Working Lines vs Show Lines (wait, what?)

[Raizo]

^^ Hello again, to those who've responded to my previous threads (I've got plenty more questions were those came from!), I'm back with something that I have very little understanding of. Working Lines and Show Lines, also it seems as though German Shepherds from DDR (East German), differ from Czechoslovakian Lines (Czech) German Shepherds.

What I want to know is what they are, (I have found a link that explains it, but its still a bit fuzzy) and how can I possibly choose which one would be best for me and my family?

List of loose requirements for my GSD as of September 25th, 2010:

*Suitable for Personal Protection Work
*Suitable for Schultzhund Competitions (trials?)
*Makes a good family pet

What type of German Shepherd should I be looking for? Will I have to sacrifice one of the three in favor of the PP work or Schultzhund Competitions? If it's absolutely necessary, then I'm fine with that.

Ah, here's the link I found explaining a little of it.
Quality Breeders of Large German Shepherds

[Zoeys mom]

Any GSD will be good for personal protection of your family without a doubt and most would chose a working line dog for Schutzhund, but your average working line dog takes awhile to become a great family pet. All that drive makes for a hyper nippy puppy who will need a lot of exercise and mental stimulation from you. Schutzhund is like having a part time job on top of your full time job and is pretty expensive. If you have the time and money go for it, but even a great working pup is not exactly born to be a schutzhund dog. That is going to take a lot of determination and training on your part. Why not visit a few clubs in your area and get a feel for the sport and the dogs. Thats really going to be the best way to decide what kind of dog your looking for and for what purposes you really want the dog

[Liesje]

I would get a working line. If you are really interested in Schutzhund and being competitive, that should be your focus. It is more stylized than other types of training and requires the right genetics and foundation (how you raise, socialize, and initially train). Once you get on your way in SchH you will know enough about your particular dog to branch out into other protection work. Keep in mind that there are liabilities that come with having a real, trained personal protection dog.

I don't think that raising a good SchH prospect has to be different or more difficult than any other type. Drive is not the same as hectic behaviors or hyper activity. I've seen some really nice, well bred working line puppies that had great manners and were not difficult puppies.

[Andy-jr.]

Like Liesje said, go with the working line. I have had both working and just your average pet line and I love the working line. To me they seem to be fast learners and willing to learn.

[KZoppa]

i would definitely say go with working line if those are your goals. I have a showline girl and she is not even close to suited for anything except a family pet. She's a little slow on the learning too. She's not high drive for anything except food and attention. She doesnt like to play fetch or chase anything. She's the first of my dogs to hide and she's VERY friendly with everyone and everything. She's my chicken dog. Zena is my working line girl, she has the protection instinct down pat and the drive to learn readily. Riley is a mix and if i had to guess i would say his GSD side is from working lines given his temperment. Shasta's dad is from germany but i would say he was more showlines. I'm anxiously waiting for the day i can bring home my working line male. I have a few breeders in mind too but until i'm able, i'm not seriously looking. Okay now i'm babbling. Go with working line. I know there are tons of people on this board that prefer the DDR lines over the Czech lines. To my knowledge you can even find working lines with both DDR and Czech lines in there.

[Castlemaid]

And if you are looking for a dog for Schutzhund, you definitely DON'T want an "Old Fashioned Large German Shepherd"

Here is a good article that describes more in depth the differences between Working and Show/ American and German:

(Types of German Shepherds, by Wildhaus Kennels )

And also some highly recommended reading:

(Elements of Temperament, by Joy Tiz )

[JKlatsky]

You have to prioritize and understand what you mean when you say "Personal Protection Dog" as well as family pet.

Can you get all 3? Yes. But you probably won't know it until the dog is older. It is very difficult to get a puppy and know that it will be good for Personal Protection Work. Understand what you are asking for there. A Personal Protection Dog generally has a high level of suspicion and will engage a stranger without equipment. The purpose of a true Personal Protection Dog is to buy you time to get a gun or call for help. If all you really want is a dog that barks and looks the part most any dog will do. However...those kind of protection drives do not really emerge until the dog is mature (after 2 years of age).

If you want a SchH dog, your best bet is a working line. You should go visit some clubs and see the dogs so you understand what goes into that.

Family pet. Did you see this thread? schutzhund trainging or pet trainging? I think it does a nice job of pointing out the differences in rearing a working puppy versus the average family pet. I stand by what I said there... SchH puppies are terrible family pets. SchH dogs are the best. So after a year or so of training your dog will probably be excellent in the home...it's getting there that's will be the hard part.

[Raizo]

To Zoey's Mom: Just to be clear, working line dogs CAN become good family pets while still having a job or doing Shutzhund, right? o.o

To Liesje: Thank you for the advice! I've already located several Shutzhund clubs in my area (though they're all about an hour away from where I currently live), and I'll give them each a call tomorrow, to see if I can drop by for a visit. =)

KZoppa: =D Chicken dog! Awww. She sounds like a wonderful girl nonetheless! I love the name Zena. A strong, powerful, mentally sound dog automatically comes to mind...

Castlemaid: A big THANK YOU for the articles! I've just finished the one explaining the working and show/American and german lines, and it's cleared things right up. I'm definitely searching for a Working Line GSD if I want to do the Shutzhund/Personal Protection Training. On to the next article!

[Raizo]

A Personal Protection Dog generally has a high level of suspicion and will engage a stranger without equipment. The purpose of a true Personal Protection Dog is to buy you time to get a gun or call for help. If all you really want is a dog that barks and looks the part most any dog will do. However...those kind of protection drives do not really emerge until the dog is mature (after 2 years of age).

I know what you're saying, but yes, my family and I honestly want a TRUE Personal Protection Dog. It would be great to never have a NEED for one, the knowledge that my dog will be able to protect me when my life and wellbeing is threatened no matter where we are, is something I'm willing to go to any lengths to achieve. Even if it takes a year+, that's fine. Thanks for the link, checking out that thread now!

[KZoppa]

Originally Posted by Raizo

KZoppa: =D Chicken dog! Awww. She sounds like a wonderful girl nonetheless! I love the name Zena. A strong, powerful, mentally sound dog automatically comes to mind...

lol yeah Shelby is my chicken girl. Zena is my (well my inlaws now but hopefully mine again soon!) protector girl. She's my perfect dog. Excellent with kids, cats, most other dogs with proper introductions. Long as other dogs dont start any trouble she's cool with them. She's a pretty good dog. Shelby is a good girl but would rather hide than face anything... including the big fierce 7 lb cat that was raised by Zena lol!!! Shelby never met Zena so i'm curious to see how my girls would do when they do meet in february.

this is my Zena dog. her attitude and build tell me she is from working lines though probably a BYB case as her hips arent soo good but she gets the job done very nicely!



and this is my chicken dog Shelby. She's my showline girl. I was told she was from a local breeder, whom i can safely assume was a BYB because they told her previous owners that if they didnt take her, Shelby would be drowned as she was "useless" to the BYB. Shelby is a very sweet girl. Only issue we have with her is she suffers from seperation anxiety but we're working on it.



the cat in the picture is the 7lb terror cat. lol. She's a sweet cat but doesnt take ANYTHING from the dogs. She'll love on them and accept kisses from them but will smack them around if they get too nosey with her too. She's the cat Zena raised.