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Old 01-11-2013, 02:37 PM   #11 (permalink)
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People will always back yard breed. But all you can do is clench your fists and point everyone in the right direction when it comes to buying a puppy. Tell them the hazards of back yard breeding and suggest good breeders. People buy from them cause they can buy a puppy for 200-500 dollars rather than 1500-2500. You've got to make people understand that it is worth the money.

I love my dog very much. He sweet and beautiful. I paid 250 for him. While I wouldn't take it back or trade him for the world..next time I am going to be doing research and i will spend good money for a puppy.
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Old 01-11-2013, 02:55 PM   #12 (permalink)
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This is why the "should I neuter/spay my animal" threads kill me on this forum. People start giving advice to not do it without any regard for who the person is that's asking. And their usual reasons for this is to make sure the dog fills out and then some unproven medical claims. No one thinks about the fact that although they are being responsible now, 2 years down the line someone might come up to them and ask them for a stud service, offer to pay $500 to $1000 for their beautiful shepherds to mate, and that person might just say yes.
I have to agree. A lot of folks here are anti spay/neuter, which is fine for THEM, as long as they can be responsible enough to prevent unwanted litters (and I suspect most people here are). But when a new poster comes and asks for spay/neuter advice, I think it borders on irresponsible to tell the average pet owner to keep their dog intact. Or to wait until the dog is 2-3 years of age. A lot can happen in that 2-3 years. We don't know the person who is posting, and yes, if some dolt offers them a grand for a stud fee, or they think they can make several grand on a litter, who is going to turn that down? Only the people who really understand the big picture are going to care enough to resist the temptation of $$$$.

Anyway, yes, I understood the OP to simply be ranting. Preaching to choir, maybe.
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Old 01-11-2013, 03:59 PM   #13 (permalink)
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I'm gonna spend some time this afternoon flagging stud ads. I already started, and have thought of a new first step to the "Should I breed my Dog" flowchart.

1) Can I spell my dog's breed?

I have seen countless ads for breeding services for "Siberina Huskies" "Malteese" "German Shephard (or Shepard)" or "Pitt Bull"

...I hate people so much.
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Old 01-11-2013, 04:03 PM   #14 (permalink)
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I think it borders on irresponsible to tell the average pet owner to keep their dog intact.
Totally disagree!. I visit this forum to get sound advice and opinion on the rearing of my GSD. I don't want some condescending do gooder telling me I should neuter/spay my dog just because they automatically assume I can't manager her during her heat cycles. I want to hear the thoughts and opinions from both sides so I can make my own informed decision.

What is irresponsible is owners who decide not to neuter/spay and end up with oops litters or breed purely for financial gain (without consideration to the breed standard). Period!

I consider myself an average pet owner. 1 female GSD, 2yrs old. She has already had 3 heat cycles all of which were easily managed.
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Old 01-11-2013, 04:46 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Kai is from a 'back yard breeder'.

In the uk their are hardly no breeders like there are in the usa. All the AKC and puppies for 1000+ and papers ect do not really exist here. I only know of one called somethin like susex GSD who sell pups from 1800. In the uk their are breeders and back yard breeders. Breeders do breed in their home ect but have different reasons for doing it to the others

Kai's dam and sire were family pets. The daughter and mother were a vet. They were not chained or anything but from an actuall loving family. She did reaseacrch before breeding, got them tested and hip scored. But he didnt come with papers ect.

If you dont plan to show ect. your dog then i dont see why youd pay silly money for your pup when you could get one from a lovin family

**** I am not saying i support back yard breeders*****

I dont like breeders who do it just for the money, do it improperly, dont get their dogs tested ect.

Also i hate petshop dogs. Its just horrible and cruel.

Hope that makes sense i hope u dont take it as i support them
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Old 01-11-2013, 05:09 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Kai is from a 'back yard breeder'.

In the uk their are hardly no breeders like there are in the usa. All the AKC and puppies for 1000+ and papers ect do not really exist here. I only know of one called somethin like susex GSD who sell pups from 1800. In the uk their are breeders and back yard breeders. Breeders do breed in their home ect but have different reasons for doing it to the others

Kai's dam and sire were family pets. The daughter and mother were a vet. They were not chained or anything but from an actuall loving family. She did reaseacrch before breeding, got them tested and hip scored. But he didnt come with papers ect.

If you dont plan to show ect. your dog then i dont see why youd pay silly money for your pup when you could get one from a lovin family

**** I am not saying i support back yard breeders*****

I dont like breeders who do it just for the money, do it improperly, dont get their dogs tested ect.

Also i hate petshop dogs. Its just horrible and cruel.

Hope that makes sense i hope u dont take it as i support them
If you do all of the appropriate research, testing and care, in my opinion, that graduates you from "Backyard Breeder" to "Hobby Breeder". Of course, seeing as how no one would willingly label themselves a BYB, there are lot who claim to do all of the appropriate testing and care...and don't. (Not saying these people didn't)
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Old 01-11-2013, 05:12 PM   #17 (permalink)
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I'm an admin on a local GSD facebook page, and I would say 75% of the owners are BYB or support them. It was started by a 'breeder' who had a litter w/ no papers/heath testing and didn't even know different lines exist.
Many of these members want to breed their dog because they want one of the pups out of them and of course have many family members that will take one too!
It is a terrible embarrassing representation of the locals, and of course isn't everyone, but majority of dog owners feel the same as the people on the fb page.
I know there are a couple of responsible breeders in my area, but these people and their mindset is to buy cheap(because they can't afford an expensive dog) and not support the rescues either. They will reply with go on "this" classified page you can find a cheap pup there.

I and one other person who is on this board will try to nicely educate, but often it falls on deaf ears.
And then they wonder why their dogs have temperament or health problems.
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Old 01-11-2013, 05:38 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by pfitzpa1 View Post
Totally disagree!. I visit this forum to get sound advice and opinion on the rearing of my GSD. I don't want some condescending do gooder telling me I should neuter/spay my dog just because they automatically assume I can't manager her during her heat cycles. I want to hear the thoughts and opinions from both sides so I can make my own informed decision.

What is irresponsible is owners who decide not to neuter/spay and end up with oops litters or breed purely for financial gain (without consideration to the breed standard). Period!

I consider myself an average pet owner. 1 female GSD, 2yrs old. She has already had 3 heat cycles all of which were easily managed.
I agree with this. I am am average pet owner. I will never neuter my boy (unless its a medical issue). He is never out of my sight. I never plan to breed because he is unregistered, unpapered, and unpedigreed. I will never allow a situation in which he can escape, or one where he could breed (unless he is in my house I have eyes on him at all times.) I am very responsible in this area of my dog. Last thing I want is more puppies that never had a chance in the shelter.
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Old 01-11-2013, 06:08 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Oh now, OP, why did you have to start this thread because it made me go to craigslist, which I never do, and check out my area. Now my blood is boiling. I'm not savvy on the craigslist front - under which TOS violation do you flag 'em (and let's not kid ourselves - it's not going to do a darn thing)?

Greatest hits from my area: Someone with a female bulldog who's looking for a stud and her pedigree is that she's has a brother who is Ice-T and Coco's dog.... a couple of other people looking for studs, but you need to call them before the bitches' next cycle because they're going to be spayed. Oh and there's a Chi-Chi (huh??) that's 8 months old and at stud - he's registered with the International Designer Canine Registry, so get your bitches ready and be sure to get their papers here: Registration and Pedigree Services for Designer Breeds - International Designer Canine Registry).... thank God I didn't see GSDs on Craigslist, but I did learn that a GSDxPug is called a Shug and a GSDxGolden Retriever is a Golden Shepherd through the esteemed International Designer Canine Registry.

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Old 01-11-2013, 06:40 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by pfitzpa1 View Post
I don't want some condescending do gooder telling me I should neuter/spay my dog just because they automatically assume I can't manager her during her heat cycles.

I consider myself an average pet owner. 1 female GSD, 2yrs old. She has already had 3 heat cycles all of which were easily managed.
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Originally Posted by GusGus View Post
I agree with this. I am am average pet owner. I will never neuter my boy (unless its a medical issue). He is never out of my sight. I never plan to breed because he is unregistered, unpapered, and unpedigreed. I will never allow a situation in which he can escape, or one where he could breed (unless he is in my house I have eyes on him at all times.)
Yes, but we don't automatically KNOW this about every new person who posts. Unfortunately, some of us see so much irresponsible pet ownership and breeding that we come to expect it from the average person; we tend to assume the worst of people in this regard. At least I do. Anyone who has worked in a rescue, ac or shelter sees the most horrible unspeakable cruelty and ignorance, becomes sensitized to it, and doesn't take anything for granted. You want to think most people are responsible and good at heart, but it's a harsh wake-up call when you see the way some people treat/mistreat/neglect their animals. A LOT of people. See it enough and you start to think that anyone is capable of it, regardless of how nice and responsible they are in other aspects of their life. Just as a groomer I can tell stories you wouldn't believe--doctors, lawyers, all walks of life can be negligent dog owners. No one gets a free pass.

I realize that all sounds horribly jaded and judgmental, but it really isn't personal. I don't care whether people keep their pets intact, as long as they don't allow any unwanted litters.

But I don't think it's wise to automatically assume that every person who posts here will be capable of that.

You, me, and the majority of folks on this forum probably can, and there are probably lots of other people out there who are, i just don't know who they are yet, and IMO it's safer to give conservative advice: Spay/neuter 6-9 months for the average pet owner who has no desire to keep an intact dog. For people who are into sport or will be working their dogs, maybe wait a little longer for optimal bone/joint development, 1-2 years. For anyone who is responsible, it's up to them when they want to spay/neuter at all.
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