sheep. If I could work w/ sheep right now, I think that'd be great. It might show her sheep are for herding, children are not. But I really don't see that happening right away. I don't even know what I have available to me in the area. So in the mean time, should I just keep the dog & kids separate most of the time, so as to not give Jinny enough opportunity to herd the kids? Or should I keep working on Jinny to try & get her to quit herding the kids? And if anyone knows of possible herding resources in western WA (Seattle area & beyond), please share!

01-03-2012, 06:53 PM	#2 (permalink)
JakodaCD OA Moderator Join Date: May 2000 Location: Old Lyme, CT USA Posts: 14,237	I would work on her to NOT herd the kids, you don't want her randomly nipping at kids heels/legs , not a good thing especially if she decides to do a full grip. As for squashing her drive for herding, I doubt it, if it's there, it's there, she needs to learn what is appropriate and what is not. By not correcting her, she is going to think anything moving is fair game.. With that I'd keep her on a leash/long line around the kids, and start correcting her behaviors..Something else to think about, you might want to 'train' the kids to. No racing around/screaming while the dog is around..That can set some dogs off as well.. I have a very high drive aussie, who goes bonkers when it comes to sheep (in a good way), she does NOT however herd kids or people,,she will herd the other dogs at times, but she knows humans are off limits and they hold no real interest for her. __________________ Diane Danger Danger vom Kleinen Hain aka Masi "Angel" Jakoda's Bewitchen Sami CD OA OAJ OAC NGC OJC RS-O GS-N JS-O TT HIC CGC "Angel" Steinwald's Four x Four CGC HIC TT Harmonyhill's Hy Jynx NA NAJ NAC NJC RS-N JS-N HIC Jakoda's Jagged Edge

01-07-2012, 08:29 AM	#6 (permalink)
GSDElsa Crowned Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Central, NY Posts: 3,706	Worried or weirded out can escalate VERY quickly. STOP HER NOW! Dogs need to know that it is unacceptable to lay teeth on kids. Try redirecting and if that doesn't work, a correction is definitely in order. Don't make a big deal out of it, but she needs to stop. Herding kids and herding sheep should not even be associated with each other and if her drive isn't there to herd sheep it will have nothing to do with being stopped from nipping at kids. __________________ Justine, mom to: - Elsa - BrightStar Rescue - "Da Pookins" - Medo Aritar Bastet - "The Beast From The East"

01-07-2012, 08:38 AM	#7 (permalink)
JakodaCD OA Moderator Join Date: May 2000 Location: Old Lyme, CT USA Posts: 14,237	Short story I once had a male gsd, Jake, best dawg ever..I don't have kids, but at the time my nephew was around 5-6 years old and would come over often..Jake LOVED kids and was the big "momma bear" when they were around.. The nephew had an older brother who was around 10, they would chase each other around the yard, and the older one would tackle his brother..Jake would get upset when anyone was messing with a kid...He would be in the thick of it, grabbing the older boy by the seat of the pants and yanking him off the younger one..He did it very calmly and matter of factly, like "this is not good behavior boys!". Once the younger one was flopping around in Jakes doggie pool, I honestly think Jake thought he was drowning, he'd go in, again, grab the kid by the seat of the pants and yank him out of the pool,,the kid thought this was the 'greatest' Probably not a good idea, but I knew what this dog would and wouldnt' do when it came to kids, he'd body block kids from falling down stairs, he mothered a litter of stray kittens..He was such a gentle dog but if you were 'hurtin' a kid, he was rightthere.. So I'm not encouraging this behavior at all especially in a younger dog just wanted to share a story,,Jake was out of old grafental / bodo lines,,such a good rep of the breed back in the 80's.. __________________ Diane Danger Danger vom Kleinen Hain aka Masi "Angel" Jakoda's Bewitchen Sami CD OA OAJ OAC NGC OJC RS-O GS-N JS-O TT HIC CGC "Angel" Steinwald's Four x Four CGC HIC TT Harmonyhill's Hy Jynx NA NAJ NAC NJC RS-N JS-N HIC Jakoda's Jagged Edge

01-07-2012, 06:25 PM	#9 (permalink)
Dooney's Mom Master Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: Deland, Fl Posts: 645	My nephew is 3 1/2 and we just moved in with him . I have had Dooney around him since I got her, but I used the long line on her for a while when she started this behaviour. Since a 3 1/2 year old can't really be vocal and give commands (at least not this one) I taught her that OW meant you are hurting me- so if she went after him too rough he knows to say OW (i do correct her asap, but i want him to learn too) She is a bit nippy with him in the mornings when he first gets up, which is getting better. but they play all day long now and she has gotten VERY protective of him. Also, the leave it command comes in very handy. Good luck! __________________ Wendy Beaulieu's Dooney Von Pell- GSD 01/25/2011 RIP- Skye- WGSD 1991-2007 2 psycho cats- Diva & Jake

01-04-2012, 02:44 PM	#3 (permalink)
anjum Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Everett, WA Posts: 42	Thx for that Jakoda. I will keep working on the dog, and the kids! The 4 yr old is pretty good, she can imitate what I show her. But the 2 yr old, not so much. But we'll continue to work on it. I still want to introduce the dog to sheep ASAP . . .

01-06-2012, 07:10 AM	#4 (permalink)
Stosh Crowned Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: tyler texas Posts: 8,434	Stosh has been herding for a while and he's never nipped or even attempted to nip at the heels or legs of the sheep so Jinny might not do that with sheep either. Could be that she's just excited about being around the fast moving little kids and not 'herding' them but only playing- which obviously she shouldn't be allowed to do. If you do get into herding she'll learn the difference between working [moving the sheep] and playing [chasing the sheep]. Go to the AKC website and look for herding instinct tests/trials in your area

01-06-2012, 09:24 PM	#5 (permalink)
anjum Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Everett, WA Posts: 42	I don't know that she's playing; I get the distinct impression that she's worried or weirded out.

01-07-2012, 02:19 PM	#8 (permalink)
anjum Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Everett, WA Posts: 42	Thanks ladies. Believe me, I'm not just letting Jinny do whatever she wants. I AM apprehensive about this behavior, and have stopped it as soon as possible in every instance. For now, I'm keeping the kids & dog separate most of the time. I will only bring them together in small doses, trying to increase Jinny's exposure to them, while controlling her behavior. It's a work in progress . . .

01-13-2012, 03:18 PM	#10 (permalink)
anjum Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Everett, WA Posts: 42	Little update: I had Jinny in the house w/ the kids yesterday. I had taken the dogs for a run/walk earlier in the day, so she got some of her energy out. She wants to follow the kids around everywhere, and after several "Leave It's", I just put her in a down/stay next to me while I was doing dishes. She tried to get up a couple times, but then she settled in. She did really well! The kids mom was also helping keep the kids somewhat subdued (no running, squealing around the dog). But they still provided plenty of distraction & temptation. So I think this will be the way we go about it for a while. I also found a place to do herding lessons, so I'm hoping to make it over there before the end of the month. I'm encouraged! Thanks to all for your help.

Remove Advertisements Sponsored Links
German Shepherd Advertisement