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Gib_laut 08-07-2014 10:46 AM

Psa Titles as breeding titles
What is your opinion on psa Titles showing a dog is worthy of breeding? Meaning reputable breeders sell a dog with limited registration and will only make it full registration after dog has earn a title. Usually that's ipo but some breeders also accept psa Titles. Thoughts?

If you were looking for a pup would you rather choose two parents with ipo Titles or two with psa Titles? I know that's a loaded question but just speaking in general terms. Thoughts?

hunterisgreat 08-07-2014 10:53 AM

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Me personally? Probably PSA but I'd like to see how the dogs nose works too

martemchik 08-07-2014 10:58 AM

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Just depends on what you're looking for. If you're into PSA, look for PSA, if you're into IPO, I'm sure the IPO titles are more important.

Then there are people that know so much that they could care less about any titles and just want to see the dogs do something if their pedigree looks like its what they're interested in.

Baillif 08-07-2014 11:15 AM

Id want a look at the parents and the pedigrees. Who cares about the titles? A good trainer with enough time and effort can push a dog to 3 in either that has no business being used as breeding stock.

Gib_laut 08-07-2014 11:55 AM

That's why i said loaded question. Of course you would rather just see the parents work.

But you can't. So which title would hold more value to you? Precision focused ipo or nerve focused psa?

Baillif 08-07-2014 12:26 PM

Do you have a way of knowing how the titles were obtained? Are they club trials with in house decoys? If so they mean very little, or were they national or world level titles obtained in another field they couldn't practice in with decoys they didn't know?

Gib_laut 08-07-2014 01:04 PM

Oh I'm not asking for me. Just a general question on if psa Titles make a Shepherd breed worthy?

I agree on your point about "courage" test with a club decoy lol.

Gib_laut 08-07-2014 01:06 PM

I do disagree with you about a good enough trainer being able to push a dog to psa3. Ipo3 yes. Psa3 I'm not so sure.

Gib_laut 08-07-2014 01:07 PM

I think the saying is if you can get a dog to ipo3 then you have officially become a dog trainer

martemchik 08-07-2014 01:42 PM

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I think the problem with the question is that "breedworthy" is such an objective thing. You'll see a lot of things that make a dog breedworthy. A dog without any titles can be considered breedworthy because a "reputable breeder" said so and everyone else just fell inline. But a dog that's IPO3 could not be considered breedworthy because a breeder of high enough caliber didn't give their approval.

If you're talking about on this forum...I would assume any high level bite sport title would get people to "approve" of the litter. I've noticed that any type of bite sport, because it has a reputation of proving a bit about the dog's nerves, gets a bit more credit than doing sports which don't have any kind of protection component.

I do SDA and IPO training. SDA is kind of small. It's fun, but it just doesn't have the same reach as IPO. So an SDA title won't be known by as many people as an IPO title. I'll assume the same is true for PSA. The more I read...the more I understand how important it is to actually watch/work the dogs you're thinking about getting a puppy out of. A dog can be an excellent example of the breed, but someone with an agenda can come on here and rip apart some small component of a video that was taken.

What I've seen/heard is that IPO people are a little more closed minded when it comes to other titles and they like to see IPO titles in the pedigree. The guy I work with for SDA says that it's important to breed back to IPO titled dogs in the pedigree because the more serious people in the sport (IPO) generally won't look at a puppy that doesn't have IPO titles within the last 2-3 generations. Other sports...the people seem to be a bit more open (which makes sense that if you do SDA you'll be fine with a generational pedigree that only has SDA titles in it). The same guy, basically says that most of the puppies are sold to pet homes who can give two rips about any titles lol.

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