To Those of You That Want A Cheap Puppy

[Emoore]

Originally Posted by mycobraracr

Doesn't it all depend on how much work I put into my dog? My Dad is a rocket scientist but I can barely spell as you can see. So I am just a little confused. As for health issues doesn't a lot of that have to do with how you care for your dog?

In a word, no.

Many elements of temperament and health are genetic and have very little to do with raising. Nerve strength, for example, is largely genetic. Whether you have a nervous fearful dog or a strong confident dog has much more to do with genetics than with raising, I have one nervous, fearful dog and one bold, confident dog. Both were bought as puppies and raised in the same household.

With health, there are many health problems such as degenerative myelopathy, bloat, hip dysplasia, elbow displasia, and heart defects which are either totally genetic or have genetic components.

[Falkosmom]

Originally Posted by amaris

tell me about it, we were turned down from 1 rescue because wanting a dog that was good with children (we have frequent young visitors), good with other dogs (street has 5 dogs) and workable with cats, because our neighbours' have gotten out before...was too demanding and made us a hard placement.

I would think that this is what most people expect from their dogs!

other times, we needed GSD experience, didn't matter from where.

I had plenty of GSD experience, especially with HA, nobody cared.

and the last one, the dog was a fit for us and we adored his description and the way he looked...but they wanted a house with another dog at least...

LOL! I was turned down for having another dog!

so now, after spending the last 6 mths working with rescues and being home-approved etc etc only to get turned down RIIIIGHT before they let us adopt, i'm going back to breeders...and if it weren't for my dad be willing to spend on a well-bred, WGSL dog (he loves them), i'm sure my mum would have okayed a BYB dog...slowly educating my parents....slowly but surely :P

I am sorry that you spent so much time working with the rescues only to be turned down. That does not even seem right. It does not take six months to determine whether you are suitable or not.

I find it interesting that you seem to be having bad experiences form rescues as I had, but for totally opposite reasons. When I looked into a rescue, it was about ten years ago, and I have subsequently read repeatedly that rescues have a very high failure rate. I wonder if things have changed since my experience.

[selzer]

Originally Posted by mycobraracr

Please DON'T excuse my ignorance here but, What does a dogs parents being obedience champions or anything like that have to do with a puppy? Doesn't it all depend on how much work I put into my dog? My Dad is a rocket scientist but I can barely spell as you can see. So I am just a little confused. As for health issues doesn't a lot of that have to do with how you care for your dog? I am just trying to learn as well. My current pup is my first not from the pound. She has already proven to be the best dog I have ever had in the sence of eas of training and wanting to learn.

I think that having the breeding dogs achieve some sort of title does make a difference to the buyer, or it should. Well, it tells me something about the dogs, not much but something. It tells me that they were stable enough to go to three separate shows, and perform what they were trained to perform in a ring in the presence of strangers and other dogs. A dog that was seriously human or dog aggressive would be difficult to manage this. And it tells me that the breeder works with their dogs, and cares enough about them to train them or at least have them trained and titled up to a certain level. If they train them themselves, that gives them an excellent understanding of the dog's character, how they learn, etc.

I think it is more important that the bitch be of good temperament than the dog, as she imprints the puppies as well as passes on her genetics.

I do not think titles or lack of titles should be the reason for buying or not buying a pup, but you look at the whole picture: pedigree, conformation, temperament, training, titles, health, instinct, breeder-experience, stud dog choice, and so forth. If you want just a pet, that pet needs good temperament, and needs to be trainable, just as much as someone who wants to raise an obedience dog or a schutzhund dog.

You still need to do your part, socializing, training, leadership, etc. But the difference is taking a pup with that should be able to succeed, and working with it, and getting an excellent pet; or taking a pup that is a complete questionmark, maybe in its genetics no matter how much you try and work with it, it will still be extremely shy, or very dog-aggressive.

[GSDkid]

But I like the fact that they come to me with no shots and no deworming done yet. As well as no papers to say when they were born. For all I know, I could be a mixed breed but I definitely believe the ad when they say pure breed German Shepherd Dog!

On a serious note, I've learned so much on this forum about GSD's as well as dogs in general. I'm not in the market for another GSD yet but will be in the next year or so. Whichever opportunity (adopt or breeder) comes first, I'm taking it.

[Kaz]

I wish shelters were more responsive in LA. I had called and left voice mails and emails to over 4 shelters about potential pups, prior to purchasing Manfred for a king's ransom. I wasnt concerned about saving money, but I wanted to rescue a poor little pup.

NOT ONE shelter replied back.

I was so angry, I left them dirty voice mails like "Shame on you for not helping to make a baby puppy's life more happy!". Finally after that, (and 2 or more weeks after I purchased Manfred), middle aged ladies with outraged voices called me to "get back" at me.

As far as I am concerned, I am not a "breed" fanatic or a training fanatic.

Manfred has one job, to be a cuddly soft toy. It doesnt matter if he is big or small or brown or black.

Yes he does have excellent certified lineage, and hips guaranteed for 2 years, but even if he does get dysplasia, what am I gonna do? Return him for a new pup?

Manfred is family.

When I had a rabbit, and he broke his front teeth and was unable to eat by himself. The vet recommended I put him down. We refused. We fed the rabbit mashed foods for a period of 6 months, before it finally died of natural causes. Pets are family!

[martemchik]

When you really get into training and being around the breed you understand what a well bred shepherd is and what an ok shepherd is. You start really seeing the differences in the lines as soon as you work around different lines. No amount of reading on the forum will truly get you to understand the difference between your dog, and another dog.

As an example, the word drive gets thrown around a lot on the forum, well what can you compare it to? This is my first shepherd, I knew he was working lines, but I couldn't compare him to a different line because I was never around shepherds or even dogs so what amound of drive he had I had no idea. Then I joined a GSD club, full of American lines with a few German show and working lines sprinkled in. Boy did I see the difference between my dog and theirs. And they were bred by good breeders, just different lines.

In a breed as varied as the German Shephed Dog there are many outstanding examples of individual dogs and just as many bad ones. Its kind of sad seeing people that buy a GSD because of the movies and the stories and whatever else comes along with owning the dog, but then quickly realize its not what they expected. Its a nervous, shy, fearful dog. I used to think the same way as you Myco (and I've only had my dog for 15 months), but then you see all these people that have had decades of experience, struggle with dogs that are genetically inept. Those were the people that finally showed me the true worth of a good breeder and the importance of a good lineage.

[mycobraracr]

Thanks, I have a lot to learn! I am very pleased with my puppy. For now that is all I can ask for and do the best I can to be the best owner I can. She has already exceeded my expectations but maybe I didn't have the bar set very high. That is all changing with the research I do. Thanks again for everyones patience with me.

[LaneyB]

I had to adjust my expectations for the price I was going to pay for a puppy. I was planning on paying $500 to $1000 but the breeders I spoke to in that price range were not too impressive (I'm in Michigan). One I spoke with basically said all of her dogs/puppies have the same temperment and just focused on what I would like the dog to look like.

The breeder I am hoping to buy from charges up to $2500 but she has an excellent reputation and when I spoke to her she asked many questions about what I'm looking for in a dog. She told me which of her upcoming litters she thought would be a good match for my family, and went into details about the personality of her dog.

My current dog is a lab that is from a puppy mill (didn't research enough when I got him). He was on sale for $400, reduced from $600 if I bought him that weekend. We have spend probably close to $15,000 over the past 9 years just to keep him going, and we are still shelling out the money. He has a heart of gold, so he's well worth it to us. We always chuckle about what a bargain he has been.

[OriginalWacky]

Originally Posted by LaneyB

My current dog is a lab that is from a puppy mill (didn't research enough when I got him). He was on sale for $400, reduced from $600 if I bought him that weekend. We have spend probably close to $15,000 over the past 9 years just to keep him going, and we are still shelling out the money. He has a heart of gold, so he's well worth it to us. We always chuckle about what a bargain he has been.

I've almost always had rescues, with some of them being purebred dogs, and I have spent a LOT of money that I probably wouldn't have if I'd paid up front for a well-bred dog. (Same with the cats - those "free" ones wind up being super spendy sometimes!) Of course I think they are worth it, but man, I'm kinda happy to have a dog that doesn't need a bunch of (medical) work to start off with.

[Catu]

My list to diferenciate BYB from responsible breeders is not that long.

1) responsible breeders have knowlege of the breed and of how genetic works.

That being said, I'd choose a BYB any time over a breeder who does it for the wrong reasons.