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What would you do if your GSD killed another of your pets? (moved from chat)

10K views 92 replies 40 participants last post by  pets4life 
#1 ·
Just wondering overall. I have 2 cats and 2 dogs. I am very bonded with all of them in different ways. I'm not sure what I would do if ever Gunther killed one of them. So I'm wondering, what would YOU do if your GSD ever killed another one of your pets. Whether accidentally or on purpose, would you be able to forgive and move on? Would you rehome the dog? Would you ever be able to look at the dog the same?
 
#40 ·
Ok, so say the dogs have always gotten along, for years they have been the best of friends, then one day, while you are home in another room, your dog kills your other dog, how would you have prevented that? By keeping them apart for their whole lives? By stalking their every move?
 
#48 ·
For me I think it would depend on the circumstances honestly. If it was in my control to prevent, I would be upset I let it happen even if it was a freak accident. If it was 100% out of the ordinary I would probably get him medically screened for anything neurological things.

But I probably would have a hard time seeing him that way regardless, and not sure how I'd act after the fact.. unfortunately.. :(
 
#50 ·
I have 4 chickens that are free range in the backyard. Fiona is good with them, but steals their eggs. When she steals eggs, I withhold play with the flirt pole and tell her that we won't play again until the egg turns up. Magically within 24 hours the egg shows up.

If she killed a chicken, I would just get another one or two. "Shrug"
 
#51 ·
In that case I would rehome the trouble maker to a home without any other dogs/pets.
I refuse to live in disharmony, just because of a mismatch. It is not fair to the dogs or humans. Even though they maybe safe from attack, there is still stress and anxiety and that influences everything in the house (in my case).
I got a taste of that when I got a foster dog that went into heat and my male dogs started fighting. Never again. After rehoming her (faster than I normally would have), peace returned.
 
#53 ·
Heres another scenes. My son has 2 dogs, 1 GSD, Willy, and a small foo foo dog, Sophie. He also has 2 chickens and a rabbit. Chickens and rabbit live in another part of the yard, fences in. My daughter in law failed to latch the gate properly, Willy killed the bunny.
Who's at fault? This happened 2 weeks ago.
 
#58 ·
I think it happened because he had a screw loose, literally. You can't fix broken. Dogs with genetic temperament problems are simply that, broken.[/QUOTE]

I agree with this.... for extreme cases.

I would never put a dog down that was workable and just needed the proper training and behavior modification to live a life that was safe for it and those around it. If however these methods were not working I would.
 
#66 ·
I think it happened because he had a screw loose, literally. You can't fix broken. Dogs with genetic temperament problems are simply that, broken.
I agree with this.... for extreme cases.

I would never put a dog down that was workable and just needed the proper training and behavior modification to live a life that was safe for it and those around it. If however these methods were not working I would.[/QUOTE]

Exactly my point. A fearful dog will always be skittish and somewhat fearful. It's simply how they can be trained and managed. If an aggressive dog is managed ok in the home then there is no need for euthanasia. If that dog can no longer be managed in the home, then what other choice is there?
 
#59 ·
We had a pot bellied pig that lived in peace with 4 Aussies for over 5 years. Then one day, the Aussies changed their minds.

My sister had a cockatiel that was in her cage in their house. This bird had free range of the house when they were home. They put her up when they were gone. Their mixed breed house dog lived with the bird for years. The bird would walk on the dog. The dog ignored the bird. One day my sister came home from grocery shopping and the dog got onto the couch, jumped on the hanging bird cage, pulled it over, ravaged the cage until the bird was out and ate the bird. The only evidence was a mess of feathers and a mauled cage.

Stuff happens. Even with your best intentions and with your best laid out plans. Stuff just happens.
 
#62 ·
I also agree with the first response. It is my job to keep my pack of animals safe and controlled. I cannot expect to own dogs who are bred for prey drive and aggression to not display what they are bred for. Many gsds, if not raised with cats, are cat killers. Mine are raised with cats. They sleep, groom and share their food with each other. Every one co exists wonderfully. However, whenever I leave a dog loose in my house, I am accepting the fact that things could happen. Maybe a cat gets its nail caught in the rug (which is my fault for not cutting them in time), panics, starts to freak out, dog gets interested, cat freaks out more, prey instinct kicks in and what do you know? My beautiful cat loving dog who has never before displayed any sort of aggression just killed one of my cats out of the blue. They are dogs and will react to instinct. I cannot expect any differently of them. I either set them up for complete success by making sure all animals are together only when supervised, or I do as most of the general population does; assume nothing will ever happen.
I did have one of my dogs kill a beloved pet rat once. I was devastated and of course mad at my dog for killing my pet but I couldn't blame her. As far as I see it dogs view our small pets much the same as squirrels, rabbits and other wildlife which we seem to be just fine with our dogs wanting to kill.
 
#64 ·
Your post made me chuckle....for two reasons...one being your point exactly and secondly...it doesn't take much to get a GSD to show it's prey drive with detected motion as you certainly know.

My take away from your appreciated post is....the nature of the beast.

SuperG
 
#71 ·
The first GSD I ever knew was brought into the animal control where I was a kid volunteer, he was to be euthanized. He was a beautiful silvery black dog that was a working farm dog whose job was sheep and dairy cow herding. One night he went on a killing spree with his 2 year old son and killed lambs on his farm and the neighbors. Never ever showed any behavior like that before. Both of them were pts, it wasn't tolerated. The guy that owned them was matter of fact, but sad. Great dog, switch flipped. I, of course being a kid, was horrified. A year earlier I witnessed a retriever kill her 8 pups, she was in a frenzy. It was so bizarre to me. Again, it seemed like the switch just flipped. Who knows why? It just seems to happen with some dogs.
 
#74 ·
So I had typed out this laborious post yesterday on the topic about how pregnant females might kill a cat or other critter, especially an outdoor cat, and it may be some type of seek and destroy mission that the hormones give her at that time to prepare for the safety of her pups -- anything that might be a threat has to go.

And, of course, intact females might decide they hate each other. Bitches fight for breathing rights, and all that.

Other than that GSDs can learn to live with other critters, etc.

And then I just backed out of the post, as it really didn't need to be said.

Then I went home.

Babs was barfy so I had put her in the outdoor kennel after cleaning up the bathroom, my bed, and the study yesterday morning, so I took Heidi with me, and decided to get her groomed while I went to work for a few hours. Jenna had something going on and was at the vet the day before, and I had her in the in/out so I could give her meds. Moofie was in the other in/out, and Heidi was so clean and good smelling, I thought I would just keep her in for the night.

The worst thing, is I noticed her tail go up as she sniffed through the baby gate at Jenna.

When I went down there to give Jenna her meds, she slipped through the baby gate with me and attacked.

I got her back through the gate, but their jaws were locked onto each other, and it was like a blood bath in there. Given the opportunity, one would have killed the other last night. Jenna is my alpha bitch. But being under the weather, and nine years old, Heidi thought it was a good time to overthrow the queen.

The thing is, Jenna rarely fights or snarls or anything with anyone. But if someone does start something with her, which has happened once or twice, she finishes it. She carries herself as an alpha, and everyone just accepts it. Heidi got the worst of it. Her face is all swelled up. I'm giving her cephalexin.

This isn't dog aggression -- Heidi was at the groomers with scads of dogs yesterday, and Jenna has no problems with outside dogs. This is same-sex inter-pack aggression, and those of us who want to keep multiples of the same sex, intact, have to manage them. And if we slip up in that, as I did yesterday, then we really cannot blame, punish, or kill the dog.

Well, we can.

If the dog has an issue, and is no longer useful to us. And we want to free up space or time for youngsters that we care more about, that we might have a use for. But then, we should call it like it is, the bitch is old, or has XYZ condition, can't use her for breeding, can't work, time to go see the vet. Killing a dog or bitch because we cannot manage some of the very traits that we want to see in them, is pretty low.

That is mostly for people choosing to keep intact dogs for work or breeding. Pet owners should really think long and hard when they want to bring in another dog that is the same sex. They need to know the general disposition of the dog they have, and maybe put a number of years between them. If their current bitch is an strong (dominant to other dogs) 8 year old female, and they have a four year old male, they might be ok getting another young female, If she is happy to be a follower, all can go superbly. But they need to be prepared with a plan in case it doesn't work out when the youngster reaches sexual maturity. Playing musical crates or kennels forever isn't what most pet owners want to deal with. And, rehoming one of them may be best for everyone involved including the critters.

So how do I feel toward the bitches I had for 8 and 9 years that just tried to kill each other? I love them. I feel sorry that I didn't prevent what happened. I know exactly how bad it looks and feels when a dog you love is trying to kill another dog you love. I think that if we anthropomorphize them, we can feel hurt, and angry, and may want to put one of them down. When we see them as another species, whose instincts and drives and characters are only partly understood by us, we are more likely to feel disgusted and angry with ourselves, and feel bad that our dog now is in pain, is going to have some scars, needs to take meds or have their face shaved.
 
#75 · (Edited)
The other day when I came home from lunch Robyn (3 yr old GSD) decided to challenge Misty(10 yr old Samoyed). Before I knew it they were in a fight, not a bad fight but an unexpected one. I don't even think they got to touch each other because I grabbed both of them. Misty kept trying to get at Robyn for a minute. I was real hesitant about leaving them alone together and I watched them for the next 20 minutes. Robyn approached Misty and kissed her, Misty was ok with that. After work Midnite was bothering Misty and she went for him, he ran as fast as he could to get away. Later on Misty threw up, so I knew she wasn't feeling well, her outbursts were completely abnormal. All we can do as owners is pay attention to them and watch their behavior. We rarely have any disagreements here, but they can happen. I have no problem breaking up a fight and I'm always ready for that. With a large group you have to be. Today Misty and Robyn are playing and hanging out together like nothing ever happened. I'll have to watch those two, Misty let's Robyn take charge most of the time these days but Misty hasn't given up total control and it's almost like she us training Robyn.
 
#76 ·
My other post disappeared or my eyes are blinded to it. I have 4 chickens that free range in the backyard. I trust Fiona with them. She does steal their eggs. If she killed a chicken, I would buy another one or two. "Shrug".

She has a prey drive that we use with the flirt pole. I hope that is enough to satisfy her drive.

However, like Sue said, two bitches wake up one day hating each other. I have Fiona and my mother has Gilda. Fiona and Gilda were born together. They loved each other and played with each other until one day, Gilda decided she wanted to kill her sister. We have had a few fights with blood and Gilda needing surgery.

But if one of them killed the other (if given the chance they would) I would be angry at myself or my mom. They only fight when one of us is lax and does not keep the dog under leash control. We have them separated by a baby gate and keeping them out of sight of one another with the kitchen as the buffer between the two. The breeder told me this would happen, because they will both fight for alpha. I chose to take the risk, so totally my fault.
 
#80 ·
I had a wolf/malamute hybrid as a kid. She was 130 lbs post litter when we got her and not overweight. Great dog, i was 7-12 years old and she never got aggressive with me or anything. She ate our parakeet, tore the cage off the cieling and the room was full of feathers. She ate my guinea pig, tore the top of the cage off, RIP Porky. Then she half ate the neighbors yappy dog. RIP Cinnamon, they told me they sent her to a farm...
 
#81 ·
My buddy had 2 malamutes ...giant fricking dogs...He lived in the country/woods. They would come back with a deer leg on occasion...never knew if they ran it down or just found a dead one.

But...those dogs had some prey drive. I remember one of them coming back with a mouthful of porcupine quills...really wicked...deep back in it's mouth. We tended to the dog and then found the dead porcupine...blew me away that the dog didn't stop while he was behind.....strong ...very strong urge/drive I guess.

SuperG
 
#82 ·
At our park we have a 7y/o unaltered malamute, 110 pounds, it's a beast, it smells another boy dog from 2 miles away and it's go time for that dog. It's beautiful, but it's unruly. They keep a gps collar on it because it has broken the metal off of leashes, I didn't believe it until i saw it happen. It will fight it's prong without flinching.
 
#86 ·
So, while I really believe that it depends on the situation, I also believe that the killing of an animal should never be down played per say.

We have a GSD in the shelter, young, spunky, bi color.....she has a history of killing chickens. Now, she is a sweet dog, but you can tell that she needs lots of training and she has lots of drive.

On a different group that sponsors shelter animals and all that, they put up her picture. They were honest, saying that she kills chickens. I posted that I met her, she was very sweet but lots of drive and with her history of killing chickens, other small animals in the home might want to be a no go.

Now, many of us here, myself included, could take her (if I already had my house I would consider it) and probably train her and manage her even if we did have small pets in the house, but, this is the county ran shelter where its first come first serve.

Would my advice of people will smaller animals being aware and possibly reconsidering her be unreasonable? Well, you'd think it would from some of the comments. "My dog has killed chickens but gets along great with my cats." Ok, thats great..thats YOUR dog. Someone even suggested that she was probably just trying to "herd" the chickens, and she'll be fine. Ok, first, around here, any farm animal that gets killed, especially by what is suppose to be a working farm animal, is going to end up killed.

My worry, is that her killing of chickens isn't going to be taken seriously and she's just going to wind up back at the shelter, or killed.

Seriously, is it to much to ask for people to not sugar coat things? It might get her out of the shelter, but at what cost? ugh.

Sorry, I had to rant.
 
#88 ·
Yes! People love their sugar coating. We had a dog come into our SPCA back when I was in high school. Her crime was also killing chickens (and who wouldn't, they're tasty). Her kennel card specifically said that she killed chickens.

Someone came in, read it, adopted her. Yay, right? Nope. She was back two days later and the guy was ticked off because she killed his turkeys. The stupidity of some people is astounding. Take a dog that you just adopted and really the only thing you know about is that it kills birds, and turn her loose with your birds. Yep, double digit IQ right there.
 
#87 ·
I had a problem that was entirely out of my hands. I've never owned a dog that has killed one of my pets but ...

When I moved here I didn't know that my next door neighbor allowed his chickens to roam around in my yard (it's fenced in on all four sides). Niki started killing the trespassing chickens he found in our yard ... I complained and complained and complained to my neighbor, asking/begging him to PLEASE KEEP HIS CHICKENS IN HIS YARD!!! This fell on deaf ears. Finally I spent a fair amount of money and had a 2nd fence built about 4 or 5' inside the outer fence (three sides only, the street side fence is only single. This didn't help much and the chickens just went over the 2nd fence too. When I got Mac he also killed the trespassing chickens ... I'd guess during a period of over 15 years, the two of them killed about 200 trespassing chickens ... and it wasn't a quick easy death for the poor critters.

BUT when I got two little carnies I put Niki the chicken killer in charge of them. Every time another Hooligan either touched the cage or nosed open the cage door to steal a bird treat, Niki got scolded. He helped me clean their cage, put them to bed at night, etc. Every interaction I had with the little birds, Niki was with me. He learned quickly that the canaries were HIS responsibility and he started ensuring their safety from the other dogs.

One day I accidently let Boris, the male, out ... the bewildered little bird flew all over the house, landing here and there, then taking off again. Finally he landed on top of Niki's head and stayed there. My chicken killing dog FROZE until I could get Boris off his head and return him to their cage.

Sadly, when Niki got quite ill from osteosarcoma, I had to place the canaries in another home because I was spending so much time tending to his needs that I was neglecting the birds, only feeding them and giving them water, cleaning their cage, nothing else.
 
#89 ·
My GSD, Mace, coexists with my cat and my mothers little pom/chi, Koko. They all pretty much grew up together. Mace and Koko were obtained within a month of each other as pups and Onyx came a couple months later (there was a BOGO sale at the humane society on cats :rolleyes:). Koko in recent years has begun to despise Mace and likes to try to control his movements and does NOT allow Mace near Onyx if we allow his bratty behavior. I do my best to put an end to any of his bullying immediately as I never want my dog to take it upon himself to correct that behavior as there is about an 80lb size difference. They are never left together unsupervised for just that reason. Accidents happen and even in play Mace can seriously injure or kill Koko with no malice or intention to do so. Also, my mother is in a wheelchair so the time Koko and Mace spend together when its just my mom at home is SEVERELY limited (I can count on my fingers how many times thats happened). Its a preventive measure and probably completely unecessary but it only takes one second and if Mace hurt or God forbid killed Koko I dont know if I'd be able to forgive him. Koko is my moms dog, yes, but that little dog holds such a special place in my heart. IDK how to describe it but we call him pinnochio cause he wants to be a "real boy" so bad! When you look into those eyes you can almost see a human soul! Such intelligence and wisdom lurk in the windows of his soul! :wub::wub:

Now, over the course of Mace's nearly 7 years of life there have been times where I had to leave him with my grandmother at her house for 2-4 months at a time due to personal health reasons. I leave her with instructions and preventive measures to keep my dog as well as her 3 dogs safe but she rarely listens, grandma ALWAYS knows best. Really, you cant tell her anything! :rolleyes: So, she allows her evil chi/terrier thing (7lbs MAX) to attack my dog for no reason. He will hang off my dogs lip. Now, when I am present I protect my dog from that bullying obnoxious behavior because like I said I never want him to feel as though he has to take it upon himself to defend himself, I want him to know I will always defend him, he doesnt have too. But when I'm not there, there is nothing I can do. Apparently, one day when I was away he had enough and bit grandma's little dog back (I personally believe he had no intention to hurt this dog. He was issuing a well deserved correction but since the dog was so small it caused more damage that intended. There was no blood, no puncture wounds nothing and he could have bit this dog in half easily if his intention was to cause harm to this dog but it was not). He stopped breathing and had to be rushed to Emergency Vet. IDK what caused that reaction but he could have died. Luckily everyone is well. But I do NOT blame my dog. I know my dog and he is VERY tolerant so if he was pushed to that extreme it was because there was no human intervention and this behavior went on for a long time until he had enough.
 
#92 · (Edited)
I have to say I do agree with Yoshi on a lot of points. When speaking from a farm living perspective, there is such a thing as *to much*. I understand how people with sport dogs may want a dog at the extreme, if it can be managed and worked with, more power to them, I wish them well.

But in farm life, a dog that has so much prey drive that it wants to kill the live stock or focus on dominating the other dogs is useless.

Spare me the "its how GSDs are" because technically it's not suppose to be. They are *suppose* to be a well rounded dog that can go from one task to the next. There has been a butt load of specialized breeding over the years within the GSDs, but, I feel that is a topic for another section of the board and maybe another time.

Regardless, the fact is, anyone who grew up in farm life, or is in farm life, cannot and will not have a dog that has so much prey drive that it will effect the livelihood of the farmer.
 
#93 · (Edited)
rabbit and chickens we feed to dogs every day, i would not let them interact, cats are another story a lot of gsds and cats can get along, but animals we feed our gsd? Id keep far away from. I have also caught my gsd stealing live prey from my cats and swallowing them whole like rodents. So its clear rodents are something to eat. Mine may kill someone elses cat but that would be territory or defense because that other cat is invading her turf. ALso other cats might come and fight with my cat which she considers her "pack" Same could go for any species. Mine does not like deer that much.
 
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