Trained or temperament? Behavior around farm animals.

[jocoyn]

FYI-I got the dog in 2006 when he was 2 so I don't know fully the experiences he had during formative times other than he did spend *some* time on a farm. I have never had a problem with him running game in the woods but this weekend was the uber-challenge.

Spent weekend at farm and did a lot of cadaver problems with my dog -
One was in a birdhouse with the birds going crazy flapping and squawking.........he pays them zero attention and even walks past a threatening turkey to search an area.

Loose goats, cattle, etc - pays them zero interest. One of the cows is even following HIM around. The landowner pulled out a young chicken (not while we were working) and he licked its head and tried to pick it up (gently) like a toy.

I am terribly pleased from a working perspecitve because he hunts and hunts and hunts and will chase a ball endlessly but is blind to other animals around him.

Is being oblivious to the farm animals something that was trained in or genetic? I would think if herding instinct was there he would want to 'herd" the loose animals? This is not a dull or low drive dog.

[RazinKain]

maybe he was around livestock so much as a pup that he has become desensitized to it and isn't curious in the least. Sounds like a really focused boy, and well behaved too.

[wilbanks17]

Originally Posted by RazinKain

maybe he was around livestock so much as a pup that he has become desensitized to it and isn't curious in the least. Sounds like a really focused boy, and well behaved too.

agreed....

[lhczth]

I think it is genetic. Treue, who was a very drivey/ball/toy crazy dog, had no interest in livestock or game. She would stand and watch a rabbit run under her nose with no desire to chase. Alexis and Nike also really have never had much interest in chasing my animals, but Vala gets great joy out of scattering my chickens. Vala will also chase game, but, luckily, loses interest quickly. Donovan pretty much ignores them, but Deja has EXTREMELY high drives to hunt down, stalk and then grab animals and game. She is the only one I have to watch around my chickens.

[jocoyn]

Ah Lisa - having a critter animal is such a hassle (as is having one dog agressive) as you can imagine with SAR.

It was such a delight seeing the dog so focused on his target that everything else disapparred, partiuclary when my retired dog needed constant reinforcement not to chase game, had e collar training for it (low stim, timing), and still has managed to catch birds in flight.

If he is not working he is curious about the animals but not in a chase/bite sort of way. He did gently pick up a baby chicken that ran under him. Never saw him pick up a toy so gently.

It was the same way a few months ago when we were charged by a dog hating horse (it was a friends boarder and she did not know that about the horse) She was running into the horse, I was trying to pull the dog out of the pen and he is going "I got scent here...just let me work it"

So genetic? Predictable? Where? I guess by 6 months you would know........

[BlackthornGSD]

I think it's inherited, but reinforced by experience (more than training). And you can usually see it at 8 weeks, to some degree, when exposing them to, say cats or chickens. It's natural for a dog with drive to have something of a prey response to a moving cat, but a non-moving cat can trigger the critter/kill drive even on a young dog.

And I've had both types of dogs in the same litter.

[jocoyn]

I did see that with my female when I got her at 12 weeks. We had cats much bigger than she and because of their dog experience they knew how to move around dogs. She is probably the youngest puppy I ever put a prong on and even then she knew when it was off. I never did trust her (to this day) unsupervised around cats.

Fortunatly they were my daughters cats we were watching and she eventually "took them" with her.

[lhczth]

Donovan also picked up a baby chick and had it sitting in front of him when I realized his Cuz was alive. It was wet, but not harmed. I used to have a female that would help me catch rabbits that escaped. She would find them and then hold them in a corner so I could grab them. Funny, she would kill wild animals, but never my farm animals.

Yes, I think Deja's desire to actually hunt will be our hardest training issue in tracking. If I had chickens when she was a puppy I think she would not be a problem around them. I didn't get the chickens until last spring and they didn't get let loose to roam until the fall.

[Liesje]

I think these things are genetic. One of my dogs has very high prey drive, and from day one at 8 weeks was not and never has been trustworthy with my cats. I could train and desensitize all I want but I would never trust him with small animals. Another one of my dogs was fine with my cats from day one and I never *had* to do any training or desensitization, the dog either ignored them completely or deferred to them (cat would approach the water bucket, dog would move; cat would jump on the back of the couch, dog would get off). People have asked me how I get the dog to be so gentle around cats and I don't have an answer, the dog just IS. The other dog is not allowed near them.

[jocoyn]

Ok so it sounds like a just add that to selection criteria for an individual dog. It really is a headache - we did, in fact, get past it during working with my female but it was a lot of ecollar work and you could tell they still distracted her; she just "thought out it" and chose not too chase (We never did SAR training with the ecollar and it was basically a few sessions and my last resort with the female dog......)