How To Find A Good Working GSD

JohnnyB · 02-25-2011, 10:12 PM

Wasn't sure where to really ask this.

I've been doing some online searching and European (DDR/Czech) bloodline GSD have peaked my interest. They seem to have the traits I'm looking for and I love the dark sables.

I currently have a show line GSD. While he has been GREAT as my first GSD, he doesn't have enough drive(s) to work much. So, I starting to look into getting a GSD somewhere between what I have and something totally off the chain.

I know nothing about which blood lines are good by looking a pedigrees. So, how do I go about finding a breeder that has blood lines that will produce what I want (I realize there's no guarantee & it's target) ? Looking for good temperament, confidence, solid nerves, good drives and an on off switch. First and foremost we need a family companion. I believe that's possible...If not, I'll have to reconsider the working dog idea.

I was thinking finding a local breeder would be nice. Does that really matter?

I'm in absolutely no hurry. This is something I'm consider over the next 1 - 4 years. So, I could wait for a breeder to say they think they have a dog that meets all I'm seeking. Just don't know how to find that breeder.

Any tips on how locate a breeder and/or recommended breeders would be much appreciated.

Elaine · 02-25-2011, 11:08 PM

Your best bet is to get recommendations. Where do you live?

crackem · 02-25-2011, 11:13 PM

your best bet is to go where the dogs are being worked and trained. Learn what the dogs have, learn where they are being produced, learn what kind of dogs you like. Then get a dog from there.

recommendations are just opinions and I remember when I first started in this sport I read a lot of comments and opinions from people, then years later I finally met some of them and their dogs. Needless to say, i see internet advice in a totally different light these days.

onyx'girl · 02-25-2011, 11:15 PM

Starting with research, you are doing it now. I would write down what you want from/for your next companion; any training goals, how much time you have to spend on those goals and any GSD training venues that are local to you may help you in your search. Then go to those venues and learn about the different lines(even if you have to travel a bit)...you have time on your side, so enjoy your research, in a year, you'll be surprised at what you want two years from now!

JohnnyB · 02-26-2011, 08:38 AM

I live in southwest OH.

Aside from the traits I mentioned above my goals as I see them now would be to have the ability to consider (not particular order except 1):

1) Companion
2) Possible trial work (such as Schutzund, French Ring, PSA, or...)
3) Agility
4) Tracking
5) Protection

Not sure I would really do any competition. But, rather have something challenge the dog and myself with. I had considered tracking to work w/our LEO. But, I'm sure that takes a huge commitment that I don't know I would have.

It seems the European lines have these traits and rich pigments are an added bonus for me. However, I'm sure there are other lines and poor lines w/in the European. I see people refer to a dog's pedigree but reading the lineage tells me nothing at this point.

Going to clubs that work is mentioned. I have a local trainer that I have worked with. But, they work mostly with Malinois and Pit Bulls.

What clubs are recommended to link up with?

**MaggieRoseLee** · 02-26-2011, 08:42 AM

Things to look for in a 'Responsible' Breeder <- click on that for some great links and info.

cliffson1 · 02-26-2011, 08:58 AM

Go and watch some events in which German Shepherds are doing the things you listed. Talk to people at the events. Get a chance to see young puppies from the stock you are considering...then after going to a few of these events and SEEING some of these dogs in person and perform...then come back to the board with questions; and the answers will make much more sense so as to let you make a better informed decision.

wolfstraum · 02-26-2011, 09:00 AM

take the time to go to some competitions and watch - even before clubs - in clubs there are pressures to buy dogs within, and that can be a good thing or a bad - but watch dogs work - even at AKC obedience shows, look at pedigrees when you find dogs you like and dogs you don't like....try to study pedigrees of dogs who are breeding and look at the databases (pedigree, working dog eu and OFAs) to start to compile information on what is out there - after you see some of course - I'd recommend going to some of the bigger trials like the AWDF if you can or maybe the Masters.....

Lee

Smithie86 · 02-26-2011, 09:09 AM

www.2011awdf.com

GSDElsa · 02-26-2011, 09:10 AM

Definitely read this if you haven't:

Things to look for in a 'Responsible' Breeder

There are lots and lots of good working line breeders out there. Everyone has things that are important to them. For me, I really wanted a breeder that works their own dogs. I grew up in the horse world and didn't take trainers and breeders very seriously who had nice horses they paid other people to show and train. I took that same opinion to dogs. How do you really KNOW your dog if you aren't training it AND trialing it away from home? Dogs react differently in different situations. However, this isn't a big deal to some people.

To me, titles are also important (protection related)...preferably titles that are "away from home." I don't buy that you can say your dog has great nerves and amazing ability and doesn't need to be trialed when the dog has never trained a day in it's life outside of home field advantage. Sure it looks good on the field it's trained on since puppyhood with the helper he's seen twice a week for his whole life. The same dog might totally fold under pressure with a different helper in a strange place. But again, not important to some people. As evidenced by the numerous page threads going on.

I would say if you're interested in possibly doing a protection sport to go out to the different clubs in your area and get a feel for each one. Each sport is pretty different from each other...so find what kind you are drawn to and IF you really want to do it. A dog you're looking to do Ringsport with might not be the same dog a breeder guides you to if really what you're going to do is tracking.

Just go to the various associations that do the sports your interested in and look up what clubs are near you. Then ask to go out and watch for awhile.

And to clarify, pretty much all GSD's are "European lines" with the exception of American Show Lines and American Backyard Breeding Extra-Special Delight Version. ADL is definitely not the route people will send you if you're planning on doing Mondio!

Also keep doing research. DDR dogs and Czech dogs are GENERALLY quite different. Also consider West German Working Lines (which then fragments into "Belgian" lines or "Dutch" lines, etc).

02-25-2011, 10:12 PM	#1 (permalink)
JohnnyB Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The Heartland Posts: 63	How To Find A Good Working GSD Wasn't sure where to really ask this. I've been doing some online searching and European (DDR/Czech) bloodline GSD have peaked my interest. They seem to have the traits I'm looking for and I love the dark sables. I currently have a show line GSD. While he has been GREAT as my first GSD, he doesn't have enough drive(s) to work much. So, I starting to look into getting a GSD somewhere between what I have and something totally off the chain. I know nothing about which blood lines are good by looking a pedigrees. So, how do I go about finding a breeder that has blood lines that will produce what I want (I realize there's no guarantee & it's target) ? Looking for good temperament, confidence, solid nerves, good drives and an on off switch. First and foremost we need a family companion. I believe that's possible...If not, I'll have to reconsider the working dog idea. I was thinking finding a local breeder would be nice. Does that really matter? I'm in absolutely no hurry. This is something I'm consider over the next 1 - 4 years. So, I could wait for a breeder to say they think they have a dog that meets all I'm seeking. Just don't know how to find that breeder. Any tips on how locate a breeder and/or recommended breeders would be much appreciated.

02-25-2011, 11:08 PM	#2 (permalink)
Elaine Crowned Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Minnesota Posts: 3,783	Your best bet is to get recommendations. Where do you live? __________________ Elaine and the herd

02-25-2011, 11:15 PM	#4 (permalink)
onyx'girl Crowned Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: SW, MI Posts: 17,605	Starting with research, you are doing it now. I would write down what you want from/for your next companion; any training goals, how much time you have to spend on those goals and any GSD training venues that are local to you may help you in your search. Then go to those venues and learn about the different lines(even if you have to travel a bit)...you have time on your side, so enjoy your research, in a year, you'll be surprised at what you want two years from now! __________________ Jane~ Kept by Onyx, Kacie and Gideon v Wildhaus aka Karlo

02-26-2011, 08:42 AM	#6 (permalink)
MaggieRoseLee The Agility Rocks! Moderator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Bushkill, PA (The Poconos!) Posts: 22,205	Things to look for in a 'Responsible' Breeder <- click on that for some great links and info. __________________ MACH2 Bretta Lee Wildhaus CGC TC TQX Glory B Wildhaus NA, NJ, NF + LOL (still) "*Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." - Oscar Wilde*

02-26-2011, 09:00 AM	#8 (permalink)
wolfstraum Crowned Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: PA Posts: 7,088	take the time to go to some competitions and watch - even before clubs - in clubs there are pressures to buy dogs within, and that can be a good thing or a bad - but watch dogs work - even at AKC obedience shows, look at pedigrees when you find dogs you like and dogs you don't like....try to study pedigrees of dogs who are breeding and look at the databases (pedigree, working dog eu and OFAs) to start to compile information on what is out there - after you see some of course - I'd recommend going to some of the bigger trials like the AWDF if you can or maybe the Masters..... Lee __________________ Csabre Sch1, Hexe Sch2, Bengal, Kyra, Kira & Kougar v Wolfstraum ~ Basha Sch3, Ghost Sch3 - Danger Sch1 SAR - ATB/Ret - Kyra, Sch3, Alice Sch1, Kelsey, Fenja Sch3 wolfstraum.net

02-25-2011, 11:13 PM	#3 (permalink)
crackem Elite Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,195	your best bet is to go where the dogs are being worked and trained. Learn what the dogs have, learn where they are being produced, learn what kind of dogs you like. Then get a dog from there. recommendations are just opinions and I remember when I first started in this sport I read a lot of comments and opinions from people, then years later I finally met some of them and their dogs. Needless to say, i see internet advice in a totally different light these days.

02-26-2011, 08:38 AM	#5 (permalink)
JohnnyB Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The Heartland Posts: 63	I live in southwest OH. Aside from the traits I mentioned above my goals as I see them now would be to have the ability to consider (not particular order except 1): 1) Companion 2) Possible trial work (such as Schutzund, French Ring, PSA, or...) 3) Agility 4) Tracking 5) Protection Not sure I would really do any competition. But, rather have something challenge the dog and myself with. I had considered tracking to work w/our LEO. But, I'm sure that takes a huge commitment that I don't know I would have. It seems the European lines have these traits and rich pigments are an added bonus for me. However, I'm sure there are other lines and poor lines w/in the European. I see people refer to a dog's pedigree but reading the lineage tells me nothing at this point. Going to clubs that work is mentioned. I have a local trainer that I have worked with. But, they work mostly with Malinois and Pit Bulls. What clubs are recommended to link up with?

02-26-2011, 08:58 AM	#7 (permalink)
cliffson1 Knighted Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 2,929	Go and watch some events in which German Shepherds are doing the things you listed. Talk to people at the events. Get a chance to see young puppies from the stock you are considering...then after going to a few of these events and SEEING some of these dogs in person and perform...then come back to the board with questions; and the answers will make much more sense so as to let you make a better informed decision.

02-26-2011, 09:09 AM	#9 (permalink)
Smithie86 Crowned Member Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Nashville, TN and Budapest HU Posts: 3,807	www.2011awdf.com __________________ Sue www.k9imports.com V KK1 Molinari Enzo SCH3,IPO3,VK3,FH(WUSVx3, FCIx4) HOT KK1 Frodo v Biezenhoeve SCH3,IPO3,HPO3 (WUSVx2, FCIx2)HOT KK1 Tarnoki-Felvigyazo Quamatz SCH3 (HOT), KK1 Griff v Tajgetosz SCH3(BHOT)

02-26-2011, 09:10 AM	#10 (permalink)
GSDElsa Crowned Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Central, NY Posts: 3,706	Definitely read this if you haven't: Things to look for in a 'Responsible' Breeder There are lots and lots of good working line breeders out there. Everyone has things that are important to them. For me, I really wanted a breeder that works their own dogs. I grew up in the horse world and didn't take trainers and breeders very seriously who had nice horses they paid other people to show and train. I took that same opinion to dogs. How do you really KNOW your dog if you aren't training it AND trialing it away from home? Dogs react differently in different situations. However, this isn't a big deal to some people. To me, titles are also important (protection related)...preferably titles that are "away from home." I don't buy that you can say your dog has great nerves and amazing ability and doesn't need to be trialed when the dog has never trained a day in it's life outside of home field advantage. Sure it looks good on the field it's trained on since puppyhood with the helper he's seen twice a week for his whole life. The same dog might totally fold under pressure with a different helper in a strange place. But again, not important to some people. As evidenced by the numerous page threads going on. I would say if you're interested in possibly doing a protection sport to go out to the different clubs in your area and get a feel for each one. Each sport is pretty different from each other...so find what kind you are drawn to and IF you really want to do it. A dog you're looking to do Ringsport with might not be the same dog a breeder guides you to if really what you're going to do is tracking. Just go to the various associations that do the sports your interested in and look up what clubs are near you. Then ask to go out and watch for awhile. And to clarify, pretty much all GSD's are "European lines" with the exception of American Show Lines and American Backyard Breeding Extra-Special Delight Version. ADL is definitely not the route people will send you if you're planning on doing Mondio! Also keep doing research. DDR dogs and Czech dogs are GENERALLY quite different. Also consider West German Working Lines (which then fragments into "Belgian" lines or "Dutch" lines, etc). __________________ Justine, mom to: - Elsa - BrightStar Rescue - "Da Pookins" - Medo Aritar Bastet - "The Beast From The East"

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