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Old 12-28-2013, 10:11 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default TIGHT Inbreeding

What are your experiences with WL dogs inbred tight. Goal oriented not accidental, on good dogs.
Im talking brother/sister, parent/progeny, grandparent/grandprogeny, dogs appearing several times close up etc.

This seems to be more common with Mal/Dutchy folks, hunting dogs and game bred dogs.

From what I hear the benifits (if it works out well) are extremely prepotent typey dogs that pass on their genetics well and you will be more likely to run into the potential pit falls in your bloodline.

The downsides are smaller litters, and bad recessives popping up both temperment and health. Obviously one would assume you would cull hard.

So any experiences good bad with such a work oriented breeding? Seems like going tight with appropriate outcrosses from time to time would increase the likelyhood of the pups you want expressing the traits you want..or thats the idea anyways.
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Old 12-31-2013, 01:36 AM   #2 (permalink)
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I don't think it is good idea today with most West dogs, but some years ago you could do it with the right compliments. Jmo
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Old 01-01-2014, 07:37 PM   #3 (permalink)
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What makes it more possible with mals and dutchies?
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Old 01-09-2014, 07:51 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Just wrote a long piece on this subject on another venue, don't want to bore people on this forum, but basically it goes back to the beginnings of these breeds. In summary, the German Shepherd needs to be balanced for continuity of keeping it strong,( compensation breeding), Mals/Dutchies naturally have stronger singular traits that when amplified still allow the dog to be functional to its purpose. Sorry about lateness of response, I only check this forum about once a week.
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Old 01-09-2014, 08:22 AM   #5 (permalink)
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GSD are like a complex stew , many ingredients without one dominant trait.
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Old 01-09-2014, 11:03 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Tight inbreeding?? Inbreeding is always tight breeding.
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Old 02-01-2014, 03:40 AM   #7 (permalink)
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I'd love to be pointed to the longer piece you did on this topic
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Old 02-01-2014, 11:08 AM   #8 (permalink)
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My boyfriends dog is linebred 2-3 on Ellute, which I consider a relatively tight linebreeding. He is an incredible dog, balanced in the house with any other dogs/people and environmentally stable everywhere else. He has incredible drive in all 3 phases of IPO. Super, super stable dog. Just had xrays done and hips and elbows looks great. But that's my only experience with a breeding of this type.

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Old 02-01-2014, 03:21 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cliffson1 View Post
Just wrote a long piece on this subject on another venue, don't want to bore people on this forum, but basically it goes back to the beginnings of these breeds. In summary, the German Shepherd needs to be balanced for continuity of keeping it strong,( compensation breeding), Mals/Dutchies naturally have stronger singular traits that when amplified still allow the dog to be functional to its purpose. Sorry about lateness of response, I only check this forum about once a week.

Id love a link.

The Ellute breeding sounds interesting. Its hard to find nice tight breedings like that. Was there a lot of variation in the litter?

So correct me if Im wrong, you are saying that mals/dutchys tend to express things like drive and nerve more strongly then GSDs? So GSD breedings tend to be more about offsetting weakness instead of emphasising and concentrating strengths?

Would the issue be a lack of worthy individuals to go tight on? Or to many negative recessives within the pool of potentially worthy individuals?
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Old 02-28-2014, 04:49 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Very interesting question that I've always though about myself, Blitzkrieg1. I've never seen a half brother half sister breeding (2-2)with the GSD and every time I've even seen it mentioned, I've seen the way people cringe. I've always wondered about it, because in the other breeds that you mentioned (Mals/Dutchies, hounds, sporting dogs, game bred dogs,hunting terriers,etc.), it's quite common. Showing a GSD pedigree to a fancier from one of the other working breeds and mentioning a dog bred 5-4 on a famous GSD,(say Mink) would be almost laughable . One thing I've learned is when looking at a GSD pedigree, you REALLY have to know WHERE those traits are coming from. Cliffson, I do understand a lot better now that you have mentioned the balance of the breed and being able to maintain it. I had always thought of other reasons.
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