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Old 05-07-2014, 12:19 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Do some dogs not tolerate raw? Scared...

Frankly I haven't done any research at all on raw.

I feed a couple of chicken of chicken backs and some hearts and gizzards a day as a meal (too small of a portion?). They get kibble in the morning because I fear nutrient deficiencies. We've been at it for maybe a month now...

Smokey seems fine on it.

Zeeva gets diarrhea from either the raw or the kibble. She also looks about as green as a white GSD can look after eating raw. And by green I mean nauseous...

I'm also scared of the raw bones. How do those not pulverize their intestines and stomach? I've this fear of a bone poking a hole in their stomach...

What are we doing wrong? Portion suggestions? Help?
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Old 05-07-2014, 12:41 PM   #2 (permalink)
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you can use bone meal or calcium pills with meals instead of bone
honestly hearts and gizzards may cause loose stool and the backs are nearly all bone
if you want to do raw do some research and make it happen
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Old 05-07-2014, 12:56 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Look at the BARF forum, and look at the menu's thread. There is so much information on how to get started. The bones don't puncture because they are softer and get digested. They would of they were cooked because the composition of the bone has completely changed.

You have to have the right balance of bone, MM, and organs.. too much or too little of one or the other may cause the issues you are seeing. Look at threads this sub-forum it's really really helpful and has links to many different sites.

I used to do raw and buy everything and portion out. Now I do kibble in the morning and a premade raw at night that is portioned for me.. I'm lazy like that though
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Old 05-07-2014, 12:57 PM   #4 (permalink)
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If Zeeva cannot handle either raw or kibble I would take her to the vet.
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Old 05-07-2014, 01:03 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Sorry, you CAN'T use bone meal or calcium supplements to replace the bone in the raw diet.

Bones do not just provide calcium, but a host of other important minerals and nutrients, all in the right ratios, needed in order for the body to utilize calcium appropriately. The marrow in the bone is a very important source of nutrition also, which is lost when bone meal is used. I think most available bone meal is made from cooked bones, so not as bio-available as eating regular bones.

I remember the worry I had about feeding raw bones to my dog when I started raw. No matter how much I read or heard that chicken bones are soft enough to not cause issues, get pulverized and digested . . . well, you still worry. So I did an experiment to find out just how 'soft' the bones were.

I decided to try and chomp down on a raw chicken bone to see for myself! I took a thigh bone, took a deep breath, closed my eyes, and CHOMP!!! Surprise! I bit down waaaaay too hard expecting the bone to be hard! It was like biting down on a crisp cracker, and the bone broke into a lot of small pieces, like a cracker would. It was true! Raw chicken bones are soft, they crush and don't splinter. (spit spit spit!)

I'm not sure what to suggest for Zeeva and her GI issues with raw? Maybe try introducing it more gradually. It is normal for a dog not used to raw to have runny poops for the first few days. Maybe you can try just doing raw for a few days to let Zeeva's system get used to it. I would stick to chicken, no Organ meats for the first few days in order not to introduce too much variety at first.
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Old 05-07-2014, 01:15 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Highly processed diet ( kibble) vs raw diet affects the stomach acidity and it's ability to cope with items which it is not used to.....more pronounced in some dogs.

It takes 7-10 days after changing to a raw diet for the PH level to drop to 2 which is the preferred level of gastric acidity.

Feeding kibble tends to not maintain a PH level of 2. Raw meat acclimates the digestive system of a dog to it's natural level ( PH 2 ) and in doing so, allows the dog to best digest bones.

And I agree with myboy diesel....do some research.


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Old 05-07-2014, 01:47 PM   #7 (permalink)
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I forgot....the bonemeal which I use at times does still have the marrow in it.

The place I get the bone meal from describes the process as a 10 step process of multiple grindings (whole bone)...and then a drying process..with some low heat but not enough to constitute as cooking the bone meal...probably like a food dehydrator process of sorts. I believe this particular bonemeal is produced strictly with dogs in mind so it probably is different than most other bone meal.

I use the bone meal as a component for some of the raw treats I make my dog, otherwise lamb shank, chicken necks and backs, chicken leg quarters and cow tails.

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Old 05-07-2014, 01:55 PM   #8 (permalink)
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SuperG - that sounds that sounds like good stuff. When I think of bonemeal, I think of the stuff people buy as fertilizer for their garden. I think some people do use gardening bone meal for their dog - I've heard it can be contaminated with heavy metals, in addition to not being a complete bone product.
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Old 05-08-2014, 12:06 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Castlemaid View Post
SuperG - that sounds that sounds like good stuff. When I think of bonemeal, I think of the stuff people buy as fertilizer for their garden. I think some people do use gardening bone meal for their dog - I've heard it can be contaminated with heavy metals, in addition to not being a complete bone product.
Agreed...I wouldn't choose to use gardening bonemeal for the reasons you cited....except for my tomatoes...maybe.

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Old 05-08-2014, 12:13 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Read Welcome to the Raw Dog Ranch and make sure you are doing everything right, lots of info there!
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