A Couple of General Breeder Questions

[eric83]

I'm pretty new to the website, and have been digging through old threads and soaking up information as much as I can, but now I have a few questions that I hadn't seen answered directly, if they have been I do apologize.

We aren't yet ready for a puppy, I won't be looking to actually add a puppy to our family until early 2013 or at the very earliest late late next year. I have been researching for about six months now, and have pretty much settled on this breed hence why I joined

So my questions are -- when should I be making actual contact with breeders? I'm really not sure how to go about this...my fiancee's two collies were all her deal and pretty much came with her. My BC was a gift from my parents when I was young so the breeder aspect of things is really uncharted territory for me.

The next aspect I'm pretty stumped on is what "type" of breeder I should be looking for -- I'm not myself interested in schutzhund, but I am interested in agility, competition obedience, and we have a pretty good Rally community here also. From what I've read I'm fairly certain I want a working-lines dog but also from what I've seen it seems like working lines breeders are going to want their dogs with drive to be going to a schutzhund home? Perhaps I'm mistaken.

As far as the type of drive I want in a puppy -- medium-high is what I would want. My border collie was VERY high drive, which I absolutely adored, we were really partners in all we did. I'm sure that the GSD drive is displayed in a much different manner, but the focus I got from the BC was awesome, it was the lack of velcro-ness and lack of personal loyalty that I didn't really enjoy.

My other concern was aloofness, I had spoken to someone at a schutzhund competition I had attended and he had said that the working line dogs were generally more aloof. (This theory seems to be laughable here however so I'm not sure how much of a concern this really is)

So I'm a bit stumped at the moment with those two questions. Hoping I can get some advice/guidance here on what my next steps are if there are any steps to be taken yet and where I should be looking as far as breeders go.

Thank you in advance!!

[JakodaCD OA]

If you've lived with a BC a gsd should be a piece of cake

As for aloofness, it is normally aloofness to strangers/non family members , otherwise they tend to be very velcro and 'into' their family.

It's always a GOOD thing to start looking and contacting breeders early vs last minute, you can get a feel of whats out there, keep a list and go from there.

and definately NOT do all working line breeders want their dogs in schutzhund homes.
Good homes that are active yes, but not necessarily to do schutzhund.

It might help if you list your general location, people could give breeder suggestions that you could check out.

[eric83]

That's what I've been hearing -- that the aloofness was with strangers, I'm very okay with that, and I would say that I prefer a dog to be that way. My BC was aloof with strangers, but also not very "into" his family either. It's the same way with my Fiancee's two Collies, they are nice dogs, and will accept affection, but they are VERY boring...way too laid back, they don't solicit attention etc. Affection is something that they could take or leave. (which is perfect for my Fiancee but terrible for me). That's what I don't want to end up with.

We're in central Indiana, we'd prefer to have a breeder within driving distance so that we can actually go "see" the litter etc, but if the perfect match for us is across the country we wouldn't pass up that option either. I'm a bit of a lover of long trips so driving distance for me is certainly any of the surrounding states and most of their border states within reason.

As far as an active home -- I can certainly offer that. We were members of our disc dog club with the BC, but we're also a hop-skip-and-a-jump away from an agility facility. And I'm just active with our dogs anyway, I'm former military so I'm go-go-go...her collies are not amused haha.

[dawnandjr]

Aloof with strangers is what it means. And I first want my puppies to go loving, forever homes, before a working home. But a working home (obedience, agility, schutzhund) is just icing on the cake. I recently had to rehome a 2 yr old male from my first litter. He was in a home with adult couch potatoes (relatives of original purchaser), and 3 young children. Dog was a little out of control, but very willing to learn and work. He now has a job to do. Sounds like the working line will be perfect for you. Velcro dogs, ready to work, want to spend as much time with you as possible, bed hogs, guardians, clown in a dog costume. I would look for someone that breeds on the smaller end of the standard too. I would say you would want a dog that is 20 to 24 inches at the wither, and not more than 75lbs. Would be better on the dogs body, and do better in the disciplines you want to do. You have already visited some of the places, but I would start going more. See who has shepherds and what breeders they come from. Could be one in your area already that has what you are looking for.

[Liesje]

If you are interested in activities like agility I think most working like breeders would be happy to sell you a puppy. Many if not most litters are not only SchH prospects. Good working line breeders often have great dogs that are more suited for an active family and other performance events than SchH or police work so I don't think you will have trouble finding a good breeder.

Given your location the first breeders that come to mind are Wildhaus in southeast Michigan, Sportwaffen in Indy, and Geistwasser in northern Illinois. There are several members on this board who have dogs from each of these kennels. I have a Geistwasser puppy and I know several of their dogs do agility. I will probably do it too after SchH (my puppy was a SchH prospect but most of his litter was sold to active pet homes or for obedience, agility, etc).

[eric83]

Very happy to hear that there doesn't seem to be discrimination on the "type" of sport you're involved in.

Certainly first and foremost I want a GSD for companionship, but also to fulfill that need for an active dog in my life to do things with. I have a pretty dog friendly lifestyle, for example I do a lot of driving out of the office for work and on those days I always liked to bring my BC before he passed.

And yes that does sound like what I would be looking for, dawnandjr. I always like my dogs a little lighter/smaller just because they normally are quicker on their feet, land softer, and are just easier to lug around

I have seen the website for the Wildhaus dogs, someone on this forum I believe had one and was in the agility forums and I got curious. They're dogs looks very very nice. I believe their name was also thrown around the last time I was up at a schutzhund meeting. Unfortunately the GSD is pretty unrepresented here at the agility venues that are near here, they are pretty over run with aussies, bc's, shelties, etc.

[Liesje]

With GSDs I think size is one thing to consider. I have a male showline and a male working line and both were the smallest males in their litters. I ask for a smaller, short coupled dog (assuming there is one that meets my needs as far as temperament). So far this hasn't been an issue b/c most people are wanting a larger, substantial dog. My female GSD is only 50lbs and she did agility too. Her son is very good too but bigger than her (larger sire). If I know I'm going to be doing activities like agility and flyball I ask for a smaller, compact, and medium boned dog. I am glad I mentioned this b/c when I got my working line puppy it was between two dogs with very similar temperament. As an aside, I mentioned to the breeder that I was not obsessed with large size, and that led her to pick the smaller of the two males for me. Now at 10 months, the other pick is 15lbs more than my puppy.

[eric83]

Wow, that's interesting the amount of size variation between the bloodlines, and just individuals. I have noticed that between males and females there's a larger difference in GSDs than in BCs.

I suppose more would want a more "solid" substantially larger dog in this breed -- hopefully that will turn out to work to my benefit the way it has for you as well. I will be sure to take a look at those kennels that you have mentioned. Being border states all of those would be drive-able for me when it came to that point.

Do you have a preference between male or female when choosing for a sport such as agility/flyball? I know the size difference would make the females lighter generally, but I know in BCs I preferred to work with males just because it was generally the easier route to take...they are easier to convince that what you're doing is worth doing haha.

[Liesje]

In general I prefer males. I like the way they look and act. Also I don't have the patience to deal with heat cycles, since I don't breed, and I'm not an advocate of early spay/neuter. I'm not sure if there's really a difference as far as training, I just prefer males.

[Andaka]

But if you are interested in sports such as flyball and agility, you might consider that a smaller dogs may be faster and easier to turn on the course.