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Buying a puppy from a friend, help and advice would be appreciated

20K views 165 replies 49 participants last post by  David Winners 
#1 ·
Hi everyone!

A friend of mine has a pair of GSD's who just had puppies. I was originally very opposed to the thought of buying a puppy from someone when there are so many in shelters, but after my last experience I have changed my mind.

My friend is not a breeder, she does not do anything like that to my knowledge. She simply has a male and female GSD and they have puppies now. I am going to buy one from her, a female, and will pick her up when she's 8 weeks old.

I asked her if she was going to have them screened for any hip and elbow issues and she said it wasn't necessary because her dogs don't have any issues. I would just like to know upfront what I should ask about or have done to make sure we don't have any issues. I tried reading as much as I could and I would still like to hear from someone else that knows much more about these amazing dogs than I do.

Thanks in advance!
 
#3 ·
I don't know about what happened with your last dog, but if you are looking for a good quality puppy, find a good breeder that health and temperament tests their dogs. Not every health issue is obviously visible, and neither are hip and elbow issues, so your friend is wrong in saying health testing doesn't matter.

I wouldn't give my money to someone who doesn't care about these things.
 
#4 ·
The puppies/dogs that are in shelters, come from people like your friend.
 
#5 ·
You should ask her again about certifying hip structure for her GSD's. They may not have hip issues now, but the future is unpredictable. You might also want to ask about the bloodline if you really want a purebred german shepherd.
As sad as it is, while there are so many dogs in shelters, many of them will grow to have an abundance of health problems. It's safer to either not get emotionally attached (which let's face it- is almost impossible), or to just get one from a reliable breeder.
 
#7 ·
Her dogs may not have issues, but what about their parents, siblings? It isn't just health to be concerned about, also temperament.

It is a tough call. The pups are here. I wouldn't buy a pup from her, but would cover the costs of the pup for the first vet/shot visit, otherwise it is just supporting a BYB. If you are concerned about health due to prior experience, do some research and begin talking with responsible breeders. They will know their dogs, the type pups they produce and will have done the needed testing.
 
#8 ·
You could purchase the pup from your friend. It could be the best dog you've ever had. It may not ever have any significant health issues.

Sadly, the odds wouldn't be in your favor.
 
#9 ·
I asked her if she was going to have them screened for any hip and elbow issues and she said it wasn't necessary because her dogs don't have any issues. I would just like to know upfront what I should ask about or have done to make sure we don't have any issues.
If your friend is that ignorant, then honestly there's nothing you can ask or do to make sure you don't have issues.

The dogs are bred, the puppies are born. If you like the parents and you want one of their progeny, take one. I agree with the consensus in this thread that personally I would not support somebody's carelessness by giving them money for such a puppy, but that's your decision.

In any case, it really doesn't sound like there's anything meaningful you can ask your friend, because it sounds like that person has absolutely no idea what they're doing and the answers would be useless.

Just raise your puppy like you'd raise any other puppy and hope for the best.
 
#10 ·
I've always loved GSD's and I have always wanted one but could never really have one until now. I adopted one from a shelter about a month ago and we were absolutely in love with her. She wound up getting sick three days later so we took her back to the shelter so they could have her looked at by a vet and they told us she had distemper so they put her down. I offered to pay for the treatment because we really loved the dog but they said it wouldn't be worth it because most likely she would die anyways. So that was that.

We still want one and I've made efforts to reach out to different rescue organizations but surprisingly, not a single one has contacted me back. I've filled out the applications, made phone calls, sent emails and haven't received anything back. The one organization that did reply back to me told me that they wouldn't let me adopt a GSD because of where I live, since my area is supposedly really bad at treating them.

I don't want to risk another shelter issue like the one I had, especially with something as bad and contagious as distemper. We have another dog and I would be absolute destroyed if they both got sick.

That is why I'm pretty much willing to give up and buy a dog from this friend of mine. I understand everything that you all are saying but unless I can get in contact with a shelter or rescue like I originally wanted to, I don't see anything else to do. I don't have the money to buy one from a reputable breeder and it's almost the same thing as buying one from my friend except of course for the fact that the reputable breeder will provide a much better quality dog.

We don't want a show dog or a working dog. We want a loving dog that we can raise from a puppy and grow with our family.
 
#15 ·
I don't have the money to buy one from a reputable breeder and it's almost the same thing as buying one from my friend except of course for the fact that the reputable breeder will provide a much better quality dog.
No, it's not at all the same thing. One of those choices supports the welfare of the breed that we all love. The other does not.

If you truly want to adopt from a rescue or shelter, and you can't find the exact puppy you want, then my first recommendation would be to broaden your criteria. Consider adopting an adolescent or adult dog, and consider mixes in addition to purebred puppies.

In most parts of the U.S. (and, from what I hear, most parts of Canada), it is not difficult to find adopters for purebred puppies. Demand for those dogs is very high, they get adopted quickly, and they tend to have their choices of excellent homes. There's often a long waiting list for these dogs. Everybody wants those puppies, because there is this widespread idea that a puppy will be a clean slate and totally malleable, and that a purebred puppy will automatically have the complement of traits that people stereotypically associate with its breed.

Both of those ideas are, in my opinion, completely wrongheaded. Puppies are not clean slates, they're crapshoots, especially puppies from unknown backgrounds (as most rescue and shelter pups are). Purebred dogs do not always have the traits that people associate with their breed stereotypes.

So if you want to rescue a dog, my advice is to figure out what you actually want -- what personality traits, what energy level, what kind of temperament -- and then look for a dog somewhere in the 6-month to 3-year range that has that personality and activity level.

Sometimes the right dog for you does not come in the package you anticipated. I have an Akita mix foster dog coming this weekend who will, in all probability, have a fantastic family dog personality: calm, gentle, affectionate, playful, sociable to people and other animals -- in short, not at all what people tend to associate with stereotypical Akitas. She's about a year old, so her personality and structure will be pretty much set. No crapshoot there: she's mature enough that what you see is what you get. And I think that is a much safer and more sensible choice for the average pet home than a cute fluffy question mark of a puppy would be, especially when we're talking about a breed like the GSD that has so many health and behavioral problems in its lines.

On the other hand, if you are absolutely dead set on having a purebred GSD for whatever reason, and you can't find one in rescue, then buy one from a responsible, ethical, knowledgeable breeder. Support a program that is striving to produce the best possible dog in all respects. If you have to save up for it, then save up.

But please do not support ignorance and greed by buying from someone who is not even trying to produce good, sound, healthy dogs.
 
#12 ·
She isn't a very close friend, more like someone I knew from high school and keep contact with through Facebook. A close friend would definitely not be selling me a puppy.

She is also not the type of person to advertise their puppies on Craigslist or Facebook in that matter. She is definitely not an expert on GSD's either. She knew that I had a puppy once and that she had to be put down. She told me to let her know if I wanted another one and I did. She recently told me that her dog just gave birth to 6 puppies and I jumped at the chance to get one.

I'm not defending her and I'm not 100% excited about this. I'm 100% excited about getting a GSD puppy but I'd still rather adopt one from a rescue or shelter before buying one. I hope I can make that clear that I am not trying to add to the problem of irresponsible breeding and I'm actually very opposed to that. I don't see her as being the person who has her dogs simply to let them breed and then sell the puppies at the cyclic rate. If I find out that is the case with her, then I'll cancel and find a different dog.
 
#13 ·
Can I ask how much you are going to pay? If it's more than the cost to feed, deworm, and have the vet look at the pups, then it is too much and she will probably be making money off of them since she doesn't use the money to get the parents health screened, titled, etc. If it is truly an accidental breeding, she should be happy to place the pups without making money off of them.
 
#16 ·
^ Totally agree with Merciel's post above ^

to expand on what I was saying- if her dog has puppies, she needs to bring them to a vet before she charges anyone any amount of money. If it was TRULY an oops litter, she needs to take them to the vet, get them wormed and checked out. With a couple of visits to the vet plus feeding the pups for a couple of weeks after they are weened, I could see charging a small fee to get the money back and get her dogs fixed. Anything beyond those costs leads me to believe it is not an oops litter and I would not support that.
 
#18 ·
if she had these pups on purpose - she IS a breeder...

If it was by accident, and she is placing them for $200, she is NOT making any profit on the litter IMO, I just hope she plans on getting the parents both fixed. At least you get to meet the parents, but otherwise, you are probably in a bit of a safer situation than with a shelter dog.....

Dogs not showing signs of having hip or elbow problems means nothing....dogs will still radiograph and rate dysplastic without visible symptoms and those dogs should NOT be bred because their pups are at a higher risk than pups from OFA certified parents.

Pups should be wormed at least 2x before being sent home, and should have a fecal test at the vets when they get their first set of vaccines.

At $200 you pay your money and take your chances. Not the ideal situation, but not much different than a rescue or shelter

Lee
 
#26 ·
Petfinder Adoptable | Dog | German Shepherd Dog | Ontario, CA | Princess
Petfinder Adoptable | Dog | German Shepherd Dog | Ontario, CA | Hannah

I found these two girls on petfinder in Ontario, CA :) they may not be puppies but it's always worth checking out.
I know I'm probably annoying you with all the rescue stuff but have you looked at Coastal German Shepherd Rescue of Southern California? Just from petfinder I saw they had a couple GSD pups and mixed gsd puppies.
I have a friend who volunteers with them who I contacted for more information and even filled out their application. I never got a call or email back.

The only rescue organization I heard back from was the Southern California German Shepherd Rescue who told me they don't adopt dogs to people living in San Bernardino or Riverside county.

I use petharbor.com and that is where I found the puppy I adopted the first time. She was about 4 months old, if you search through my posts you'll find a picture of her. I miss that dog :(
 
#21 ·
If you visit and the parents aren't skittish and barking non stop and the pups are active and not shy then I don't see why not. These pups are born. They will either be sold to someone else or put in shelters. Then I guess you can "rescue" it from a shelter? It's all the same. You not supporting a byb isn't going to change a thing. There's always people out there who wants a cheap puppy. The chances of you getting a dog that everything a German Shepherd should be aren't in your favor but that's the gamble you have to take if you don't want to go to a reputable breeder.

Btw 200 seems cheap now but if the dog has aggression issues and needs a trainer or has medical issues then I promise you that 200 up front won't seem so cheap anymore. I've gone the byb route and learned the hard way. The emotional and financial toll isn't worth it.

I wouldn't spend 2000 on a dog either. Good thing well bred dogs don't cost that much.

Sent from Petguide.com Free App
 
#25 ·
Btw 200 seems cheap now but if the dog has aggression issues and needs a trainer or has medical issues then I promise you that 200 up front won't seem so cheap anymore. I've gone the byb route and learned the hard way. The emotional and financial toll isn't worth it.

Sent from Petguide.com Free App

THIS. $200 isn't much up front, but many of us (me included) learned the hard way that a poorly bred dog often means LOTS of $$$$ and heartache in the long run!
 
#22 ·
I really appreciate everyone's comments. I hope I'm not coming off in a bad way.

I haven't closed this deal so there's always time for me to back out and keep searching. I just wanted to have more information so I am making the most informed decision I can make.

I think the biggest reason I have for not wanting an adult dog is that we currently have a 3 year old male chihuahua that was given to my daughter as a birthday present. I can't take a risk with that dog's safety and maybe it's just me, but I feel that bringing an adult GSD into the home with my killer chihuahua is just asking for trouble. So that is why I want a puppy.

There are risks with everything, and I've read through thread after thread already about all the medical issues these dogs have. If it was about finding a dog that was 100% safe then I wouldn't be looking at these dogs at all, and instead would go back to keeping a fish tank on my desk.

I made the comment about the 2-4k dog because when I did searches for reputable breeders in my area, that's how much they cost. That is more than my TV, even more than my motorcycle lol
 
#27 ·
This forum generally only supports two ideas. One, buy from an ethical/reputable breeder (if you can honestly figure out who they are) or two, get from rescue/animal control.

Your friend will either sell these puppies to someone else or they will wind up in rescue/animal control. If you buy from your friend you will be a sinner. Get the same puppy from rescue and you are a saint who saved a puppy.
Go figure.

Everyone needs to learn. I say go ahead and get the puppy and you will learn one way or the other.
 
#29 ·
Thank you. I am realizing this and I would much rather be a saint. I have no doubt that she will either sell them or give them to someone when she doesn't want them. Then who knows what will happen to them. I know the type of person that I am and know that I will do my absolute best to take care of this animal. I love dogs, and I have always loved GSD's, maybe that's why I am even willing to consider getting one in this method.

I'm not giving up on finding the right one through a shelter or rescue organization. I seriously felt I had hit it perfect with the one we adopted a month ago, totally felt like it was my one in a million chance that I had gotten the perfect dog for me.

I'm okay with a dog having some issues, I don't think any dog is perfect, and I know this is totally not the popular opinion, but buying a dog from a so-called reputable breeder is like buying the best slave for my money in my opinion. That's kinda how I see it in my head. I don't think anyone should buy any dog or animal when we have so many in shelters. But I guess it's not a bad thing when everyone else does it. Maybe that's why I'm getting so much flak for asking my question. These could be perfectly good dogs, or just as good as breeder dogs but because they aren't from a breeder and aren't costing me thousands of dollars they will never be as good.
 
#28 ·
Why must you have one today? Now? Many of us have waited years and saved enough money until we could afford a well bred dog, and if you can only afford $200 to pay for a puppy, what are you going to do if you need to pay thousands to a vet for healthcare?
And leaving aside the money issue, if you have a "killer Chihuahua" in your home I would not recommend getting any other dog, much less a German Shepherd puppy.
A GSD could kill your Chihuahua in an instant, if the little dog annoyed it enough.
 
#31 ·
If you think about it, I've been waiting since I knew what a GSD was to have one...so should I keep waiting?

Is a 3k dollar GSD better than a shelter dog or a dog that someone dumps in the street? What about a dog that got out of the yard and ran around for a while before winding up in my front yard drinking water from the curb? Does a breeder dog not have to go to to vet anymore? Are they immune for anything and everything? Or are we simply talking about possibilities that something won't happen? I've read enough about finding a 'reputable' breeder that I don't even know how to find one anymore.
 
#34 ·
Please don't, I appreciate your comments, I genuinely do. But I think we've established that I am NOT going to save up money to buy one from a breeder. Now putting that aside, can you help me or is your only option for me to buy one from a breeder.

If that is your only option, can you recommend me your breeder, how much did your dog cost, where can I find more information on your breeder?
 
#38 ·
The advice I was hoping to get was along the lines of:

Have a vet screen the dog for a, b, c...
Check this and that from the parents
Check this and that from the litter
Take the dog to the vet afterwards and have them check for this or that
Be aware of these warning signs
Look out for these possible issues

I understand everything else, I should save my money and buy from a breeder, but then I also read that not all breeders are created equal and some people still have problems from their breeders. So how do I fix that?

I should also adopt, I want to adopt, it is what I want to do, but I am not having any luck. I am not giving up, I am still looking, and it is still what I want to do.

I wasn't expecting to only receive advice about buying from a breeder as if that is the absolute only option available and everything else is just wrong. I don't believe that. I want to believe that good dogs exist outside of the breeder circle.
 
#44 ·
The advice I was hoping to get was along the lines of:

Have a vet screen the dog for a, b, c...
Check this and that from the parents
Check this and that from the litter
Take the dog to the vet afterwards and have them check for this or that
Be aware of these warning signs
Look out for these possible issues
The problem here is that most issues are not apparent in 8-week-old puppies. Other than the absolute most extreme cases, you cannot tell if there are going to be behavioral or health problems. Those issues will only become apparent as they develop down the road.

Even then, if you don't have a ton of experience, it's easy to miss the warning signs. I thought I knew what I was doing when I adopted my fearful mutt puppy Pongu, because god knows I'd read all the books and watched all the videos and talked to the shelter staff (who turned out to have not the first clue about what they were doing)... and I didn't have the faintest idea what I was actually getting into.

So, I mean, you can and should try to go into it with your eyes open, but one of the big reasons people recommend working with a knowledgeable, ethical breeder is because a good one knows waaaayyy more about their dogs than any novice puppy buyer can possibly hope to see.

If your friend doesn't know or care enough to have done OFA or PennHip examinations of the breeding dogs' hips and elbows, if there's no realiable information about genetic health issues in the pedigree, if you don't have any record of performance titles or working certifications... then all the stuff that I would normally suggest looking for simply is not there. Those questions can't be answered. Therefore there's no point asking them.

The only thing you really can do, as a couple of people have already said, is to go meet the parents and see if they're skittish or aggressive. Try to get a look at them off their own property and in unfamiliar environments (many timid dogs will appear more relaxed in their own homes, and the timidity will only become apparent when they're in less familiar places). That's about all you can reasonably hope to evaluate.

On the adopting front, if you are really dedicated to doing that, my suggestion would be to contact rescues and ask to be placed on a waiting list, and/or spend some time volunteering with those rescues (if you can't foster, you might be able to help in some other capacity like fundraising, transport, web design, etc. -- if you have ANY skills, there's something you can do to help).

Then you might be able to get to the head of the line when a dog you like comes in through that rescue. But that route usually takes some time and there are no guarantees about what dogs will come through the shelter system or when.
 
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