The "good old dogs"

elisabeth_00117 · 03-05-2011, 04:08 PM

I had a great surprise today - the TD/helper for our club that just split came by for a little visit while he was in the area!

Recently our TD/helper became ill and was forced to give up the sport and our 'helper in training' moved to a different club which left us with only a few members. We have still been meeting and working on obedience and soon tracking and so he stopped by to help us with our "helper search".

Anyways, as we were talking he kept saying that Stark reminded him of the "good old dogs" from the past.

His structure was moderate, not your typical working line or showline but a nice balance of the two. Drives were not over the top and he could work from both sides (I am asumming he meant defense and prey?), great nerve and just reminded him of the 'good old dogs'.

In terms of structure, I really like Stark's. If I could change one thing about his structure it would be his hocks and possibly his easty-westy front but I have noticed that changing as he fills out and his chest dropping.

10-12 months (can't remember when the photo was taken):

20-21 months

It was a very nice compliment coming from him.

I guess I am curious what others would consider "good old dogs"? Which dogs from the past and now in the present would you consider "good old dogs?"

I know this is going to be subjective because everyone has their own opinion on what the GSD should be but I think it could be a very interesting topic.

Lin · 03-05-2011, 05:09 PM

I don't have much to say on the "good old dogs" but I've always thought Stark's structure reminded me of my Logan... But then I don't have the most developed eye for that!! So I hope this doesn't end up being insulting

(I wish I had some better pictures online!!)

(odd posture...)

onyx'girl · 03-05-2011, 05:15 PM

Glad to hear your TD/Helper is out and about. I bet it was a wonderful visit for you!
Good old Dogs can still be found today....I'm sure of that!!!
Both Stark and Logan are handsome guys!

elisabeth_00117 · 03-05-2011, 05:33 PM

Lin, definitely a compliment!

Wowzers - gorgeous colouring!!!

Jane, I agree they can be found. Not sure I would consider Stark one of the "good old dogs" but my TD thinks so, I'll take the compliment!

He was so happy to be out and visiting, his granddaughter and son came with him and we all had a nice visit. I wasn't expecting them to buzz up so it was a very nice surprise! In true fashion, he demanded.. I mean, asked...

what Stark and I were working on and to show him.... lol. He was impressed with his flip finish which made me proud because I basically (with the help of my breeder via skype) did it all on my own!

elisabeth_00117 · 03-05-2011, 05:35 PM

I guess I will throw this question out there as well:

What characteristics would YOU consider to make up the 'old type dogs'?

Lin · 03-05-2011, 07:36 PM

Well.... This is why I didn't have anything to say right off

I disagree with the hype about the "good old dogs." I understand the sentiment, people are nostalgic for the past. And with many of the extremes present in the various lines I understand the strong sentiment from many. BUT, we usually remember primarily the good of the past and not the bad. In my mind, the "old type dogs" would be when they resembled the malinois. But then I'm going from education on breed history, not specific experience working with the breed for decades. Breeding is done for a purpose... Responsible breeding improves the breed. Like the ubiquitous "straight back" issue... The dogs were bred for more drive in the rear, lower HQ for a reason. No its not pretty (or functional) when taken to an extreme. But when well bred I believe we're better off with many of the changes since the "good old dogs." And think its mostly people yearning for a past that they are romanticizing.

onyx'girl · 03-05-2011, 08:05 PM

"Responsible breeding improves the breed" is subject to the breeders interpretation of what is "improvement".

I'd rather have a responsible breeder breed within the breed standard rather than improving upon it. That is what has caused the downfall in this breed, when breeders believe what they are doing to improve vs breeding within the standard and having breeding stock that is proven to do what it takes to be breedworthy.
And after the dog is proven breedworthy, you do the best to match dam/sire to produce another generation of breedworthy progeny.
In a perfect world!!

**Andaka** · 03-05-2011, 08:25 PM

German Seiger, American Ch. Bodo v Lierberg SchH 3, ROM

Winners Dog at the 1967 GSDCA National Specialty.

**Andaka** · 03-05-2011, 08:31 PM

Ch. Caralon's Hein vd Lockenheim CD ROM

**Andaka** · 03-05-2011, 08:36 PM

Ch. Caralon's {hantom v Lebarland, a Hein son.

03-05-2011, 04:08 PM	#1 (permalink)
elisabeth_00117 Crowned Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Waterloo, Ontario Posts: 7,250	The "good old dogs" I had a great surprise today - the TD/helper for our club that just split came by for a little visit while he was in the area! Recently our TD/helper became ill and was forced to give up the sport and our 'helper in training' moved to a different club which left us with only a few members. We have still been meeting and working on obedience and soon tracking and so he stopped by to help us with our "helper search". Anyways, as we were talking he kept saying that Stark reminded him of the "good old dogs" from the past. His structure was moderate, not your typical working line or showline but a nice balance of the two. Drives were not over the top and he could work from both sides (I am asumming he meant defense and prey?), great nerve and just reminded him of the 'good old dogs'. In terms of structure, I really like Stark's. If I could change one thing about his structure it would be his hocks and possibly his easty-westy front but I have noticed that changing as he fills out and his chest dropping. 10-12 months (can't remember when the photo was taken): 20-21 months It was a very nice compliment coming from him. I guess I am curious what others would consider "good old dogs"? Which dogs from the past and now in the present would you consider "good old dogs?" I know this is going to be subjective because everyone has their own opinion on what the GSD should be but I think it could be a very interesting topic. __________________ Battleborn Hundesport Wild Winds Archangel Raphael "Stark", HIC (2009-04-10) Wild Winds Zephyr "Zefra" (2011-04-15) *Beau* 03/08/97 to 06/07/10

03-05-2011, 05:09 PM	#2 (permalink)
Lin Knighted Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Indianapolis, Indiana Posts: 3,243	I don't have much to say on the "good old dogs" but I've always thought Stark's structure reminded me of my Logan... But then I don't have the most developed eye for that!! So I hope this doesn't end up being insulting (I wish I had some better pictures online!!) (odd posture...) __________________ Sorry dude. I can't live up to your expectations all of the time. Sometimes I'm going drink six miniature bottles of rum and then draw horses. That's just the way the world works. - Allie Brosh

03-05-2011, 05:15 PM	#3 (permalink)
onyx'girl Crowned Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: SW, MI Posts: 17,605	Glad to hear your TD/Helper is out and about. I bet it was a wonderful visit for you! Good old Dogs can still be found today....I'm sure of that!!! Both Stark and Logan are handsome guys! __________________ Jane~ Kept by Onyx, Kacie and Gideon v Wildhaus aka Karlo

03-05-2011, 05:33 PM	#4 (permalink)
elisabeth_00117 Crowned Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Waterloo, Ontario Posts: 7,250	Lin, definitely a compliment! Wowzers - gorgeous colouring!!! Jane, I agree they can be found. Not sure I would consider Stark one of the "good old dogs" but my TD thinks so, I'll take the compliment! He was so happy to be out and visiting, his granddaughter and son came with him and we all had a nice visit. I wasn't expecting them to buzz up so it was a very nice surprise! In true fashion, he demanded.. I mean, asked... what Stark and I were working on and to show him.... lol. He was impressed with his flip finish which made me proud because I basically (with the help of my breeder via skype) did it all on my own! __________________ Battleborn Hundesport Wild Winds Archangel Raphael "Stark", HIC (2009-04-10) Wild Winds Zephyr "Zefra" (2011-04-15) *Beau* 03/08/97 to 06/07/10

03-05-2011, 05:35 PM	#5 (permalink)
elisabeth_00117 Crowned Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Waterloo, Ontario Posts: 7,250	I guess I will throw this question out there as well: What characteristics would YOU consider to make up the 'old type dogs'? __________________ Battleborn Hundesport Wild Winds Archangel Raphael "Stark", HIC (2009-04-10) Wild Winds Zephyr "Zefra" (2011-04-15) *Beau* 03/08/97 to 06/07/10

03-05-2011, 07:36 PM	#6 (permalink)
Lin Knighted Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Indianapolis, Indiana Posts: 3,243	Well.... This is why I didn't have anything to say right off I disagree with the hype about the "good old dogs." I understand the sentiment, people are nostalgic for the past. And with many of the extremes present in the various lines I understand the strong sentiment from many. BUT, we usually remember primarily the good of the past and not the bad. In my mind, the "old type dogs" would be when they resembled the malinois. But then I'm going from education on breed history, not specific experience working with the breed for decades. Breeding is done for a purpose... Responsible breeding improves the breed. Like the ubiquitous "straight back" issue... The dogs were bred for more drive in the rear, lower HQ for a reason. No its not pretty (or functional) when taken to an extreme. But when well bred I believe we're better off with many of the changes since the "good old dogs." And think its mostly people yearning for a past that they are romanticizing. __________________ Sorry dude. I can't live up to your expectations all of the time. Sometimes I'm going drink six miniature bottles of rum and then draw horses. That's just the way the world works. - Allie Brosh

03-05-2011, 08:05 PM	#7 (permalink)
onyx'girl Crowned Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: SW, MI Posts: 17,605	"Responsible breeding improves the breed" is subject to the breeders interpretation of what is "improvement". I'd rather have a responsible breeder breed within the breed standard rather than improving upon it. That is what has caused the downfall in this breed, when breeders believe what they are doing to improve vs breeding within the standard and having breeding stock that is proven to do what it takes to be breedworthy. And after the dog is proven breedworthy, you do the best to match dam/sire to produce another generation of breedworthy progeny. In a perfect world!! __________________ Jane~ Kept by Onyx, Kacie and Gideon v Wildhaus aka Karlo Last edited by onyx'girl; 03-05-2011 at 08:11 PM.

03-05-2011, 08:25 PM	#8 (permalink)
Andaka "I like Daffy" Moderator Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: New Douglas, IL ( near St. Louis) Posts: 2,435	German Seiger, American Ch. Bodo v Lierberg SchH 3, ROM Winners Dog at the 1967 GSDCA National Specialty. __________________ Daphne and the Gang at Andaka Where Beauty and Brains Come Together http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/germ...&results_in=10 Home of Ch Natty; Ch Doll; Jag RA (ch ptd); Sara RN (ch ptd); Bella (the new one); and Fisher (Mr. Evil) At the Bridge: Ch Kahla CD; Ch Keno UD HSAs OA; Ch Kizzy HSAs RE; Ch Tag CD RAE2; Ch Pharra; Bee PT; Ch Red the Dachshund

03-05-2011, 08:31 PM	#9 (permalink)
Andaka "I like Daffy" Moderator Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: New Douglas, IL ( near St. Louis) Posts: 2,435	Ch. Caralon's Hein vd Lockenheim CD ROM __________________ Daphne and the Gang at Andaka Where Beauty and Brains Come Together http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/germ...&results_in=10 Home of Ch Natty; Ch Doll; Jag RA (ch ptd); Sara RN (ch ptd); Bella (the new one); and Fisher (Mr. Evil) At the Bridge: Ch Kahla CD; Ch Keno UD HSAs OA; Ch Kizzy HSAs RE; Ch Tag CD RAE2; Ch Pharra; Bee PT; Ch Red the Dachshund

03-05-2011, 08:36 PM	#10 (permalink)
Andaka "I like Daffy" Moderator Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: New Douglas, IL ( near St. Louis) Posts: 2,435	Ch. Caralon's {hantom v Lebarland, a Hein son. __________________ Daphne and the Gang at Andaka Where Beauty and Brains Come Together http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/germ...&results_in=10 Home of Ch Natty; Ch Doll; Jag RA (ch ptd); Sara RN (ch ptd); Bella (the new one); and Fisher (Mr. Evil) At the Bridge: Ch Kahla CD; Ch Keno UD HSAs OA; Ch Kizzy HSAs RE; Ch Tag CD RAE2; Ch Pharra; Bee PT; Ch Red the Dachshund

Remove Advertisements Sponsored Links
German Shepherd Advertisement