muscle development...questions

[sagelfn]

Please bare with me. I'm not exactly sure how to ask what I want to know so I have a bunch of stuff with questions thrown in.

Sage- male GSD
2yrs old (26months)
28" tall
33" girth
80lbs
neutered just shy of 10months of age

One of the things I'm wondering about is his development. I'm not sure if there is a nutrition issue, early neutering, genetics, no issue, I'm stupid, or all the above - even though Sage is large he still seems small to me... He seems very narrow. He doesn't seem to be building muscle. He is strong, he is toned. I can feel muscles but he just doesn't look... masculine/muscular. I think his back legs look strong but chest/shoulder not so much.

I asked this question a while back Rib cage
I was wondering if he has a flat rib cage maybe I am keeping him too thin using normal methods and thus he is not getting proper nutrients to build muscle. (the website I linked in that thread is down, I am thinking there was something there about dogs with flat rib cages lacking muscle mass but I can't be certain)

Oh he is eating on average 3 1/2 cups a day of Orijen Adult. He also gets treats, raw bones, etc.. but not sure how much on average.

Here is a recent thread where I kind of touched on this but decided to start this thread Your dog is fat. Sorry.

The pictures in that thread are a little old. Here are some from yesterday ( I know there are a lot of pictures but I want to make sure what I'm talking about is seen)

This is not about his terrible conformation so please don't waste critique on my stakcing skills....muscles/developement. Please do not be shy in your comments.

he moved..






















Front view of chest



I know someone will suggest raw diet. I would love to do that but I have a tiny freezer. I do not have space and without buying in bulk it would not be an affordable option. He needs to be on grain free diet. So if you suggest another kibble keep that in mind. I thought protein was good for building muscle (of course with exercise)..thought he was on a high protein food already.

[GSDAlphaMom]

I have zero experience with this product (k9 super fuel) but I have a friend with working dogs that uses it. One of the claims is 'builds muscle'.

K9 Super Fuel for Dogs

[Freestep]

Sage looks fine to me! Maybe not as masculine as some males, but his body condition looks good. He may need another year to fill out.

[Ace952]

Honestly, I think the only way to get real muscle development is with a raw diet. He has to eat meat and he needs exercise (swimming, running or you on a bike with him jogging next to you, etc.)

I agree with GSDAlphaMom in that I head K9 Super Fuel builds muscle and is a good supplement. You still you have to feed meat to gain significant muscle.

Just to add, you can find a small deep freezer on craigslist to store your raw meat. People will advertise a nice small chest one for about $100 and of course you offer $50 and will probably walk away with it for $70.

For what you are paying in Orijen, you can afford raw.....seriously. You dont have to buy so much in bulk as you think. You also feed less than you do with kibble. No matter how good Orijen is, there is no substitute for real meat.

Nice looking dog.

[JakodaCD OA]

I think he looks good to He's young, he's not heavy boned , so maybe your thinking because he isn't 'heavy boned' he's not muscled?

Masi is 3, she's long legged , (26" 74#)finer boned but built like a brick you know what house. She is all muscle, you can feel it espec in her back thigh areas..She does ALOT of swimming, ALOT of running, and well alotta stuff She's lean and I like to keep her that way..

It could also be immaturity with Sage, I don't think he looks underweight at all, in fact I wouldn't want him any fatter, but I tend to like a lean dog.. My males all tended to look gangly, long lean, ribby, until they matured out between 2-3 yrs old. It wasn't because of lack of muscle tone, it was just what I called, "the uglies" LOL..

[sagelfn]

Originally Posted by Ace952

Honestly, I think the only way to get real muscle development is with a raw diet. He has to eat meat and he needs exercise (swimming, running or you on a bike with him jogging next to you, etc.)

I agree with GSDAlphaMom in that I head K9 Super Fuel builds muscle and is a good supplement. You still you have to feed meat to gain significant muscle.

Just to add, you can find a small deep freezer on craigslist to store your raw meat. People will advertise a nice small chest one for about $100 and of course you offer $50 and will probably walk away with it for $70.

For what you are paying in Orijen, you can afford raw.....seriously. You dont have to buy so much in bulk as you think. You also feed less than you do with kibble. No matter how good Orijen is, there is no substitute for real meat.

Nice looking dog.

He does swim, often. We started biking in June. I don't have space in my house for a freezer or I would have one. Really, I do want to feed raw but I don't see how it is possible right now. Maybe could figure out how to feed raw half time. There are plenty of kibble fed dogs with muscle though, I get your point and I do agree raw is best but not a good option right now. His treats are real meat. I know it's not the same, but I'm sure he gets more real meat than most kibble fed dogs.

[sagelfn]

Originally Posted by JakodaCD OA

I think he looks good to He's young, he's not heavy boned , so maybe your thinking because he isn't 'heavy boned' he's not muscled?

Masi is 3, she's long legged , (26" 74#)finer boned but built like a brick you know what house. She is all muscle, you can feel it espec in her back thigh areas..She does ALOT of swimming, ALOT of running, and well alotta stuff She's lean and I like to keep her that way..

It could also be immaturity with Sage, I don't think he looks underweight at all, in fact I wouldn't want him any fatter, but I tend to like a lean dog.. My males all tended to look gangly, long lean, ribby, until they matured out between 2-3 yrs old. It wasn't because of lack of muscle tone, it was just what I called, "the uglies" LOL..

Thanks Diane. I've said it a million times, he's my first dog so I don't know what is normal. Everyone I know has fat dogs. Everyone tells me he is so skinny. GSD people say he will fill out and I'm like when, because he's so narrow I can't imagine him changing that much more. The GSDs I have met are all bigger but they are also bigger boned SL type. Plus Sage has that tight coat he really shows how narrow he is. The only WL GSD I know is a DDR brick house. That dog gets walks and runs in the yard and has bulging muscles.

[JakodaCD OA]

some are just finer boned...one of my gsd's long ago , I swear I had people telling me all the time how skinny he was and he was 2 years old,,He DID look like some skinny starved junkyard dawg LOL..He was VERY active, and finally when he really matured out, he filled out and didn't look so unproportioned.

My first female, she was an energizer bunny, and she burned off whatever she ate, I couldn't get her fat if I wanted to, but she was all muscle, long legged and long bodied, it was just her metabolism and she never really did get 'fat'..

I don't know how many vets I've heard say "your dog is to thin", but you look at THEIR dogs and they are fat hogs! ..

I like a lean dog, I want them proportioned, and I want to feel muscle..if they have a good diet, get good exercise, and mature out, they usually 'grow' into themselves.

[SchHGSD]

He looks pretty good, IMO.

Although he was neutered at 10 months, that might be young enough that he will remain a bit "feminine" looking his whole life. Neutered males, of any species, grow a bit taller, are leaner, and lack "masculine" bone and muscle.

[sagelfn]

Originally Posted by SchHGSD

He looks pretty good, IMO.

Although he was neutered at 10 months, that might be young enough that he will remain a bit "feminine" looking his whole life. Neutered males, of any species, grow a bit taller, are leaner, and lack "masculine" bone and muscle.

This just made me think of something I want to clarify... I am fine with him being a bit feminine looking. I'm not disappointed that he isn't this big beast of a dog. I just want to make sure he's healthy and that everything I can do to help him grow properly is done... well except for early neutering