how to choose a herding dog

twhvlr · 03-25-2011, 01:46 PM

Hi, I'm new to this forum and to GSD's but I have owned several other breeds in the past. I would like a GSD for several reasons. Family pet, personal protection (not trained for this, just to bark, intimidation factor and maybe protect me as a friend as I would for it) and herding. I am planning on getting some sheep in the future and would like it to help me with them. I have read a lot on this forum and other web sites over the past week and have not seen much advice on how to choose a herding puppy. I would be OK with an older puppy or rescue dog too. Are there certain bloodlines that I should be looking for? What traits should I be seeing in the puppy? I keep reading of "working lines" but it seems like this is not referring to herding but to protection. Is this the line that I should be looking at? Any advice would greatly appreciated. I'm not in a great hurry as my husband and I are dog sitting my son's 2 boxers until at least October until he returns from Iraq.

Emoore · 03-25-2011, 01:50 PM

I keep hearing the Kirschental bloodlines in connection with herding. Might be something to look into. If your plan is to herd, you'll definitely want to go with a breeder who works their dogs on sheep, just like someone who wants to Schutzhund should go to a breeder who works their dog in that sport, and someone who wants to win in the show ring should go to a breeder whose dogs do well in shows.

DJEtzel · 03-25-2011, 01:50 PM

You would be looking at working line dogs that work in herding instead of protection, but any working line dogs could have the propensity to do well in hobby herding. Whatever breeder you chose would be picking the puppy for you for that venue and would know what to look for, you really don't have to know what to find in the puppy at all.

carmspack · 03-25-2011, 01:55 PM

herding that the GSD was developed for is not the same herding that everyone automatically thinks of --- .
Kirschental is not so much herding as a herding trials or competition dog.
What you might be looking for is that really smart old farm dog intelligence .
Later this spring I am going to try one of my males out on a mini flock.
Carmen
Carmspack Working German Shepherd Dogs

**Samba** · 03-25-2011, 01:57 PM

http://www.german-shepherdherding.com/

Sheep Herding German Shepherd Dogs Training

http://members.cox.net/gsdvominsel/index.htm

elisabeth_00117 · 03-25-2011, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carmspack

herding that the GSD was developed for is not the same herding that everyone automatically thinks of --- .
Kirschental is not so much herding as a herding trials or competition dog.
What you might be looking for is that really smart old farm dog intelligence .
Later this spring I am going to try one of my males out on a mini flock.
Carmen
Carmspack Working German Shepherd Dogs

Carmen, there is a herding test happening in the next few months (I think it's June) that Stark's breeder and I are going too. She works her girls on sheep and I know has a few youngsters as well as puppy/dog owners who are going (myself included). It's being put on by the Mal club out that way. Not sure if you knew about it or are interested at all.. just thought I would mention it.

**Samba** · 03-25-2011, 02:05 PM

My Carmspack Samba very talented on stock. It would be her activity of choice and mine had we any sheepies in nearby counties. First herding judge to evaluate her wanted her.

**Chris Wild** · 03-25-2011, 02:05 PM

Herding trials, particularly of the AKC variety, are very very different from real world/farm work type herding. There aren't that many people who do herding any more, particularly of the more real world style or the German HGH style. But then there aren't many people any more who have a pastoral lifestyle or the means to keep livestock, so that sort of makes sense.

If looking for a herding dog for real work, I'd probably get ahold of these folk and pick their brains a bit:
Ulf Kintzel
Truly pasture raised lambs. White Clover Sheep Farm

Ellen Nicklesberg
German Shepherd Herding

Emoore · 03-25-2011, 02:18 PM

There are plenty of people that do real farm herding, they're just hard to find if you don't know where to look. They don't go to competitions, they're not active on web forums, they're not breed enthusiasts. They're old guys on farms with livestock. Growing up we always had a couple of border collie/Australian Cattle Dog/Catahoula/whatever mixes that worked the cattle. They were incredibly valuable in getting a cow out of whatever thorn bush or stand of trees she had gotten into that you couldn't follow with a horse or 4-wheeler. They knew how to bring them in to the pen or select one or two out of a herd for you to get into the chute for branding/castrating/etc. They certainly weren't purebred or registered anything, and from what I can remember the young ones learned from the older ones. Nobody took their dogs to herding clinics. They just worked.

We got our first one when we traded 400 square bales to another rancher for him.

holland · 03-25-2011, 02:20 PM

Contact someone who does herding or has titled one of their dogs in herding

03-25-2011, 01:46 PM	#1 (permalink)
twhvlr New Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Colorado Posts: 7	how to choose a herding dog Hi, I'm new to this forum and to GSD's but I have owned several other breeds in the past. I would like a GSD for several reasons. Family pet, personal protection (not trained for this, just to bark, intimidation factor and maybe protect me as a friend as I would for it) and herding. I am planning on getting some sheep in the future and would like it to help me with them. I have read a lot on this forum and other web sites over the past week and have not seen much advice on how to choose a herding puppy. I would be OK with an older puppy or rescue dog too. Are there certain bloodlines that I should be looking for? What traits should I be seeing in the puppy? I keep reading of "working lines" but it seems like this is not referring to herding but to protection. Is this the line that I should be looking at? Any advice would greatly appreciated. I'm not in a great hurry as my husband and I are dog sitting my son's 2 boxers until at least October until he returns from Iraq.

03-25-2011, 01:50 PM	#2 (permalink)
Emoore Crowned Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: North DFW, TX Posts: 9,214	I keep hearing the Kirschental bloodlines in connection with herding. Might be something to look into. If your plan is to herd, you'll definitely want to go with a breeder who works their dogs on sheep, just like someone who wants to Schutzhund should go to a breeder who works their dog in that sport, and someone who wants to win in the show ring should go to a breeder whose dogs do well in shows. __________________ Rocky vom Backyard- 10 years young Kopper vom Felssclucht Bach - 17 months At the Bridge: Cash van der Animal Shelter 2006-2010

03-25-2011, 01:50 PM	#3 (permalink)
DJEtzel Knighted Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Kalamazoo, Michigan Posts: 2,932	You would be looking at working line dogs that work in herding instead of protection, but any working line dogs could have the propensity to do well in hobby herding. Whatever breeder you chose would be picking the puppy for you for that venue and would know what to look for, you really don't have to know what to find in the puppy at all. __________________ I'm Danielle Frag CGC, male GSD Bailey, female Rat Terrier Mix www.FraggleRockCollars.com

03-25-2011, 01:57 PM	#5 (permalink)
Samba Administrator Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: USA Posts: 6,447	http://www.german-shepherdherding.com/ Sheep Herding German Shepherd Dogs Training http://members.cox.net/gsdvominsel/index.htm Last edited by Samba; 03-25-2011 at 02:03 PM.

03-25-2011, 02:05 PM	#8 (permalink)
Chris Wild Administrator & Alpha Bitch of the Wild Bunch Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Michigan, USA Posts: 12,604	Herding trials, particularly of the AKC variety, are very very different from real world/farm work type herding. There aren't that many people who do herding any more, particularly of the more real world style or the German HGH style. But then there aren't many people any more who have a pastoral lifestyle or the means to keep livestock, so that sort of makes sense. If looking for a herding dog for real work, I'd probably get ahold of these folk and pick their brains a bit: Ulf Kintzel Truly pasture raised lambs. White Clover Sheep Farm Ellen Nicklesberg German Shepherd Herding __________________ *Wildhaus Kennels* Kaiser ~ SchH3 CGC TDI (HOT) Raven ~ SchH3 AWD2 PD1 P1 PA T1 UCD URO2 CGC TT (B/HOT) Della ~ SchHA TR1 PD1 P1 PA T1 URO2 CGC TT (B/HOT) Wulf ~ SchH1 PD1 P1 T1 URO2 CGC TT (B/HOT) Heidi ~ BH CD UCD RN URO1 (B/HOT) Jazz ~ Superpup In Training

03-25-2011, 01:55 PM	#4 (permalink)
carmspack Knighted Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: ontario - Posts: 3,324	herding that the GSD was developed for is not the same herding that everyone automatically thinks of --- . Kirschental is not so much herding as a herding trials or competition dog. What you might be looking for is that really smart old farm dog intelligence . Later this spring I am going to try one of my males out on a mini flock. Carmen Carmspack Working German Shepherd Dogs

03-25-2011, 02:05 PM	#7 (permalink)
Samba Administrator Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: USA Posts: 6,447	My Carmspack Samba very talented on stock. It would be her activity of choice and mine had we any sheepies in nearby counties. First herding judge to evaluate her wanted her.

03-25-2011, 02:18 PM	#9 (permalink)
Emoore Crowned Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: North DFW, TX Posts: 9,214	There are plenty of people that do real farm herding, they're just hard to find if you don't know where to look. They don't go to competitions, they're not active on web forums, they're not breed enthusiasts. They're old guys on farms with livestock. Growing up we always had a couple of border collie/Australian Cattle Dog/Catahoula/whatever mixes that worked the cattle. They were incredibly valuable in getting a cow out of whatever thorn bush or stand of trees she had gotten into that you couldn't follow with a horse or 4-wheeler. They knew how to bring them in to the pen or select one or two out of a herd for you to get into the chute for branding/castrating/etc. They certainly weren't purebred or registered anything, and from what I can remember the young ones learned from the older ones. Nobody took their dogs to herding clinics. They just worked. We got our first one when we traded 400 square bales to another rancher for him. __________________ Rocky vom Backyard- 10 years young Kopper vom Felssclucht Bach - 17 months At the Bridge: Cash van der Animal Shelter 2006-2010

03-25-2011, 02:20 PM	#10 (permalink)
holland Crowned Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 3,630	Contact someone who does herding or has titled one of their dogs in herding

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