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-   -   What The Breeder Looks For. (http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/choosing-breeder/456778-what-breeder-looks.html)

jafo220 06-03-2014 06:08 PM

What The Breeder Looks For.
 
There have been many discussions on what to look for in a reputable breeder and such. But what do breeders look for in a possible customer? What turns a breeder off of a customer?


I did some searching before getting Cruz. All be it, I got him from a backyard breeder. But I did contact "reputable" breeders also. I was not really turned down by any but I was turned off by one. I WAS like probably most of the general public in wanting to pick my dog out and not have it picked for me. I have since learned things and my next one I would be more open to having a pup matched to me instead of the reverse. I've also learned differences in breeders like the one I got Cruz from and ones I've delt with in the past and some of the reputable breeders here and elsewhere. I've also applied for a rescue but never heard back from them. So I guess you could put that in the rejected category, but I'm not sure why they failed to contact me back, it may be something a innocent as being overlooked. I never pursued it, so it's water under the bridge for me and wouldn't hesitate to try a rescue again.

I'm not really looking for arguments just information to help myself understand a breeders perspective when dealing with potential buyers.

gsdsar 06-03-2014 06:30 PM

Good question. Not being a breeder I can't answer from that POV.

I know with my recent purchase, I pretty much sent a full dog owner CV to the breeder I was interested in, including "references available" part. She called me within 6 hours and we talked for 2.

I have never had a problem getting a dog from a breeding I wanted. But I have not bought a lot of dogs. In my search I found some hilariously long and detailed "applications" that needed to be completed before even talking to the breeder. I generally just bypassed those breeders. Not because I think I would be rejected, but because I knew I could find what I was looking for without the 10 page questionnaire.

I talked to all my breeders extensively before purchasing. Actually talked. I assume they were gathering the information on me they needed and I them.

I have always been honest about my expectations, lifestyle, and needs. I know what I want and what I can handle.

But I am curious what breeders will say.


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jafo220 06-03-2014 10:10 PM

Good response. It brings one perspective to light. You mentioned filling out a questionnaire. That rescue I talked about took me around 40 minutes to fill their questionnaire out. I was that determined to rescue a GSD and then didn't hear anything back. Broke my heart. I've had 4 other GSD's prior and just didn't understand why I didn't even get a response from them. You would have thought they would want their GSD's to go somewhere where someone was familiar with the breed.

I almost pulled the trigger on a breeder in the upper Michigan Peninsula before going to get Cruz. They pretty much had the GSD's I was looking for but time constraint was a factor. I just didn't want the added expense of shipping and the idea my dog was in someone else's hands played a big factor. By the time I get back into the market for another, time should not be a factor. An by cracky, this next time it'll be two dogs and not one. My wife talked me out of two the last two times we purchased.


I hope some breeders can share or are willing to share.

selzer 06-03-2014 10:54 PM

I really am not all that willing to share this. I think people in general can read and research too much, and they find out what the breeder wants to hear and then they tell them what they heard they should tell them, and the wrong dog goes into the wrong hands.

We talk a lot about red flags here. Well, I will tell you, that mostly I judge people and fix yellow flags to a lot of things I hear. Enough yellow flags, and I am not going to sell you a puppy.

I don't have a set of questions, or application for people to fill out. I talk to people on the phone and if you give them enough rope, they will hang themselves. So I talk to them, and listen to them.

There are some that come across like they have been reading the forums for two weeks straight, and those folks, I steer elsewhere. Sorry. They may make great homes. But I'm a little more down to earth, and I want to hear what people think and about their experiences, so I can get a feel for where the pup will be going.

I will ask some leading questions, if they do not bring some topics up, so I can make a decision on what emphasis they put on certain aspects of dog ownership. And then I have to decide whether or not to sell a pup to them. Breeders aren't perfect. We make mistakes too. I expect I have turned people down that didn't deserve it. And didn't turn down people I should have. Sometimes people can talk a good game.

My advice to you, is to talk to breeders honestly, not by what you have read, and what people have told you. Honestly assess your situation, and what you want, and what you need, and what you expect.

The forum probably can teach you how to acquire a particular type of dog from a breeder, but it might be the kind of dog that the forum members want and need, and not the kind of dog you want and can manage in your situation.

jafo220 06-04-2014 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by selzer (Post 5598322)
I really am not all that willing to share this. I think people in general can read and research too much, and they find out what the breeder wants to hear and then they tell them what they heard they should tell them, and the wrong dog goes into the wrong hands.

We talk a lot about red flags here. Well, I will tell you, that mostly I judge people and fix yellow flags to a lot of things I hear. Enough yellow flags, and I am not going to sell you a puppy.

I don't have a set of questions, or application for people to fill out. I talk to people on the phone and if you give them enough rope, they will hang themselves. So I talk to them, and listen to them.

There are some that come across like they have been reading the forums for two weeks straight, and those folks, I steer elsewhere. Sorry. They may make great homes. But I'm a little more down to earth, and I want to hear what people think and about their experiences, so I can get a feel for where the pup will be going.

I will ask some leading questions, if they do not bring some topics up, so I can make a decision on what emphasis they put on certain aspects of dog ownership. And then I have to decide whether or not to sell a pup to them. Breeders aren't perfect. We make mistakes too. I expect I have turned people down that didn't deserve it. And didn't turn down people I should have. Sometimes people can talk a good game.

My advice to you, is to talk to breeders honestly, not by what you have read, and what people have told you. Honestly assess your situation, and what you want, and what you need, and what you expect.

The forum probably can teach you how to acquire a particular type of dog from a breeder, but it might be the kind of dog that the forum members want and need, and not the kind of dog you want and can manage in your situation.

I want to be clear here. I formed this thread for general information. Not a blue print on what to say to a breeder to pass any formal interview to get a dog out of them. If they don't buy from a reputable breeder, you know where they go next...... a BYB, and thats what many preach against at length here.

I am not looking to buy right now. I am interested in what some of the biggest reasons are that breeders reject a buyer. What are breeders are looking for.

I understand your point for not being forthcoming about that info. But I'm beginning to understand where the "secrecy" aspect surrounding dog breeding is coming from.

Thanks for your input.

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dawnandjr 06-04-2014 09:12 AM

I have had two pups returned to me as adult dogs. Both situations the dogs were not raised as they should have been. These are working line GSD's. Not to say other lines would be any different. Owners were instructed to get into training classes. They did not. Both came back at different ages. Supposedly out of control and untrainable. The first dog that came back was a male. Person that originally purchased the dog, no longer in the picture. The dog was living with the dad and stepmom. Stepmom did her best, but since she was not familiar with working line GSD's, she had no clue. She was not to blame, but tried. Claimed she could not train the dog and he had no food motivation. She raises puppies for guiding eyes. Labs are not GSD's. I had this dog trained to touch, with food reward, in about 15 mins. He is now a police K9. Other dog was taken to training classes after problems started to show up. They did not try their best to correct their mistakes. They have a tiny fluffy dog now. So now I have to screen people better. I must insist on training classes. I must insist on knowing your knowledge base. I must insist on knowing your home environment. (One of the dogs was allowed to roam where ever she wanted and got aggressive with the neighbors). Breeders learn from past experiences. Dont think they are trying to play God. They are trying to make the best decision's for their puppies as they can without living right next door to every puppy buyer. A breeder friend sold a puppy to someone who she shouldnt have. They buyer knew all the right answers. This GSD is now a puppy factory, and the breeder has to live with that. The pup was placed on AKC limited, but we all know that registry that will take anyone with money and people buy puppies without knowing it was made by people that didnt want to title and health check their puppies. And they make it sound legit (CKC) by using the same initials as another registry. Some one that posts on here and asks good questions would be fine with me. Some one that is willing to give references and wants to ask me lots of questions too. Maybe not so much the person that went to the first set of training classes with their pup (6 classes) and then stopped because they didnt think they needed to continue. I think going to classes for the first year you have the dog (pup) is minimum. By then you have several skills and will know how to work through problems that my arise (or at least have a resource to go to as well). That is a critical foundation for the rest of the dogs life. Should the need arise for me to take the dog back, for what ever reason, the dog will be better off having gone through additional training.

Yoshi 06-04-2014 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dawnandjr (Post 5599338)
I have had two pups returned to me as adult dogs. Both situations the dogs were not raised as they should have been. These are working line GSD's. Not to say other lines would be any different. Owners were instructed to get into training classes. They did not. Both came back at different ages. Supposedly out of control and untrainable. The first dog that came back was a male. Person that originally purchased the dog, no longer in the picture. The dog was living with the dad and stepmom. Stepmom did her best, but since she was not familiar with working line GSD's, she had no clue. She was not to blame, but tried. Claimed she could not train the dog and he had no food motivation. She raises puppies for guiding eyes. Labs are not GSD's. I had this dog trained to touch, with food reward, in about 15 mins. He is now a police K9. Other dog was taken to training classes after problems started to show up. They did not try their best to correct their mistakes. They have a tiny fluffy dog now. So now I have to screen people better. I must insist on training classes. I must insist on knowing your knowledge base. I must insist on knowing your home environment. (One of the dogs was allowed to roam where ever she wanted and got aggressive with the neighbors). Breeders learn from past experiences. Dont think they are trying to play God. They are trying to make the best decision's for their puppies as they can without living right next door to every puppy buyer. A breeder friend sold a puppy to someone who she shouldnt have. They buyer knew all the right answers. This GSD is now a puppy factory, and the breeder has to live with that. The pup was placed on AKC limited, but we all know that registry that will take anyone with money and people buy puppies without knowing it was made by people that didnt want to title and health check their puppies. And they make it sound legit (CKC) by using the same initials as another registry. Some one that posts on here and asks good questions would be fine with me. Some one that is willing to give references and wants to ask me lots of questions too. Maybe not so much the person that went to the first set of training classes with their pup (6 classes) and then stopped because they didnt think they needed to continue. I think going to classes for the first year you have the dog (pup) is minimum. By then you have several skills and will know how to work through problems that my arise (or at least have a resource to go to as well). That is a critical foundation for the rest of the dogs life. Should the need arise for me to take the dog back, for what ever reason, the dog will be better off having gone through additional training.

This is a very interesting topic. I didn't know that such people "who would tell the breeder everything they wanted to hear" were out there. Although I do remember when I contacted a breeder and I told them what I was looking for such as "easily trainable" that they told me "yes, our dogs are easily trainable but it also depends on the trainer because some people claim that they are world class trainers when they have never taught their dog to sit before"! It must be hard trying to pick good homes for the pups. But I would just like to add, that not everyone has to go to training classes to raise a well mannered dog. Some people may live too far away as well. :)

Yoshi 06-04-2014 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gsdsar (Post 5597402)
Good question. Not being a breeder I can't answer from that POV.

I know with my recent purchase, I pretty much sent a full dog owner CV to the breeder I was interested in, including "references available" part. She called me within 6 hours and we talked for 2.

I have never had a problem getting a dog from a breeding I wanted. But I have not bought a lot of dogs. In my search I found some hilariously long and detailed "applications" that needed to be completed before even talking to the breeder. I generally just bypassed those breeders. Not because I think I would be rejected, but because I knew I could find what I was looking for without the 10 page questionnaire.

I talked to all my breeders extensively before purchasing. Actually talked. I assume they were gathering the information on me they needed and I them.

I have always been honest about my expectations, lifestyle, and needs. I kn
But I am curious what breeders will say.


ow what I want and what I can handle.
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Arhg, I really dislike those lengthy puppy application forms as well. Such questions;

"Do you have a fenced in yard?"

Well of course you would! Why would you get a dog if you didn't have a fenced in yard!

"Do you rent and if so are you permitted to have pets?"

Why on earth would I get a dog if I rented and was not permitted to have pets?? :confused:

"Do you have cats/dogs/birds/whatever? How many? What breed? Genders?"

I don't need an application form to tell the breeder that I have other animals. I would tell them anyway.

"How many dogs you had in the past five years?"

"Who do you work for?"

That is just personal.

"Are you married? Do you have children?"

Also personal in the marriage section.

"How long you have lived at your current address?"

Not sure what this has to do with owning a dog? :confused:

Most of these questions to me just seem to be questioning a puppy buyer's commonsense. I am sure that if we are going to pay $1500+ for a dog that we would have done our research, right? Perhaps I am being naive here? I am not knowledgeable of these bad puppy buyer stories.

lhczth 06-04-2014 10:04 AM

I am one of those that has a rather long questionnaire. You make a few mistakes in placements over the years you start looking for more extensive ways to screen people. Some I do talk to on the phone first or I have had a few send me a pretty extensive first contact email so all I have to do is fill in some empty information. Buyers know how to lie, many embellish the facts a bit or have dreams of what they want without the experience. After one bad experience last year I was almost tempted to ask people to send me videos of how they trained their previous dogs. :eek: People are very good at misrepresenting themselves.

Breeders that breed infrequently, who give a darn about where their pups go, and who don't feel the need to sell pups ASAP tend to screen the most.

One thing, if you actually want a breeder to respond to you, do not send an email stating, "how much are your Shepard puppies?" and don't ask questions when the answers are clearly on the breeder's website. Why would I want to take time to talk to someone who is too lazy to do a little research on their own? I also hate form letters.

lhczth 06-04-2014 10:12 AM

Many questions on a questionnaire are there because at some point a breeder ran into a situation that warranted the question. No fenced yard and the puppy died. Husband thinks getting a puppy is a great idea for a gift and the wife is NOT happy so the pup is returned or becomes an outside dog on a chain. People rent, don't tell the landlord, the latter finds out and the pup has to be returned or a new home found (or worse, dumped at the shelter, and, yes, people dump expensive dogs too). There are a lot of examples.


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