So who do you blame?

[Lauri & The Gang]

We've talked about how the breed is falling apart but who is to blame.

My personal opinion? it's 100% the fault of the JUDGES.

Breeders (as a majority) breed for what wins. If judges put up the banana back, egg beater, ski slope, no drive dogs - then that's what breeders will continue to breed.

Breeders and handlers put their dogs under a judge they think will like that type of dog - based on past judging experiences.

If judges stopped putting up the banana back dogs breeders would stop producing them.

[Jax08]

I think the breeders will breed dogs to win but they also have a responsibility to breed healthy dogs. The judges can only judge what is in front of them. So...the blame is equal...

[Amaruq]

I think partial blame comes to those that do NOT show their dogs that meet the standards but are "working" dogs not "show" dogs. If the judges had the option AND judged according to the standard not the name of the dog, the color of the dog or the dope on two legs at the other end of the dog.......

While I agree the judging has a large part of the responsibility, the breeders *should* have the responsibilty of putting in their dogs that are the best examples of the breed regardless of color, kennel, line, or handler. The judge can't put up a dog that isn't there.

[Liesje]

As far as German show lines go, I agree most of the judges are nuts. I'm not sure about Am lines, but many if not most of the SV judges do have their own kennels and breeding programs. I was just reading the bio of a well known judge, stating that their program focused on only breeding dogs with sound nerve and good working ability....yet when I look at what this judge "puts up" at shows....anything but!! Many of the judges are in cahoots with other exhibitors. Pretty much anything you make up can and does happen. It's hilarious and disturbing at the same time. The WDA just suspended a well known breeder for dying dogs and breaking their tails, which was known and possibly encouraged by a judge.

*barfs*

Just look at the Sieger Shows..... Boy von Zorra, great dog in work and really nicely put together. I really really like this dog, from a show standpoint. He got V2 I believe right before the Seiger Show (so second place since this was a show with no VA ratings). Then at the Seiger show he finishes at the bottom of the class, one of the dogs he had recently beat getting a much higher rating. Boy was noted for his bitework performance. Or Javir. Cannot dispute his work and also nice conformation. The crowd went wild for him in Ulm. The judge had given this long speech about improving the work, not going along with ring fads....and who wins? Vegas, again, with Javir at V54 (9 VA dogs above that).

The judges are saying one thing and doing another. That is fact.

[Liesje]

Anyway, I blame everyone. Judges for being hypocrites so easily bought, breeders for being kennel blind or just plain ignorant, people/exhibitors for not doing their research and falling for whatever the judges and kennels are spewing, the organizations for not being willing to force change..... pretty much everyone but the dogs are to blame.

[Doc]

Ethical breeders breed German shepherds and rarely have winning dogs because they are from a different mold than the trendy dog. "Breeders" bred whatever is in fashion and wins in the ring. Judges should not be in the breeding business especially if they are judging dogs from their own kennels. Money and Greed now dominate which contributes to the decline of this breed.

Dying coats, breaking tails, judges being paid off; I haven't heard of any juiced dogs, but it would not surprise me. How much more abuse can we stand? Are we at the point of no return?

[Liesje]

Originally Posted By: DocAre we at the point of no return?

I don't know about this but definitely to the point where if my dog were to place high at one of these shows, I'd probably be repulsed rather than proud!

[Andaka]

Alot of it is the judges, but also they can only put up what is shown to them. If we want to change the perception of what a GSD should look like, then the exhibitors need to step up and show "correct" dogs. They need to spend the money to advertise in the show magazines so that the judges will see them and learn to appreciate them both mentally and structurally.

And it won't be easy. It is a tall hill to climb.

[Lauri & The Gang]

Originally Posted By: AndakaAlot of it is the judges, but also they can only put up what is shown to them.

But the judges does have the option to without BOB. I know - had it happen to me with my Skye Terrier. It was just us and another Skye and the judge said neither dog was a good enough representative of the breed to be BOB.

I went up to the judge after he was finished in the rang and THANKED him for being so honest. The other Skye owner left in a huff.

[Andaka]

Here is what you do -- find a small show in your area. You can check previous entries at a show on many websites of the show superintendents or the AKC site. Get together a group of working line dogs and enter them (but don't spill the beans to others not in the group -- you don't want the AM show line dogs coming). That way you are being judged against other dogs of the same type. And you give the judge a chance to learn about your type of dog.