some questions

[LissG]

ok...please don't yell at me lol i don't want anyone to think i'm a byb cause i'm not....BUT i have a gsd who i absolute adore and he has a truly great working line pedigree. he isn't fixed. i would love to *one day* *maybe* have him be a sire for a litter of puppies and keep one of the puppies (he's not fixed for other reasons-NOT because i maybe possibly one day will have him be a sire)....anywho-i was wondering how does that all work? does he have to have titles first? lol it wouldn't be for quite a while-he's still pretty young...i'm just curious and want to spend a couple years researching/learning before i ever do anything. IF i do it-i want it to be done right and with someone really experienced and not a byb...i want it to be a contribution to the breed. thanks in advance for the help

[selzer]

Ok, here's the thing. You want to do it right, so you do not want to use him for just any old bitch. For one thing, people will blame the dog if there are genetic or temperament problems, because no one wants to blame their own dog. So, you do not want to be known for having a dog that sired a litter with problems. So you have to be careful in your selection of a bitch.

So, think about what you want the bitch to have to qualify to be used to breed to your dog:

For example,
OFA hips, elbows, cardiac, thyroid, DM-testing, Von Wilbrand's disease, CERF testing.

A history of OFA hips and elbows in the pedigree.

Some type of title to ensure that she isn't a crazy bitch that cannot be around people or dogs.

No disqualifying faults.

etc.

Now, think about if you have a bitch. Let's say she has all of the above. And you want to breed her. You know that any time you breed your bitch, you can lose her. She can have puppies and lose them. She can miss and not have puppies. If the puppies have problems, she will have to manage the puppy buyers, helping them or taking puppies back. If she misses, she cannot be bred again for six months. So what would you want for the dog to have.

Now, for less than the price of a puppy, you can get for your bitch a top winning dog to use of a stud. That dog can be used scores of times in a year, so availability is really not a problem, and spending a few hundred dollars more for an excellent dog, good pedigree, all health screenings, titles, the whole nine yards, as well as a stud owner with a good reputation and lots of experience, known excellent progeny.

So you can see the problem you are up against.

My advice to you is to spend two years working with your dog, getting involved with shows and clubs, working with your dog, putting lots and lots of titles on your dog, train train train, and learn everything you can about breeding, bloodlines, training, genetic issues.

Then buy yourself an awesome bitch.

I don't know that you can really get on your dog a resume that is good enough to entice even a decent bitch owner to take a chance on your dog. Once your dog has it all, including some nice progeny, then maybe other people will see you working with your dog and take notice of him, and you will be able to use him as a stud dog.

[doggiedad]

don't do it. you're sitting yourself
up to be a byb'er.

[selzer]

Why I don't want to be a stud owner...

One day when I had my bitch Heidi at the stud owner's home, the dog was getting nowhere. Finally, she took the dog in and came back out with a rubber glove. Ok, maybe it was latex. I don't know. All I could think of was, uhg!

Yep, she put her finger into my girls pieces parts to see if she was open.

It is a messy job to be sure, even when everything goes right. I love my breeder friends. We often go out to eat after a tie. And I always wonder what people in the restaurants think of our conversation. Ick!

The bitch owner needs to hold her bitch (usually muzzled to protect the dog), while the dog owner sits on a small stool, holding the bitch's hind end and the dog's lead. While he does the job, the stud owner may need to guide his bun into the oven. Then weight of dog and bitch is on her while the dog is doing the job. She then ensures that they are indeed tied, and will show the bitch owner, that the dog is tied, and will help the dog turn so they are then tail to tail. If it is an outside tie, she may have to lock her arms around both hind ends and hold them together.

Another thing to think about is Brucellosis. Yes dogs can get VD. Oh, but now they call them STDs. But whatever. Brucellosis is a nasty disease that will cause the bitch to abort, and the dog and bitch to become sterile. They can catch it off the toilet seat so to speak, so most people will euth a dog with brucellosis, as it will infect their other dogs. A minimum requirement is a brucellosis test for dog and bitch prior to mating. And it is not a bad idea to insist on a vaginal culture that will tell if there is an overage of bacteria in the vaginal area. The vaginal area is not sterile, so there will be strep, staph, microplasma, etc. But if any of these are abundant, it can infect your dog. A dog with an infection can get, well, it can be bad up to sterility for a while. Some people clean the dog's penis after its over each time.

Also, just one breeding is not enough, usually they bring the bitch so many days into the heat cycle, and then every other day that the bitch is willing to stand. Got something going? Too bad, if she needs to be bred, she needs to be bred. Timing is literally everything, and progesterone testing and target testing only gets you so far.

[selzer]

Originally Posted by doggiedad

don't do it. you're sitting yourself
up to be a byb'er.

Why?

Are all the breeders who will not be BYBs already breeding? So there cannot be any new breeders ever? If she wants to go about it right, then I think it is better to just give her some information to get started with. The breed needs people who are willing to learn and do it right. They will not all be BYBs.

[cliffson1]

Don't ask questions like that on a public forum, find a person you respect their knowledge and inquire privately about what you are trying to do. I promise you, you'll get a far better response than the two thousand public opinions, some of which haven't ever bred a good dog, to be in a position to give you good advice one way or the other. JMO

[LissG]

Originally Posted by doggiedad

don't do it. you're sitting yourself
up to be a byb'er.

how?? isn't this how real breeders start-by asking questions? i plan on doing some extensive research for at least 3 years before actually persuing it. i'm just looking for a starting point because there's obviously sooo much to it. i didn't even know dogs could get STDs. i DO care about the well being of all parties involved. i want the pups to be healthy, amazing pets. i wanted long time breeders on here to give me a starting point (thanks selzer and cliff). after doing alot of research, and i work alot on my dog- if i still want to do it i'm going to look for a local experienced, responsibile breeder to mentor me and let me see how everything works with a litter they have going before i actually do anything.

[selzer]

You maybe can find a good mentor in a German Shepherd Dog club or a good training club. I agree with Cliffson that a good mentor will give you more than trying to sort out a lot of comments from anonymous sources.

Get involved. Breeding is hands-on. First you have to be a dog-person, be where dog people are, do what dog-people do.

The hard thing is getting your feet wet. Even in clubs, it takes some time to get in and have people realize you are serious. It takes time and commitment, sometimes going back again, and again, and again.