Input on this Pedigree, please?

[Chris Wild]

I don't see any attraction in this pedigree and am not sure what draws you to it. It is such a mismatch of bloodlines and dogs that there is absolutely no way to predict what the outcome might be. The genetics are just all over the place and chances are that even amongst littermates there will be huge variations based on what traits each individual inherits from what ancestors.

However, it appears that these 2 dogs have been bred together before this. In which case, ignore the pedigree and look at those dogs as the real flesh and blood products of this mating will provide the best indication of what to expect in the current litter. Get contact information for their owners from the breeder, and contact as many of those people as you can asking specific questions about their dogs as they would relate to your situation and what you want in a dog. If any are close to you, go meet the dogs in person. If that research indicates that the majority of the offspring from previous breedings of these dogs would be a good fit for you, then it is likely that a pup from the current litter would as well. If however most, or all, of those previous dogs would not be a good fit, than I certainly wouldn't expect the current pups to be any different. Don't take the breeder's word for it that they are producing what you want. Not saying that they are dishonest or anything like that, but don't forget that they have something to sell to you. And there is something called "kennel blindness" that can affect breeders too, where just like any other pet owner who loves their dogs they can become too close to their dogs to really see and acknowledge their faults. So it always pays to obtain more objective information from others, particularly those with first hand experiences with the results of these breedings.

[cliffson1]

What Chris said!

[carmspack]

"I was more drawn to the litter because of the Dam, Kafi, and her imported Sire/pedigree." what? the dam's sire is
Ezekiel
vom Bountyfull OFA-G

Double K Choice of Texas or "Harley"
black/tan/grey(CANADA)


Harleyphoto
Dekers True Grit
or "Texas"
OFA29F
OFEL29
black/tan/greyWatch
Dekker Kiona Masuta
Cita Mocha VESA's L.S.A.T.
CD Asta Jayr
CD
Sultan's Storm Shadow Sultan Shadow Magrath Butch 2nd Franzer O'Halloran Leapchew Shadowhawk's Intermezzo
Shadowhawk's Denver Shadowhawk's Fireworks Ole O's Wyona
black(CANADA)



Sunshadow's Target
SchH2
Cherry v Schienerberg
SchH3 IPO3 CDX V Boris v Trogenbach
SchH3 FH Britta v Korbelbach
SchH3 Sunshadow's Becca
Ulk v Bungalow
SchH3 FHTanja vd Jungen Hansen
SchH3 Chricava's Valencia SunshineV Semiahmoo's Gunner
Western Canadian SiegerQuatsch vom CellerlandSemiahmoo's Rebecca
Western Canadian Siegerin
SG Chricava's Melba
black
Pozmanns Argo
ScH1 BC YouthSieger1977Chricava's Freda

there are a lot of unknowns and some of the names were a franchise - you bought their stock , bred according to their dictates, pups sold under their name and a percentage went back to them either in pup or cash. yes. Even so that is not reason enough. The dam has a mother line , and you are not buying the dam you are buying offspring so that brings in another 2 sets of parents - 3 lines that are not the dams sire - who is not imported.

this "Their mindset does not entirely match my high level of working dog ideas, but they do believe this match can and has produced high quality dogs with working capabilities" is a contradiction as was the statement immediately before that saying " and it does seem to match what you say about the breeder's aim or intent."
I don't understand ? why in the blazes go with them then. They don't know working , because they are not involved. Just how old is the female? Seems she has had a few litters. Her oldest is from 2007 making them 5 years old. I hope that she was at least 2 years so she is potentially 7 years old with 3 litters under her belt and a fourth possible. When she has that fourth she'll be over 8 years old? Too much.
the sire of the litter has american show lines "Coal Town"
west German show lines extremely angulated "canadian show lines" -- no reason for the pairing . These were not working dogs in any stretch of the imagination.

good luck.

for the pleasure of it, and to be able to offer impressive dogs at affordable prices

[intriGSD]

Originally Posted by Ace952

Sounds like u have your mind made up. Good luck.

If I had had my mind made up I wouldn't have opened the thread. I'd appreciate constructive comments to the issues I requested help on. If not, don't post.

To the others- especially Carmspack, Freestyle, Chris Wild - thank you for your input. I had questions that with your help turned into more important questions that I, myself, needed to provide answers to.

I visited the breeder today and evaluated the pups. They were great pups, but as was said by all, not working pedigree. Had I not asked myself more important questions I may have made concessions in evaluating my test results and purchased the pup of choice in this litter. I did NOT.

Now my search continues and would appreciate any help in locating a reputable breeder in my region. My eyes are set on Haus Gill to start with and will be contacting the kennel. Any thoughts on this kennel?

Any other breeder recommendations in my region?

[codmaster]

Originally Posted by Capone22

I think you could get a more qualified working line pup for around 1500. I'd skip that breeder all together. Jmo


Sent from my iPhone using Petguide.com Free App

Me too!

[codmaster]

Originally Posted by intriGSD

If I had had my mind made up I wouldn't have opened the thread. I'd appreciate constructive comments to the issues I requested help on. If not, don't post.

Yes, certainly that attitude will make me (and others more knowledgable?) much more eager to help in any way I can!

To the others- especially Carmspack, Freestyle, Chris Wild - thank you for your input. I had questions that with your help turned into more important questions that I, myself, needed to provide answers to.

I visited the breeder today and evaluated the pups. They were great pups, but as was said by all, not working pedigree. Had I not asked myself more important questions I may have made concessions in evaluating my test results and purchased the pup of choice in this litter. I did NOT. Great for you!

Now my search continues and would appreciate any help in locating a reputable breeder in my region. My eyes are set on Haus Gill to start with and will be contacting the kennel. Any thoughts on this kennel?

Any other breeder recommendations in my region?

Good luck!

[robk]

Originally Posted by intriGSD

If I had had my mind made up I wouldn't have opened the thread. I'd appreciate constructive comments to the issues I requested help on. If not, don't post.

To the others- especially Carmspack, Freestyle, Chris Wild - thank you for your input. I had questions that with your help turned into more important questions that I, myself, needed to provide answers to.

I visited the breeder today and evaluated the pups. They were great pups, but as was said by all, not working pedigree. Had I not asked myself more important questions I may have made concessions in evaluating my test results and purchased the pup of choice in this litter. I did NOT.

Now my search continues and would appreciate any help in locating a reputable breeder in my region. My eyes are set on Haus Gill to start with and will be contacting the kennel. Any thoughts on this kennel?

Any other breeder recommendations in my region?

I like what I see on the Haus Gill web site.

[Smithie86]

Keep looking....

[intriGSD]

Originally Posted by Smithie86

Keep looking....

Is there reasoning behind that? Are you pointing me to your website?

[lhczth]

We are not allowed to bash breeders on this board so often it is just safer (to avoid a warning) to say "keep looking" or "this is not a breeder I would get a puppy from". Sue is just telling you that this is not a breeder she would purchase from.

Pointing to one's own website would be advertising so that too is not allowed.