Possible new puppy, need advice

Lialla · 07-26-2011, 10:35 PM

First of all want to thank for a great forum! I've been here for a while and learned a lot, this forum is a valuable source of information!

I've been looking for a puppy and came across a 3-month old dark sable gorgeous male pup. His sire is Cato Katargo V Cato Katargo - German Shepherd Dog and dam is a 3 year old daughter of SG Orry, she is not titled yet, but the breeder said they are working on her Sch1. The puppy was returned to the breeder as previous owner thinks the pup doesn't suit his high-end sport goals. The breeder was very open, she told me the previous owner was very harsh with him and he was doing alpha rolls to the pup and now the puppy doesn't favor men and shows dominant behavior around them (except for breeder's husband). She said he is very good with children, socialized, started his training and behaves inside the house and will do great in agility.

This will be our first dog ever, we have kids and are looking for a family companion mostly, but I'm very eager to try dog sports such as agility and possibly Schutzhund with emphasis on obidience mostly. I'm not looking for titles just for fun for me and a dog. My concern is will he make a good fit for us considering his previous history or is it better to keep looking, there are other options right now. I really like the idea of getting a little bit older pup, but don't want to get a dog with problems.

What would you advise?

carmspack · 07-26-2011, 11:42 PM

I would take a chance on the pup . He is still very young and his brief bad period will quickly be history, forgotten history. What a goof --- his high end sports goals indeed . Good on the breeder for taking the pup back and good on them being open and honest with you .
Carmen
Carmspack Working German Shepherd Dogs

sagelfn · 07-26-2011, 11:43 PM

I'm wondering why the first owner felt the need to alpha roll a 3 month old puppy. Are they close to you? I would speak to the breeder about you and your spouse coming to visit for a day. See how that goes and then bring the kids up on another day.

If the breeder knows what you want and is honest as are you, they will not place you with a dog that is too much for you.

A 3 month old (12wks) pup is not really older, it is a common age to get a pup. Unless you mean you prefer this age instead of the usual 8wks. I think if he has strong nerves he will come around with training and socialization. He is still a baby.

Lialla · 07-27-2011, 03:57 PM

Thanks for your input! We are going to visit the breeder, and see how this goes. Any suggestions on how my husband should approach him? The breeder says that she wants to fing a good home for him and right now he needs a positive attitude and training.

I don't know what goes in the head of a person who alpha rolls a puppy. I feel sorry for this little guy.

wolfstraum · 07-27-2011, 05:12 PM

I am going to disagree with Carmen here - if this is a dominant pup, and has been ....let's call it mishandled, I would have reservations about placing him with a novice home...goals of doing sport or not.....

I venture to guess that I know where the pup comes from.....and am skeptical about the ...................................screening that has been/will be done to place this pup properly....the pedigree has some high power dogs in it, and I would personally steer a novice towards a pup whose genetics are more geared to socially happy biddable dogs.............JMHO

Lee

PS there is another thread here with a novice getting a strong pedigree'd Cz pup and she is being told to 'alpha roll' this boy who growls at her and bites.....NOT the same pup!!! - just remarking because of the advisability of alpha rolls on baby pups!

sagelfn · 07-27-2011, 05:40 PM

I just want to add that Carmen and Lee are both experienced breeders and have more knowledge in their little finger than me. If Lee knows the breeder and advises against it I would take her word.

I would probably still go see the pup just for the experience if it isn't too far of a drive. I would not be guilted into taking the pup though.

**MaggieRoseLee** · 07-27-2011, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sagelfn

I just want to add that Carmen and Lee are both experienced breeders and have more knowledge in their little finger than me. If Lee knows the breeder and advises against it I would take her word.

I would probably still go see the pup just for the experience if it isn't too far of a drive. I would not be guilted into taking the pup though.

You can learn alot by going to see a breeder and their dogs, even if it's that you do NOT want one of their dogs right now....

Keep this video in mind when you are looking at working line dogs...

‪So You Think You Want a High Drive Puppy‬&rlm; - YouTube

Lialla · 07-27-2011, 07:23 PM

what's very hard to distinguish, especially for a novice, is this an honest reputable breeder or the one that just tells you what you want to hear. (and i did read Things to look for in a 'Responsible' Breeder)

I want to check this pup out, so far I like everything that the breeder told me, exactly the dog I'm looking for. But I don't want to make a decision right away. What should I be aware of and take notice of when meeting the puppy? We live almost 4 hrs away and the breeder suggested to meet us halfway and bring the dam along.

I'm aware of what a working line dogs are, I've been researching this topic for quite some time, and yes, I saw that video

Quite an eye opener, but I'm up for a challenge, though I'm not looking for a super high drive puppy.

From what breeder said, he is not the biggest one in the litter and not an alpha, says he is very quiet in the house and cuddly, and playful outside.

**JakodaCD OA** · 07-27-2011, 07:33 PM

it's kinda hard to say 'what' to look for since it sounds like you won't be able to spend alot of time with him prior...

I'd say, since the breeder said he's got a 'thing' for me? Make sure you take your husband or a MAN along, see how he reacts to him..

Could you possibly take him on a trial basis? a couple of weeks, with the stipulation if he doesn't work out, you can return him/get your money back??

I don't know the breeder your dealing with (and please don't post their name, could lead to drama

Maybe you could PM a couple breeders here, (carmen for one, lee for one,,Cliff for another?) and ask their personal opinions on the breeder??

Please keep us updated and if you get him of course we want pictures

07-26-2011, 10:35 PM	#1 (permalink)
Lialla Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: NJ Posts: 111	Possible new puppy, need advice First of all want to thank for a great forum! I've been here for a while and learned a lot, this forum is a valuable source of information! I've been looking for a puppy and came across a 3-month old dark sable gorgeous male pup. His sire is Cato Katargo V Cato Katargo - German Shepherd Dog and dam is a 3 year old daughter of SG Orry, she is not titled yet, but the breeder said they are working on her Sch1. The puppy was returned to the breeder as previous owner thinks the pup doesn't suit his high-end sport goals. The breeder was very open, she told me the previous owner was very harsh with him and he was doing alpha rolls to the pup and now the puppy doesn't favor men and shows dominant behavior around them (except for breeder's husband). She said he is very good with children, socialized, started his training and behaves inside the house and will do great in agility. This will be our first dog ever, we have kids and are looking for a family companion mostly, but I'm very eager to try dog sports such as agility and possibly Schutzhund with emphasis on obidience mostly. I'm not looking for titles just for fun for me and a dog. My concern is will he make a good fit for us considering his previous history or is it better to keep looking, there are other options right now. I really like the idea of getting a little bit older pup, but don't want to get a dog with problems. What would you advise?

07-26-2011, 11:43 PM	#3 (permalink)
sagelfn Crowned Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Illinois Posts: 3,748	I'm wondering why the first owner felt the need to alpha roll a 3 month old puppy. Are they close to you? I would speak to the breeder about you and your spouse coming to visit for a day. See how that goes and then bring the kids up on another day. If the breeder knows what you want and is honest as are you, they will not place you with a dog that is too much for you. A 3 month old (12wks) pup is not really older, it is a common age to get a pup. Unless you mean you prefer this age instead of the usual 8wks. I think if he has strong nerves he will come around with training and socialization. He is still a baby. __________________ -Brandi Sage 6-5-09 Facebook

07-27-2011, 05:12 PM	#5 (permalink)
wolfstraum Crowned Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: PA Posts: 7,088	I am going to disagree with Carmen here - if this is a dominant pup, and has been ....let's call it mishandled, I would have reservations about placing him with a novice home...goals of doing sport or not..... I venture to guess that I know where the pup comes from.....and am skeptical about the ...................................screening that has been/will be done to place this pup properly....the pedigree has some high power dogs in it, and I would personally steer a novice towards a pup whose genetics are more geared to socially happy biddable dogs.............JMHO Lee PS there is another thread here with a novice getting a strong pedigree'd Cz pup and she is being told to 'alpha roll' this boy who growls at her and bites.....NOT the same pup!!! - just remarking because of the advisability of alpha rolls on baby pups! __________________ Csabre Sch1, Hexe Sch2, Bengal, Kyra, Kira & Kougar v Wolfstraum ~ Basha Sch3, Ghost Sch3 - Danger Sch1 SAR - ATB/Ret - Kyra, Sch3, Alice Sch1, Kelsey, Fenja Sch3 wolfstraum.net Last edited by wolfstraum; 07-27-2011 at 05:14 PM.

07-27-2011, 05:40 PM	#6 (permalink)
sagelfn Crowned Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Illinois Posts: 3,748	I just want to add that Carmen and Lee are both experienced breeders and have more knowledge in their little finger than me. If Lee knows the breeder and advises against it I would take her word. I would probably still go see the pup just for the experience if it isn't too far of a drive. I would not be guilted into taking the pup though. __________________ -Brandi Sage 6-5-09 Facebook

07-27-2011, 07:33 PM	#9 (permalink)
JakodaCD OA Moderator Join Date: May 2000 Location: Old Lyme, CT USA Posts: 14,237	it's kinda hard to say 'what' to look for since it sounds like you won't be able to spend alot of time with him prior... I'd say, since the breeder said he's got a 'thing' for me? Make sure you take your husband or a MAN along, see how he reacts to him.. Could you possibly take him on a trial basis? a couple of weeks, with the stipulation if he doesn't work out, you can return him/get your money back?? I don't know the breeder your dealing with (and please don't post their name, could lead to drama Maybe you could PM a couple breeders here, (carmen for one, lee for one,,Cliff for another?) and ask their personal opinions on the breeder?? Please keep us updated and if you get him of course we want pictures __________________ Diane Danger Danger vom Kleinen Hain aka Masi "Angel" Jakoda's Bewitchen Sami CD OA OAJ OAC NGC OJC RS-O GS-N JS-O TT HIC CGC "Angel" Steinwald's Four x Four CGC HIC TT Harmonyhill's Hy Jynx NA NAJ NAC NJC RS-N JS-N HIC Jakoda's Jagged Edge

07-26-2011, 11:42 PM	#2 (permalink)
carmspack Knighted Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: ontario - Posts: 3,324	I would take a chance on the pup . He is still very young and his brief bad period will quickly be history, forgotten history. What a goof --- his high end sports goals indeed . Good on the breeder for taking the pup back and good on them being open and honest with you . Carmen Carmspack Working German Shepherd Dogs

07-27-2011, 03:57 PM	#4 (permalink)
Lialla Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: NJ Posts: 111	Thanks for your input! We are going to visit the breeder, and see how this goes. Any suggestions on how my husband should approach him? The breeder says that she wants to fing a good home for him and right now he needs a positive attitude and training. I don't know what goes in the head of a person who alpha rolls a puppy. I feel sorry for this little guy.

07-27-2011, 07:23 PM	#8 (permalink)
Lialla Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: NJ Posts: 111	what's very hard to distinguish, especially for a novice, is this an honest reputable breeder or the one that just tells you what you want to hear. (and i did read Things to look for in a 'Responsible' Breeder) I want to check this pup out, so far I like everything that the breeder told me, exactly the dog I'm looking for. But I don't want to make a decision right away. What should I be aware of and take notice of when meeting the puppy? We live almost 4 hrs away and the breeder suggested to meet us halfway and bring the dam along. I'm aware of what a working line dogs are, I've been researching this topic for quite some time, and yes, I saw that video Quite an eye opener, but I'm up for a challenge, though I'm not looking for a super high drive puppy. From what breeder said, he is not the biggest one in the litter and not an alpha, says he is very quiet in the house and cuddly, and playful outside.

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