Mounting and being stubborn about it

[TankGrrl66]

Ok, lets stay lighthearted about this...

The dog park poll thread completely reminded me of this. I forgot bc of our ruined doggy social life

My very rude older dog had (I imagine still has) an embarrassing vice.

Turned loose amongst other dogs, he would always try to mount them. Every single last one. Sometimes he wouldn't even sniff first, but usually would. Most dogs start playing, up he would go...and nothing short of forcefully grabbing him and snatching him away would help at all. Not even a prong.

Trying to be a saavy dog owner, I looked it up ASAP. I called trainers. Everyone said it was normal and part of play since he was neutered.

This did not ease how most people reacted, even though I would always intervene within seconds. If I had a dollar for every snicker followed by the word 'gay' somewhere, I could open my OWN flippin' dog park.

He even started getting crafty. He would sneak away from me and ignore me, and started getting very aggressive about the mounting. He would even attack dogs for resisting...he went from normal mounting to rapist dog. I felt bad after 2 occaisions of that, so now he isn't allowed off leash around other dogs.

So I was just wondering...how many of you agree that mounting is a natural social/play behavior?
How many of you think he has some sexual problem?
Why do you think he became aggressive about it? I imagine the punishment for mounting did that, but what else was I supposed to do? Working on recall did nothing...and I can't carry food at a dog park to get his attention.
Any other insight that I am missing?

Any ideas to stop it? I would like to take him with me when I take my puppy in social situations with other dogs. I want to make sure this habit is GONE first.

*sigh*

[chelle]

Mmm I don't know... but if it isn't sexual, which is likely is not, (though I don't know the situation, if he's neutered, if the ones he's trying to mount are speutered or not, etc,) then I have to think it is simply about dominance.

Everyone said it was normal, part of dog play? I can't go with that.

I don't subscribe to it being "natural social/play behavior." At all.

I've read about sexual dysmorphic issues. (spelling could be wrong there). Might be worth more research on that.

I'm pretty harsh on this issue. My oldest girl occasionally gets some bee in her bonnet and humps. I totally shut it down. I'm not a harsh owner, but this issue will bring it out in me. Considering she's spayed and has been for years and years, it is not sexual - it is her attempt to be dominant. On this, I wouldn't worry about recall, treats, anything else, I think this is one thing we must be very forthright and even physically forceful to make stop.

I could be totally wrong, I often am , but I just can't tolerate this with my own or any others.

Curious to see the other responses this one gets.

[jocoyn]

I have always heard of it as an attempt at dominance. Never heard of it referred to as "sexual" unless he is moutning a female in heat.

As far as dog parks and play with other dogs I can't answer that one but it is not a behavior I would tolerate one bit. I am in the "my dogs ignore, not play with strange dogs" camp.

Good way for your dog to get bit by another dog that does not like it.

[Cassidy's Mom]

Originally Posted by TankGrrl66

So I was just wondering...how many of you agree that mounting is a natural social/play behavior?

I think it CAN be, but with limits. It's not at all uncommon between dogs who are part of the same pack or between doggy pals who are comfortable with each other. Keefer humps Halo all the time when they're playing and she doesn't care, but she'd tell off a dog that she didn't know who tried that with her - I've seen her do it.

And Halo will sometimes hump Keefer too! If I take him out for a walk and leave her home she jumps all over him when we get back and often she'll climb on his back and hump him for a few seconds. We think she's telling him that even though he got something she didn't get he's still her bitch!

But just because this is normal and common social behavior in my pack, that doesn't mean it's okay with dogs outside the pack. My dogs never hump strange dogs (I would not allow that) and as I said in the other thread, they're fairly tolerant of it as long as it doesn't go on too long, so I step in right away if it happens. I tell them to cut it out when they do it to each other, but it's not that big a deal to me because it clearly doesn't bother either of them, and it has never translated over to humping dogs outside the pack, where it could provoke a fight.

How many of you think he has some sexual problem?

It's dominance posturing, it's not sexual. People who are snickering about your "gay" dog know nothing about dog behavior.

Why do you think he became aggressive about it?

No idea. How old is he? Is he neutered? Did he get humped or otherwise picked on by other dogs when he was younger? Sometimes dogs develop a "get 'em before they get me" me mentality. It's possible that at this point it's firmly established behavior and there's not much you can do about it besides management, which means he has no opportunity to practice it anymore. I haven't dealt with this before so I'm just guessing. But not every dog is a great candidate for off leash socializing with other dogs, and that may be the case here.

[msvette2u]

Wow. I'm glad someone brought this up.
I know that dogs do it out of dominance or play or whatever, but lately, one of our boys has began mounting and it becomes sexual (???) really quickly as his bulb swells and he actually sniffs and licks himself as if to, er, um, clean himself off. He is getting aroused by this behavior - and his "love interest" is a male.
What does anyone make of that??

[PaddyD]

Time for a behaviorist intervention?

[Shaina]

I don't like to use electric for a lot of behavioral issues, but barking and mounting are two things that my dogs get the buzzer for. It is unacceptable in my eyes, the other dogs eyes, and I'm SURE the other dogs owners, so I'd rather nip it as it occurs than allow the behavior to continue. I'm sure many will disagree, but I think that is the *easiest* solution.

[TankGrrl66]

I completely forgot about the dominance thing...I have been immersing myself in all these positive training reads lately bc of my puppy and they never bring it up (dominance, or this problem, for that matter)

I did consult a behaviorist. All he did was try and sell me an overpriced handheld thing that shot a little blast of compressed air at my dog. He didn't even mind it, lol.

I really thought about using an ecollar...I can't find one for under 150-200. That is a LOT of money for me, especially something I don't want to use incorrectly.

[TankGrrl66]

He is around 8 and neutered. I have had him since he was 2 maybe 3, and that was when he was fixed.

The last time it was a problem was at an agility class we took. The instructor mentioned that he could have been used for breeding when he was with his other owner, so that was how he viewed other dogs. I'm not so sure about that one, but I thought it was an interesting point.

Oddly enough, he doesn't even think about it with the dogs he lives with. In fact, our other males mounts HIM every once in awhile.

He knows I get angry when he does it. As soon as he jumps up on another dog I would grab him and reprimand him and literally pluck him off the other dog.

And of course other than that and declaring the mailman his mortal enemy he is pretty much perfect

[Shaina]

Originally Posted by TankGrrl66

I completely forgot about the dominance thing...I have been immersing myself in all these positive training reads lately bc of my puppy and they never bring it up (dominance, or this problem, for that matter)

I did consult a behaviorist. All he did was try and sell me an overpriced handheld thing that shot a little blast of compressed air at my dog. He didn't even mind it, lol.

I really thought about using an ecollar...I can't find one for under 150-200. That is a LOT of money for me, especially something I don't want to use incorrectly.

It is a lot of money. I paid $180 for my dogtra and that was the price we got it from the manufacturer, costs about $240 or so for it otherwise.... but it is an invaluable tool for me. Howevere, I agree with you, if you do not know how to use one it should not be used. You can, however, find a trainer that knows electric well and will train you how to use it correctly if that is the route you choose to go. I feel like otherwise the options can be pretty limited - leaving a long line on him and yanking him off from a distance COULD work, but it would require pretty good timing and angles :P Besides that, it sounds like you've done quite a bit with no results, so it's definitely time to consult a trainer if it is an issue you'd like to resolve.