breeder red flag? - Page 4 - German Shepherd Dog Forums

Increase font size: 0, 10, 25, 50%

GermanShepherds.com is the premier German Shepherd Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 02-03-2013, 12:47 AM   #31 (permalink)
Crowned Member
 
selzer's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Denmark, Ohio
Posts: 26,806
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by carmspack View Post
also remember that the due date is not a singular day . A female may be bred over a 5 day period -- had one happy female that would stand almost the entire 21 days of the cycle - you witness a tie , you figure out when those pups are due. Anyway even at best the gestation time is 60 to 63 days , then figure out if conception was on day one or the last time you had a tie , and then the semen has a survivability of 48 hrs(?) so conception again is not the date of the tie .

You may have in some cases a litter that may be born a week later than expected by calendar estimation.
O C'mon Carmen, everyone knows that breeders should take their bitches in multiple times and have their blood tested mutliple times to pinpoint the exact day of ovulation. Then that can add 63 days to that, and they can then schedule the day off, and tell all their prospective puppy buyers when the pups are due.

At about 4 weeks they just must do an ultrasound to ensure that conception has taken place and there are puppies. It won't tell you the number or sex though, but you might as well contact puppy buyers with that information at well. If the bitch contracts something while at the vet and loses the litter, well tough luck, it is just so much more important that we have that information for the puppy buyers that are going to split or get a puppy elsewhere before these guys are ready to go anyway.

Because we don't know how many yet, we should go ahead and take her back to the vet at about 8 weeks along to get a count. Puppy buyers will want to know this too, even though, again they will not know if they are males or females either, and they will not even know if the count is accurate, but, what the hey, get her x-rayed and expose her to the vet again, and x-rays again.

And, just because your bitch was pregnant, doesn't mean she stayed pregnant. Bitches can resorb puppies for a number of weeks.

It is nature. It happens. I generally wait a week before contacting, though I have only lost pups once after the first day. That first week though is always kind of nerve-racking.
__________________
Jenna, RN CGC & Babs, CD RA CGC HIC
Heidi, RA CGC
SG3 Odessa, SchH1, Kkl1, AD
Ninja, RN CGC & Milla, RN CGC
Joy, Star Puppy, RN CGC
Dolly CGC & Bear CGC
Hepzibah
selzer is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 02-03-2013, 12:52 AM   #32 (permalink)
Elite Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,400
Send a message via AIM to VaBeachFamily Send a message via Yahoo to VaBeachFamily
Default

Deposits seems to be a huge personal preference. I know breeders that do 10% down, up to 50% down. I don't know any that take deposits before birth. I know one woman that offers them up for sale at 2 weeks, but will not consider a puppy sold until it is payed for, so you can pay all up front, and she will make sure the contract is there, but if something happens to the pup, she will refund 100%. Then, the refundable part.. some offer no refund, no NOTHING, while some offer to move it to another litter, and others offer to pay it back... it's all a matter of each person. I think if it were I , I would just take a percentage, non refundable, with an option for next litter, but not an option to hold past the NEXT litter. After that it is forfeited.
VaBeachFamily is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-03-2013, 10:13 AM   #33 (permalink)
Administrator & LOTR Addict
 
lhczth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Michigan, USA
Posts: 16,365
Default

Then you have the other option. I just don't take deposits. If someone decides to move on then so be it.
__________________
Lisa Clark

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Vala SchH3 AWD1 FH2 CGC B/HOT, SG1 Deja IPO3 AWD1 KKL1 B/HOT, SG Elena BH AD CGC B/HOT, LB (the ugly little sable) B/HOT, Donovan IPO1 TR2 AD, and gone but not forgotten, Nike SchH1 OB1 TR3 AD CGC HOT, Treue SchH3 CD CGC HOT




lhczth is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-03-2013, 11:44 AM   #34 (permalink)
Knighted Member
 
sit,stay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Idaho
Posts: 3,261
Default

I don't think the quality or repute of a breeder can be ascertained through answering the question of whether or not they accept deposits. Or by how aggressively/expensively they investigate the status of the supposed pregnancy.

But I surely do believe that an ethical, reputable breeder will NOT wait for those who have given deposits to contact them for updates to share the news that there is no litter. And I also believe that an ethical, reputable breeder would also honor the contracted purchase price and offer at least one comparable replacement option at that contracted purchase price.

After all, if you (the universal breeder "you") insist on following the letter of the contract that says no refunds ever, then all aspects of that contract should be followed, including the purchase price. Picking and choosing which aspects of a contract you'll follow in the case of a problem stinks.
Sheilah
sit,stay is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-03-2013, 02:02 PM   #35 (permalink)
Junior Member
 
Noles20's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 31
Default

I don't know anything about breeding dogs but I do know a lot about communication. A good communicator considers how the message will be received. In this case, while it may have seemed normal to the breeder that the dog was not pregnant, to the buyer, this might not make sense at all. It would have been helpful for the breeder to offer the buyer some kind of explanation. If he/she can educate the buyer and help it make sense to him/her, both parites would benefit. Failing to do this does not make the breeder a bad breeder at all. My 2 cents.
Noles20 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-04-2013, 09:04 AM   #36 (permalink)
Elite Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,400
Send a message via AIM to VaBeachFamily Send a message via Yahoo to VaBeachFamily
Default

Lisa... do you not accept anything to hold until the pups are old enough to go home?
VaBeachFamily is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-04-2013, 09:49 AM   #37 (permalink)
Administrator & LOTR Addict
 
lhczth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Michigan, USA
Posts: 16,365
Default

Nope. I took a deposit once because she was insistent. I actually have only had one person back out and it was due to extenuating circumstances. I never want a buyer to feel like they are obligated to get a pup nor do I ever want to feel like I am obligated to sell a pup. I am always more than willing to keep back puppies for as long as needed. There is a market for started young dogs with prelims so I don't worry about being "stuck" with a puppy.
__________________
Lisa Clark

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Vala SchH3 AWD1 FH2 CGC B/HOT, SG1 Deja IPO3 AWD1 KKL1 B/HOT, SG Elena BH AD CGC B/HOT, LB (the ugly little sable) B/HOT, Donovan IPO1 TR2 AD, and gone but not forgotten, Nike SchH1 OB1 TR3 AD CGC HOT, Treue SchH3 CD CGC HOT




lhczth is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-04-2013, 10:10 AM   #38 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 5,121
Default

After reading some "horror" stories about what happens when someone picks a breeder, puts down a deposit to go on a waiting list for a puppy, and then have to wait a year or more for their turn to finally come up...I don't know if I'd ever do something like that. Mostly because I can't plan a year ahead, and with something like a puppy its tough to just sit around and wait for that phone call that your turn is finally up.

Too many breeders out there that regular people can purchase from that would give you a very solid puppy. For those looking for a particular line or a particular grandparent/parent...then yes...you might have to search the one breeder out that has that, but for the rest of us its pretty crazy to put down a deposit and then not really know when you'll get a dog.

My current dog...I put down a deposit but it was after the pups were born and on the ground. My next dog...I'm dealing with a club member and good friend so I don't think a deposit will be necessary. Plus if I do have to back out for any reason, she'll find a home for this dog before I get done telling her that I can't take her.
martemchik is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-04-2013, 03:31 PM   #39 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 255
Default breeder red flag?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Noles20 View Post
I don't know anything about breeding dogs but I do know a lot about communication. A good communicator considers how the message will be received. In this case, while it may have seemed normal to the breeder that the dog was not pregnant, to the buyer, this might not make sense at all. It would have been helpful for the breeder to offer the buyer some kind of explanation. If he/she can educate the buyer and help it make sense to him/her, both parites would benefit. Failing to do this does not make the breeder a bad breeder at all. My 2 cents.
Nicely said,
Professionals in any field sometimes take things for granted and in there mind instantly chalk it up as a "given" and unintentionally forget that not everyone knows as much as they do on the subject. I am guilty of this as well as other professionals in any field. Sometimes we just unintentionally disregard the competency level of who we are speaking with.


Sent from Petguide.com Free App
SFGSSD is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-04-2013, 06:59 PM   #40 (permalink)
Crowned Member
 
Dainerra's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: N. Central Arkansas
Posts: 5,746
Send a message via Yahoo to Dainerra
Default

You should also remember that the breeder might have been very upset about losing the litter and didn't want to draw out their own pain with a long explanation of what happened. Or it could have been a grisly or sad story that they didn't think that others would want to hear the details of.
As others have said, it could have been that they thought there was a litter until the due date.
"There are no puppies. I'm sorry" is really all of the answer they might have been up to giving at the time...
Dainerra is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply



Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the German Shepherd Dog Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:
Security Question
While balancing on a piece of wood, two inches by four inches known as a 2x4, john and his friend sally both spotted a dalmatian inside a truck with sirens, headed to put out a fire. State what the 2x4 is made of.

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:34 PM.



Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SEO by vBSEO 3.3.2
PetGuide.com
Basset Hound Forum Doberman Forum Golden Retriever Forum Beagle Forum
Boxer Forum Dog Forum Pit Bull Forum Poodle Forum
Bulldog Forum Fish Forum Havanese Forum Maltese Forum
Cat Forum German Shepherd Forum Labradoodle Forum Yorkie Forum Hedgehog Forum
Chihuahua Forum Retriever Breeds Cichlid Forum Dart Frog Forum Mice Breeder Forum