Do the ends justify the means -- let's say I have a friend...

selzer · 01-11-2012, 07:19 PM

Ok, So, let's say I have a friend whose very smart, very stupid brother has a cat. His cat has had kittens twice already. And now he is finally agreeing that he should spay her. But the vet wants $300 for the job, and while he has a good job, he is way over his head in debt, and is working his way out of it.

So he HAS looked into low-cost spay/neuter. Good for him!

Unfortunately, where he lives, you must be on a government program to qualify to go with the low cost program.

Now it so happens, that my friend does qualify.

Do the ends justify the means?

Would preventing yet another litter of kittens justify this person in taking the cat and using the program to have it spayed? Or is that working the system, cheating, and in no way acceptable?

msvette2u · 01-11-2012, 07:25 PM

The ends justify the means.
I'm confused though. He does, or does not qualify?

Dainerra · 01-11-2012, 07:27 PM

friend qualifies, the brother who owns the cat doesn't.

selzer · 01-11-2012, 07:28 PM

The brother who owns the cat does not qualify. My friend who does not own the cat, but owns the brother does qualify. My friend is wondering if she can take the cat in, using the low-cost program for her brother.

Greydusk · 01-11-2012, 07:30 PM

Sure, seems reasonable to prevent an unwanted litter.

When you say some sort of government program do you mean WIC, welfare etc?

**JakodaCD OA** · 01-11-2012, 07:31 PM

I think the end does justify the means altho I wouldn't do it for someone because I'd be afraid I'd get caught

Falkosmom · 01-11-2012, 07:43 PM

I would do it.

selzer · 01-11-2012, 07:47 PM

I am guessing that unemployment, medicare, Heap, or any number of things could qualify you.

I don't believe it is a government program. But they are using eligibility to government programs as their cut off. If you ARE eligible for ANY type of assistance, there is no way you could slip your brother a check for $300 to get the cat fixed.

As for being caught, I do not know how that could happen. If the individual no longer has the cat two weeks after the spay, and says she gave it to her brother -- cats are not registered in any way here.

Still it is a moral dilemma. Do you encourage someone to do something you would not do, more for moral reasons than for any type of legal/criminal consequences?

Jax08 · 01-11-2012, 07:50 PM

The requirements are silly. Work the system and get the cat spayed. They aren't losing any money and the government isn't funding it.

wolfstraum · 01-11-2012, 07:57 PM

Get the cat spayed - however. No more kittens who may not get homes.

Lee

01-11-2012, 07:19 PM	#1 (permalink)
selzer Crowned Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Denmark, Ohio Posts: 17,499	Do the ends justify the means -- let's say I have a friend... Ok, So, let's say I have a friend whose very smart, very stupid brother has a cat. His cat has had kittens twice already. And now he is finally agreeing that he should spay her. But the vet wants $300 for the job, and while he has a good job, he is way over his head in debt, and is working his way out of it. So he HAS looked into low-cost spay/neuter. Good for him! Unfortunately, where he lives, you must be on a government program to qualify to go with the low cost program. Now it so happens, that my friend does qualify. Do the ends justify the means? Would preventing yet another litter of kittens justify this person in taking the cat and using the program to have it spayed? Or is that working the system, cheating, and in no way acceptable? __________________ RIP Arwen, CD RN CGC RIP Whitney, RN CGC Jenna, RN CGC Babs, CD RA CGC Herding Instinct Certificate Heidi, RA CGC Tori, RN CGC SG3 Odessa, SchH1, Kkl1, AD Ninja, RN CGC Milla, RN CGC Joy, Star Puppy, RN CGC Dolly & Bear

01-11-2012, 07:25 PM	#2 (permalink)
msvette2u Crowned Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Beautiful Pacific NW Posts: 5,505	The ends justify the means. I'm confused though. He does, or does not qualify? __________________ Ruger v. Sunnyside Stray 4-11-11

01-11-2012, 07:28 PM	#4 (permalink)
selzer Crowned Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Denmark, Ohio Posts: 17,499	The brother who owns the cat does not qualify. My friend who does not own the cat, but owns the brother does qualify. My friend is wondering if she can take the cat in, using the low-cost program for her brother. __________________ RIP Arwen, CD RN CGC RIP Whitney, RN CGC Jenna, RN CGC Babs, CD RA CGC Herding Instinct Certificate Heidi, RA CGC Tori, RN CGC SG3 Odessa, SchH1, Kkl1, AD Ninja, RN CGC Milla, RN CGC Joy, Star Puppy, RN CGC Dolly & Bear

01-11-2012, 07:30 PM	#5 (permalink)
Greydusk Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Arizona Posts: 488	Sure, seems reasonable to prevent an unwanted litter. When you say some sort of government program do you mean WIC, welfare etc? __________________ Blitz~ 7 (ish) year old GSD, adopted 1/1/10

01-11-2012, 07:31 PM	#6 (permalink)
JakodaCD OA Moderator Join Date: May 2000 Location: Old Lyme, CT USA Posts: 14,237	I think the end does justify the means altho I wouldn't do it for someone because I'd be afraid I'd get caught __________________ Diane Danger Danger vom Kleinen Hain aka Masi "Angel" Jakoda's Bewitchen Sami CD OA OAJ OAC NGC OJC RS-O GS-N JS-O TT HIC CGC "Angel" Steinwald's Four x Four CGC HIC TT Harmonyhill's Hy Jynx NA NAJ NAC NJC RS-N JS-N HIC Jakoda's Jagged Edge

01-11-2012, 07:27 PM	#3 (permalink)
Dainerra Crowned Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: N. Central Arkansas Posts: 4,565	friend qualifies, the brother who owns the cat doesn't.

01-11-2012, 07:43 PM	#7 (permalink)
Falkosmom Elite Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 1,047	I would do it.

01-11-2012, 07:47 PM	#8 (permalink)
selzer Crowned Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Denmark, Ohio Posts: 17,499	I am guessing that unemployment, medicare, Heap, or any number of things could qualify you. I don't believe it is a government program. But they are using eligibility to government programs as their cut off. If you ARE eligible for ANY type of assistance, there is no way you could slip your brother a check for $300 to get the cat fixed. As for being caught, I do not know how that could happen. If the individual no longer has the cat two weeks after the spay, and says she gave it to her brother -- cats are not registered in any way here. Still it is a moral dilemma. Do you encourage someone to do something you would not do, more for moral reasons than for any type of legal/criminal consequences? __________________ RIP Arwen, CD RN CGC RIP Whitney, RN CGC Jenna, RN CGC Babs, CD RA CGC Herding Instinct Certificate Heidi, RA CGC Tori, RN CGC SG3 Odessa, SchH1, Kkl1, AD Ninja, RN CGC Milla, RN CGC Joy, Star Puppy, RN CGC Dolly & Bear

01-11-2012, 07:50 PM	#9 (permalink)
Jax08 Crowned Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: NNE PA Posts: 14,321	The requirements are silly. Work the system and get the cat spayed. They aren't losing any money and the government isn't funding it.

01-11-2012, 07:57 PM	#10 (permalink)
wolfstraum Crowned Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: PA Posts: 7,088	Get the cat spayed - however. No more kittens who may not get homes. Lee __________________ Csabre Sch1, Hexe Sch2, Bengal, Kyra, Kira & Kougar v Wolfstraum ~ Basha Sch3, Ghost Sch3 - Danger Sch1 SAR - ATB/Ret - Kyra, Sch3, Alice Sch1, Kelsey, Fenja Sch3 wolfstraum.net

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