Questions about the longcoats and the SV

[Whiteshepherds]

Didn't want to hi-jack the two threads about longcoats but had some questions. It can be pretty confusing.

Does the SV recognize the longcoats as a variety or have they changed the breed standard to eliminate the longcoat fault? That would be two different things right? (no?) Has the SV amended the breed standard or do the longcoats have their own standard?

When a breed has different varieties do they compete separately in the conformation ring? As an example, a longcoat wouldn't compete against a stock coat?

For breeding. Two stock coats can produce a longcoat if they both carry the recessive gene, but they can also have stock coats in the same litter.
(this how Annie got the longcoat, except for one male, the other pups in the litter have stock coats)

So what does a breeder have to do to insure that all the pups are longcoats? Do they actually have to breed longcoat to longcoat as opposed to breeding stock coats who carry the recessive gene? (be happy to research this on my own if anyone has a reliable website or book to recommend)

Finally, what's the right term, are they longcoats or longstock?

[Andaka]

For breeding. Two stock coats can produce a longcoat if they both carry the recessive gene, but they can also have stock coats in the same litter.
(this how Annie got the longcoat, except for one male, the other pups in the litter have stock coats)

So what does a breeder have to do to insure that all the pups are longcoats? Do they actually have to breed longcoat to longcoat as opposed to breeding stock coats who carry the recessive gene? (be happy to research this on my own if anyone has a reliable website or book to recommend)

I can't help with the SV questions, but maybe I can with the breeding questions.

Yes, two stock coats can produce long coats if they both carry the LC gene, which is recessive to the stock coat. To insure that all of the puppies are LC, two LC must be bred. You can also breed a stock coat that carries the LC gene to a LC and statistically half of the puppies would be LC, but not necessarily. All of the puppies could be LC or none. Confused yet?

[lhczth]

You would need to breed long coat to long coat to guarantee 100% long coats. Even if you bred a long coat to a stock coat that has the recessive for long coat you could still get stock coated dogs.

Technically the recognized coats are long stock. The term long coat has always referred to the dogs with the long outer guard hairs, but no or little undercoat. This will still be a disqualifying fault.

[RubyTuesday]

Whiteshepherds, IMO, those that breed specifically for LC (long stock coat, actually) have the prettiest, most abundant coats, which is understandable given their emphasis. Most have also sounded (for my tastes) too soft & possibly too laid back. I don't think this goes with the coat, but the LC breeders I'm familiar with are strictly pet lines & many select for the uber soft & sweet temperament.

As much as I love the lc, it's not my priority. The breeders I prefer, (which are largely 'pet breeders'), don't breed for strictly LC so I might never have one. And that's all right, too.

[Whiteshepherds]

Originally Posted by Andaka

Yes, two stock coats can produce long coats if they both carry the LC gene, which is recessive to the stock coat. To insure that all of the puppies are LC, two LC must be bred. You can also breed a stock coat that carries the LC gene to a LC and statistically half of the puppies would be LC, but not necessarily. All of the puppies could be LC or none. Confused yet?

LOL, nope, that explained it perfectly, thanks!

[My2Furkids]

Originally Posted by Andaka

I can't help with the SV questions, but maybe I can with the breeding questions.

Yes, two stock coats can produce long coats if they both carry the LC gene, which is recessive to the stock coat. To insure that all of the puppies are LC, two LC must be bred. You can also breed a stock coat that carries the LC gene to a LC and statistically half of the puppies would be LC, but not necessarily. All of the puppies could be LC or none. Confused yet?

All of the puppies from a breeding such as this would at least carry the gene for long coats though, correct?

[Andaka]

All of the puppies from a breeding such as this would at least carry the gene for long coats though, correct?

Yes, they would.

[Whiteshepherds]

I found this about the amendment to the breed standard. (SV)

Breed Standard Amendment - SV
New German Shepherd breed standard, new GSD breed standard, German Shepherd Dog hair types