incapable mother

x11 · 01-03-2013, 07:47 PM

first time i heard of this, a friend had a planned breeding with a first time mother (gsd's of course). the mother dropped the pups all over the kennel and cowered in the corner of th kennel geting as far away as possible from them snarling and bristles up. she killed two pups instantly before anyone could react. the shocked owners removed all the pups and lucky in that neighbourhood there were two pet dogs with litters that took on the pups straight away without fuss while still caring for their own pups. the pups have been surrogated and getting bottle supplements.

the female has an incredibly good temperament other than this and has zero dog agression and has owners kids playing with her and climbing all over her every other day before this happened - what went wrong??

Stevenzachsmom · 01-03-2013, 08:02 PM

I have heard of this happening before, but am not a breeder and have no idea why. I hope someone answers soon, as I am also interested.

LoveEcho · 01-03-2013, 08:29 PM

We had this happen with a dog at the kennel. Killed all puppies in the litter except for one.

What I understood was that she did it because she felt threatened. Normally we removed the pregnant bitches into a separate room days prior to their whelping... she gave birth early and unexpectedly (I was not working there at this point so I don't know what the exact circumstances were), surrounded by a dozen other dogs (all in their own runs, but still) in a very stressful environment. It's a fight-or-flight type situation, and if she's stressed she'd rather kill the puppies and be able to run/etc than risk the lives of everyone involved. I'm curious what the validity behind that is.

llombardo · 01-03-2013, 08:30 PM

Could it be that something is wrong with them and she senses it?

x11 · 01-03-2013, 08:40 PM

the pups are physically healthy and evrything else seems normal at this stage. the reaction of the female like she was horrified and scared for her life from the pups.

Narny · 01-03-2013, 09:10 PM

When I was younger we had a cat that did this... she didnt even remove the sacks she just dropped them everywhere and walked away.

Is it possible that she didnt understand what was going on so she just dropped them?

llombardo · 01-03-2013, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Narny

When I was younger we had a cat that did this... she didnt even remove the sacks she just dropped them everywhere and walked away.

Is it possible that she didnt understand what was going on so she just dropped them?

I always heard that cats would suffocate or ignore their kittens if there was something wrong with them....I thought I heard this about dogs to

selzer · 01-03-2013, 09:18 PM

When I have a litter due, especially with a new mother, I am there. Sometimes, I have to break the sack and rub the puppy until it squeaks and the bitch will take over. I keep her separated and safe from the other dogs. I do not bring people in to witness the miracle of birth. I am there helping with her, saying "push it out, push it out."

It sounds like this poor bitch was teamed up with some inexperienced owners who did not know how to create a den for her, reassure her, take an active part if necessary. Now both bitch and pups will suffer from their lack of doing what they should have.

Just because the pet dogs had milk and pups, does not mean they were still spewing cholostrum. That is extremely important. They should have muzzled the bitch and put the pups on her at least for 24 hours, they should have done this every 2-3 hours. Also they should have cleaned the pups and helped them urinate and defecate. Chances are the bitch would have come to herself and taken care of the pups, but if not, the pups would have gotten the immunity of having that cholostrum.

This is a terrible situation.

x11 · 01-03-2013, 09:25 PM

yr out of line if you are saying the breeders somehow did wrong, this happened very quickly and while you would be saying soothing things like "push it out, push it out." the pups would have been torn to shreds.

**Lauri & The Gang** · 01-03-2013, 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by x11

first time i heard of this, a friend had a planned breeding with a first time mother (gsd's of course).

How old is the bitch?

Just because Mother Nature gave them a uterus doesn't mean that every female makes a perfect mother. Some just DO NOT.

I would suggest they spay that bitch and take a serious look into her background. Did this happen to any other bitches from that litter? From litters from that Sire or Dam (with different mates)?

01-03-2013, 07:47 PM	#1 (permalink)
x11 Elite Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 1,258	incapable mother first time i heard of this, a friend had a planned breeding with a first time mother (gsd's of course). the mother dropped the pups all over the kennel and cowered in the corner of th kennel geting as far away as possible from them snarling and bristles up. she killed two pups instantly before anyone could react. the shocked owners removed all the pups and lucky in that neighbourhood there were two pet dogs with litters that took on the pups straight away without fuss while still caring for their own pups. the pups have been surrogated and getting bottle supplements. the female has an incredibly good temperament other than this and has zero dog agression and has owners kids playing with her and climbing all over her every other day before this happened - what went wrong??

01-03-2013, 08:30 PM	#4 (permalink)
llombardo Crowned Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Illinois Posts: 4,973	Could it be that something is wrong with them and she senses it? __________________ Misty- Samoyed Mix Tannor- Golden Retriever CGC Robyn- German Shepherd CGC Cats-Thunder, Harley, Miley, Bandit, and Ferah RIP Boo..Black Lab "A dog is the only thing on this earth that loves you more than he loves himself."

01-03-2013, 09:10 PM	#6 (permalink)
Narny Master Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Houston Pearland Posts: 750	When I was younger we had a cat that did this... she didnt even remove the sacks she just dropped them everywhere and walked away. Is it possible that she didnt understand what was going on so she just dropped them? __________________ LuLu 09-14-12

01-03-2013, 09:18 PM	#8 (permalink)
selzer Crowned Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Denmark, Ohio Posts: 20,858	When I have a litter due, especially with a new mother, I am there. Sometimes, I have to break the sack and rub the puppy until it squeaks and the bitch will take over. I keep her separated and safe from the other dogs. I do not bring people in to witness the miracle of birth. I am there helping with her, saying "push it out, push it out." It sounds like this poor bitch was teamed up with some inexperienced owners who did not know how to create a den for her, reassure her, take an active part if necessary. Now both bitch and pups will suffer from their lack of doing what they should have. Just because the pet dogs had milk and pups, does not mean they were still spewing cholostrum. That is extremely important. They should have muzzled the bitch and put the pups on her at least for 24 hours, they should have done this every 2-3 hours. Also they should have cleaned the pups and helped them urinate and defecate. Chances are the bitch would have come to herself and taken care of the pups, but if not, the pups would have gotten the immunity of having that cholostrum. This is a terrible situation. __________________ RIP Arwen, CD RN CGC RIP Whitney, RN CGC Jenna, RN CGC & Babs, CD RA CGC HIC (not AKC) Heidi, RA CGC & Tori, RN CGC SG3 Odessa, SchH1, Kkl1, AD Ninja, RN CGC & Milla, RN CGC Joy, Star Puppy, RN CGC Dolly CGC & Bear Gretta Hepzibah

01-03-2013, 08:02 PM	#2 (permalink)
Stevenzachsmom Knighted Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Maryland Posts: 3,363	I have heard of this happening before, but am not a breeder and have no idea why. I hope someone answers soon, as I am also interested.

01-03-2013, 08:29 PM	#3 (permalink)
LoveEcho Knighted Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: New Hampshire Posts: 2,311	We had this happen with a dog at the kennel. Killed all puppies in the litter except for one. What I understood was that she did it because she felt threatened. Normally we removed the pregnant bitches into a separate room days prior to their whelping... she gave birth early and unexpectedly (I was not working there at this point so I don't know what the exact circumstances were), surrounded by a dozen other dogs (all in their own runs, but still) in a very stressful environment. It's a fight-or-flight type situation, and if she's stressed she'd rather kill the puppies and be able to run/etc than risk the lives of everyone involved. I'm curious what the validity behind that is.

01-03-2013, 08:40 PM	#5 (permalink)
x11 Elite Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 1,258	the pups are physically healthy and evrything else seems normal at this stage. the reaction of the female like she was horrified and scared for her life from the pups.

01-03-2013, 09:25 PM	#9 (permalink)
x11 Elite Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 1,258	yr out of line if you are saying the breeders somehow did wrong, this happened very quickly and while you would be saying soothing things like "push it out, push it out." the pups would have been torn to shreds.

Remove Advertisements Sponsored Links
German Shepherd Advertisement