I've got a two year old Christmas baby GSD with severe allergies that have been confirmed by blood tests. He is currently on allergy shots to help with his external allergies like grass and certain trees.
I've modified his diet with Purina One Beyond to avoid wheat, corn, peas, potatoes and pretty much all starches (tests confirm he's allergic to almost all of them). In addition he is allergic to pork.
He also is suffering from a chronic yeast issue that leaves him very itchy and with black scaley hairless skin (from itching I suppose).
I've been suggested by many two switch him to a raw food diet but I'm weary for fear of malnutrition and possible salmonella poisoning (vet advised against it do to salmonella and other possible illnesses related to raw feeding). They suggested cooking the meats first but not including bones (after cooking they splinter)
I'm looking for some serious guidance here. Im looking to help my pride and joy Panzer get better and lead a full happy life. If raw food diet is the ticket I'm all for it. With my dog being sick as he is with this chronic yeast/itchy skin problem, how should I start him off?
Can someone provide a list of what Raw Meaty Bones are considered for each source of protein (i.e. chicken, beef, etc.) I'd like the same detailed list for muscle meat and the last category as well please.
Should I use supplements to help prevent malnourishment from a raw meat diet?
My GSD weighs about 70 pounds give or take 5 pounds, is 2 years old, and due to this skin condition he isn't very active right now.....(He has no hair on roughly 40% of his body maybe more and its been below 20 degrees here for well over a few months......) The best I can do so he doesn't get sick is throw the ball with him for an hour or so in the house but there isn't that much room for him to really run and be truly active. I suppose it's more for his spirits if anything else.......Please help! My GSD looks like he's miserable!!!!
Thanks guys for all your help.
This isn't responsive to your question exactly but...
Are you supplementing with organic, unrefined coconut oil? (Good antifungal supplement that reportedly helps with yeast.)
Are you regularly using an antifungal/antibacterial shampoo like Ketachlor (ketoconazole and chlorhexidine 2.3%)?
My vet told me Ketachlor baths are step one in battling nasty yeast on the skin of foster dogs -- we have to bathe at least once a week, and with some dogs twice a week, in this medicated shampoo, but it does work--slowly. It relieves the itching almost immediately and improves the smell immediately too! After a few weeks, the pink skin emerges and you see less and less black. The hair regrows too. You have to keep on it though.
Here it is (note that a prescription from your vet is required):
Ketochlor Shampoo Rx
There are a few other brands with similar products but you want to look for both of these active ingredients.
Here it is:
Ketochlor Shampoo Rx
there is a lot of advice for the chronic fungus problem already in the OPs other thread http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum...ffles-vet.html
why did this baffle the vets though?
anyway -- raw food is an excellent choice .
you are going to have to give this dog a good source of probiotics , the higher the bacterial strains the better . This will displace the bad and replace a good gut colony of beneficial bacteria . Takes time .
Digestive enzymes and probiotics together can help heal leaky gut .
Adding Olive leaf powder is an excellent anti fungal .
as said in the other thread , this is going to be a detox situation . Help the liver , nettles or milk thistle . Lots of good clean water - no chlorine or fluoride . The dog may look worse in his detox period . The dog may have loose stools , urinate more , have gas , and appear fatigued . The coat will be shed so will look shabby , skin will be renewed .
If the Herxheimer's is too much , take a day off , or cut back . The system is overburdened with the die-off -- period also known as the healing crisis.
Spirulina and Chlorella help with the detox - chelation
Topically quality coconut oil and even with a drop of lavender or oregano , both being anti fungal , is soothing . Vetericyn combats external fungus and bacteria , and is soothing , while contributing to new skin regeneration.
I only mentioned the skin issue because the person who told me I should make a thread in here to change diets, said to specify the skin issue so I wouldn't be told to give them yogurt and such.
Where and what should I get for probiotics and how much should I give him? Ive been using unrefined coconut oil (really hard almost like wax) to rub on his skin....Is this okay? And where do I get all of the other items? Are they purchased through the vet?
coconut oil is like butter -- warm it up just a little and you will have liquid
the skin issue is pretty central to the problem . That is your symptom. Disbiosis is your cause. What is being recommended is your solution.
nothing wrong with yogurt if it is plain , no sugar of any sort , preferably whole 3.25 % not the zero % . Fat is needed to take benefit of calcium . Generally yogurt is not a strong factor for probiotics . KEFIR is much better .
Another important additive is MSM , an organic sulfur , which regulates the pH , is a natural pain killer , helps new skin and hair production, helps with detox and other benefits.
vet (especially one who was baffled) won't have these -- go to the health food store , check out Dogs Naturally Magazine which has many good articles and products in the on line shop Dogs Naturally Magazine
I just changed to a different probiotic and this one seems to make a huge difference. It is called Proviable-DC. Changing to a raw diet would be beneficial to your dog even if he didn't have skin issues. Vets always use the scare tactics of you getting samonella. Just make sure you wash your hands afterwards. I use vinegar water to clean my counters. The only people I've heard of getting samonella from dog food are the ones that feed kibble. Good luck and I hope your pup gets better. Here is a link to the Proviable-DC http://www.amazon.com/Proviable-DC-Cats-Dogs-Capsules/dp/B001O3UE9E/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1389272447&sr=8-1&keywords=proviable+dc
^^^Lots of RAW dog food pics on here (some kibble w/toppings, but ignore those:))
^^^Laurie and the Gang started this thread (again for visual and variety), you can click on her link to get to RAW dog ranch for ratio's
^^^ This is a member (Nyx) who came here, like you, with same issue, massive hair loss, blackened skin (also on the hamster wheel of conventional treatment) and at a loss as to what to do...
^^^This is their updated thread...I believe it was 3 months later:D
This can be resolved. Hang in.
Oh, and the reason for no yogurt is it is a milk product, lactic acid is a sugar...at this time and with 40% hair loss...cold turkey (like quitting smoking) from carbs to battle a systemic yeast condition.
This includes treats too BTW.
gibby913: I am sorry that Panzer is having such a hard time with allergies. My first GSD had severe allergies and now Nikki has them too so I know how frustrating this is.
Your vet is right to be concerned about bacteria in raw meat (see attached file).
If you are determined to feed a raw diet there are ways to make sure the diet is balanced. Monica Segal formulates all my diets and I believe she has a chapter in her book "K9 Kitchen" that walks you through the steps on how to balance a diet but you might want to double check on that.
The Allergy Problem
You could try a dehydrated food like "The Honest Kitchen" if he can tolerate the ingredients since these diets are balanced. I think only one of their formulas requires the addition of meat.
Is Panzer being treated by a dermatologist or by your primary vet? Here are some articles that you might find interesting:
Food Allergy | Dermatology for Animals - Part 1
Good luck :hug:
Yes, please go raw!
Something else to consider:
What about thyroid issues concerning yeast?
From Vet Pet Health: "Thyroid hormone is also involved in skin and coat health. Hypothyroid dogs will often lose hair on their bellies, the backs of their legs, and on their sides. They are not itchy, but the hair just doesn't grow properly leading to thin coated or even bald areas. Their skin is often thicker than normal, and sometimes darkened, as a result of the hypothyroidism. These dogs have more problems controlling skin yeast organisms, which are a natural part of a dog's skin flora. They will have more problems with a greasy and often stinky coat/skin, and sometimes will develop full blown skin and ear yeast infections."
From the Dane Lady: "It is my opinion, after working with hundreds of cases over many years, that when we are trying to re-balance the system and reduce the yeast/fungus levels in the gut, we have a much higher success rate when the thyroid is working properly. Now the problem is that yeast die-off, known as mycotoxins, actually can destroy the thyroid gland, which is the master lock to the whole glandular system (endocrine system). This is why having an current and accurate thyroid test done is critical to a successful re-balancing of the yeast overgrowth in the digestive tract.
Most veterinarians do not do a complete thyroid panel (5 panel test), nor do they know how to recognize a low normal test. I feel it is of utmost importance that you get a thyroid test analyzed by Dr. Jean Dodds at www.hemopet.com. I feel so strongly about this that I often will not do a consultation until pet owners have this thyroid test done before our consultation. Go to hemopet.com and click on services. You will note Dr. Dodds has 4 sections with instructions and forms for you to print out and take to your vet. Your vet will draw the blood and mail it to her laboratory and she will send you the accurate results. She does a complete Thyroid Antibody Panel which includes T4, Free T4, T3, Free T# and a TGAA (thyroglobulin autoantibody) test.
I really don't recommend going by your vets blood test. But if you have already gone to your own vet and they have run a T-3 and T-4 - look at the numbers, if they are in the middle (50%) range, it is considered low for the giant breeds and you must treat with thyroid meds. You must insist on it. In fact, if your dog is a large/giant breed and it comes back in the middle range say 1-10 and it reads a 5 on your dog, it means it needs to be treated with meds. Ideally a large/giant breed needs to be above the 50% range and on small active dogs it needs to be even higher than that - say on 1-10 range it would need to be a 7-8!"
This is what it says at Dr. Dodd's website:
"HEMOLIFE, provides the most comprehensive diagnostic profiles for detecting and interpreting autoimmune thyroiditis and hypothyroidism, with our specialized reference ranges. We use novel, 'green' non-RIA technology never offered before in veterinary medicine (patent pending). The Thyroid Antibody Panel (Thyroid 5™) is comprised of T4, Free T4, T3, Free T3 and TGAA. No other diagnostic laboratory offers this technology or provides clients with the detail, personal assessment, and recommendations offered by Dr. Dodds and her staff."
If this were my baby, I'd insist that your vet send the blood work to Dr. Dodds (not a lab) for this specific test! "Thyroid Profile 5 or 5 PLUS" is $160.00 at Hemopet. Hemopet
Hemopet Hemolife Thyroid Testing
Hemopet Hemolife Diagnostics T4:FT4 Ratio
Some info for you to read
|All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:31 AM.|
Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.