We survived our first day of agility!

Shaina · 10-31-2011, 05:36 PM

....And I decided that we are REALLY going to enjoy it!

One thing I did not like is how persistent our trainer was about using any corrections or even the word "no". She would correct me any time I said no, saying to make a gasp or "oh no" or "whoops" noise instead. While I understand that agility is supposed to be OMG FUN, my pup is also my schutzhund prospect and we are just doing agility for another mental thing that we may pursue if it is a fit. Just thought it was interesting that I couldn't say "no". Her reasoning was "no means nothing to a dog" which I find incorrect since I always match my "no" with a leash correction during obedience, so it definitely means more than "whoopsie" does...

Either way we REALLY enjoyed it and had a good time, Versailles picked up on the aframe, jumps, and tunnel immediately (and for those worried, we are not doing a lot of jumping since she is young!) and kept going over the aframe every time we passed it because she loved it so much.

Hopefully we end up doing well! Good first day.

fuzzybunny · 10-31-2011, 07:37 PM

Glad you enjoyed your first class! Agility can be addicting

Dooney's Mom · 10-31-2011, 09:07 PM

How old is your girl? Mine is 9 months and we just had our first agility class which they mix up with the agility. Mine is good with everything BUT the A frame- she would rather go around it- LOL

and I can see how it can become addicting- I can't wait for our next class!

Shaina · 10-31-2011, 09:15 PM

She is 7 1/2 months old

She LOVED the a-frame! Definitely her favorite. The tunnel we had a little trouble with (started out with a U shaped one so she didn't really understand teh concept) but if I threw her ball through it a few times she picked it up right away. She is pretty small and compact (only 48lbs) so she's certainly "agile" enough for it right now.

I_LOVE_MY_MIKKO · 11-01-2011, 11:03 AM

I'm glad you both had a great time!!

One of the reasons you don't give corrections to dogs in agility is because you want them to stay drivey and don't want them to slow down, trying to be correct, always looking to you to see if they are right.

I try not to mark an incorrect behavior at all (not even with whoopsie or whatever). If my dog is wrong, I do something else that he gets right and give him a treat then move back to what was wrong. That way, he is still rewarded, but not for the incorrect behavior and the incorrect behavior is just ignored.

**MaggieRoseLee** · 11-01-2011, 11:18 AM

Your instructor is right. For agility, the MOST important thing is enthusiasm, speed and our pups offering behaviors.

And...

In the REAL world with training and life, the word 'NO' should have alot of POWER! And not in a nagging nudging not-really-mean-it way. When I say 'NO' I want it to mean NO! Like 'NO' do not get near the skunk. Or 'NO' do not go in the road. Or 'NO' do not chew the electric cord.

I want 'NO' to have the power to stop my dog in their tracks.

That said, 'NO' doesn't really train or give the dog the right thing to do. I do not have a world full of no no no no no no no no. Cause that is a VERY demotiviating 'YOU KEEP BEING WRONG' world.

Instead, agility in particular (and my world in general) is full of my dog being brilliant and right! So they keep trying. Keep being enthusiastic. Keep loving the training and being with me. They learn to try to figure out how to be right, by ME becoming a better trainer, and learning to figure out with my big big brain how to set them up to succeed and do it right.

Rather than my dog having to fail and do it wrong 'no no no' and learn by FAILURE.

Cause that's really the difference here. If you think you have to train by having the dog fail and LEARN they failed by our 'no no no' that is not good in agility.

Instead, I only use a 'no' in agility if my dog is running over to say hi to a dog I know is aggressive. Or something else that may be actually DANGEROUS for my dog.

Otherwise, agility is all about how brilliant my dog is and having them WANT to offer and try new things. Now not everything is 'right' but that doesn't mean it's a STOP DEAD IN YOUR TRACKS YOU 'BAD' DOG THAT WAS WRONG. So the 'right' thing earns us going on, or a treat or a verbal. And the 'wrong' thing has ME figure out how to SHOW the dog what I want instead. Or a much lesser verbal marker like the 'oops or uh uh'. Because I want the dog to stay in the game.

I'm actually impressed by your trainer and them getting on you with this from the very start. Many people don't learn this, especially newbies to agility, until a year or so along in training when suddenly they realize their dog is no longer flying around the course at top speed. Or isn't seeming to really enjoy agility any more.

Because if you keep the 'no' in your vocabulary as agility goes on to get harder and more challenging, it will also get much more full of 'no's' as they take and off course or knock a bar or.......................... sucking the fun out of agility.

AGILITY IS ABOUT SPEED and doing the course properly. Both. Equally important. The speed of the dogs is in direct correlation to their enjoyment for the sport. And using 'no' for week after week after year of training assures a 'clean' run and perfection on a course. But it's at the expense of time. Our smart dogs learn if they slow way down and make absolute sure (double and triple checking before each obstacle) of where they are going, then they don't get mommy upset and earn those 'no's!!!!

Emoore · 11-01-2011, 11:32 AM

In beginning agility there are no wrong answers. Only right answers and right-er answers. You want your dog to keep trying passionately and excitedly without any fear whatsoever of being wrong or displeasing you.

Stosh · 11-01-2011, 02:48 PM

We're about to finish our first agility class- Stosh loved it from the very first night too! He especially loves the tunnel and the dog walk, even though he looks like a big cow up there. It's crazy how much fun they have and all the stuff they'll do just because we ask them to.

Emoore · 11-01-2011, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stosh

He especially loves the tunnel and the dog walk, even though he looks like a big cow up there.

Ha! Our instructor said that Kopper on the dog walk looked "Like Shaquille O'Neal on a balance beam."

AgileGSD · 11-01-2011, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaggieRoseLee

AGILITY IS ABOUT SPEED and doing the course properly. Both. Equally important. The speed of the dogs is in direct correlation to their enjoyment for the sport. And using 'no' for week after week after year of training assures a 'clean' run and perfection on a course. But it's at the expense of time. Our smart dogs learn if they slow way down and make absolute sure (double and triple checking before each obstacle) of where they are going, then they don't get mommy upset and earn those 'no's!!!!

Great post MRL!

If your dog is just starting agility, there is no reason for "correcting" them for being "incorrect". Because right now, there is no incorrect. Your pup has no idea what she is suppose to be doing, so dhe has no idea what she is being corrected for. In the beginning you want to build obstacle focus and confidence, instead of encouraging your dog to keep checking if their behavior is ok with you, which is what using corrections will encourage.

10-31-2011, 05:36 PM	#1 (permalink)
Shaina Master Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Mesa, AZ Posts: 740	We survived our first day of agility! ....And I decided that we are REALLY going to enjoy it! One thing I did not like is how persistent our trainer was about using any corrections or even the word "no". She would correct me any time I said no, saying to make a gasp or "oh no" or "whoops" noise instead. While I understand that agility is supposed to be OMG FUN, my pup is also my schutzhund prospect and we are just doing agility for another mental thing that we may pursue if it is a fit. Just thought it was interesting that I couldn't say "no". Her reasoning was "no means nothing to a dog" which I find incorrect since I always match my "no" with a leash correction during obedience, so it definitely means more than "whoopsie" does... Either way we REALLY enjoyed it and had a good time, Versailles picked up on the aframe, jumps, and tunnel immediately (and for those worried, we are not doing a lot of jumping since she is young!) and kept going over the aframe every time we passed it because she loved it so much. Hopefully we end up doing well! Good first day. __________________ "In order to really enjoy a dog, one doesn't merely try to train him to be semihuman. The point of it is to open oneself to the possibility of becoming partly a dog." - Edward Hoagland

10-31-2011, 07:37 PM	#2 (permalink)
fuzzybunny Elite Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Ottawa Posts: 1,817	Glad you enjoyed your first class! Agility can be addicting __________________ Carolyn Jazz, Shiloh Shepherd, 2.5 years old, CGC HIC Bunny, GSD X, 5.5 years old

10-31-2011, 09:07 PM	#3 (permalink)
Dooney's Mom Master Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: Deland, Fl Posts: 645	How old is your girl? Mine is 9 months and we just had our first agility class which they mix up with the agility. Mine is good with everything BUT the A frame- she would rather go around it- LOL and I can see how it can become addicting- I can't wait for our next class! __________________ Wendy Beaulieu's Dooney Von Pell- GSD 01/25/2011 RIP- Skye- WGSD 1991-2007 2 psycho cats- Diva & Jake

10-31-2011, 09:15 PM	#4 (permalink)
Shaina Master Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Mesa, AZ Posts: 740	She is 7 1/2 months old She LOVED the a-frame! Definitely her favorite. The tunnel we had a little trouble with (started out with a U shaped one so she didn't really understand teh concept) but if I threw her ball through it a few times she picked it up right away. She is pretty small and compact (only 48lbs) so she's certainly "agile" enough for it right now. __________________ "In order to really enjoy a dog, one doesn't merely try to train him to be semihuman. The point of it is to open oneself to the possibility of becoming partly a dog." - Edward Hoagland

11-01-2011, 11:03 AM	#5 (permalink)
I_LOVE_MY_MIKKO Knighted Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: FLORIDA Posts: 2,243	I'm glad you both had a great time!! One of the reasons you don't give corrections to dogs in agility is because you want them to stay drivey and don't want them to slow down, trying to be correct, always looking to you to see if they are right. I try not to mark an incorrect behavior at all (not even with whoopsie or whatever). If my dog is wrong, I do something else that he gets right and give him a treat then move back to what was wrong. That way, he is still rewarded, but not for the incorrect behavior and the incorrect behavior is just ignored. __________________ Mikko GM, RM, AAD, ASA, SJ, SS, EAC, EJC, TN-E, TG-E, WV-O, OCC, HP-O, VerO, NAJ, CGC - 6 year old GSD

11-01-2011, 11:18 AM	#6 (permalink)
MaggieRoseLee The Agility Rocks! Moderator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Bushkill, PA (The Poconos!) Posts: 22,199	Your instructor is right. For agility, the MOST important thing is enthusiasm, speed and our pups offering behaviors. And... In the REAL world with training and life, the word 'NO' should have alot of POWER! And not in a nagging nudging not-really-mean-it way. When I say 'NO' I want it to mean NO! Like 'NO' do not get near the skunk. Or 'NO' do not go in the road. Or 'NO' do not chew the electric cord. I want 'NO' to have the power to stop my dog in their tracks. That said, 'NO' doesn't really train or give the dog the right thing to do. I do not have a world full of no no no no no no no no. Cause that is a VERY demotiviating 'YOU KEEP BEING WRONG' world. Instead, agility in particular (and my world in general) is full of my dog being brilliant and right! So they keep trying. Keep being enthusiastic. Keep loving the training and being with me. They learn to try to figure out how to be right, by ME becoming a better trainer, and learning to figure out with my big big brain how to set them up to succeed and do it right. Rather than my dog having to fail and do it wrong 'no no no' and learn by FAILURE. Cause that's really the difference here. If you think you have to train by having the dog fail and LEARN they failed by our 'no no no' that is not good in agility. Instead, I only use a 'no' in agility if my dog is running over to say hi to a dog I know is aggressive. Or something else that may be actually DANGEROUS for my dog. Otherwise, agility is all about how brilliant my dog is and having them WANT to offer and try new things. Now not everything is 'right' but that doesn't mean it's a STOP DEAD IN YOUR TRACKS YOU 'BAD' DOG THAT WAS WRONG. So the 'right' thing earns us going on, or a treat or a verbal. And the 'wrong' thing has ME figure out how to SHOW the dog what I want instead. Or a much lesser verbal marker like the 'oops or uh uh'. Because I want the dog to stay in the game. I'm actually impressed by your trainer and them getting on you with this from the very start. Many people don't learn this, especially newbies to agility, until a year or so along in training when suddenly they realize their dog is no longer flying around the course at top speed. Or isn't seeming to really enjoy agility any more. Because if you keep the 'no' in your vocabulary as agility goes on to get harder and more challenging, it will also get much more full of 'no's' as they take and off course or knock a bar or.......................... sucking the fun out of agility. AGILITY IS ABOUT SPEED and doing the course properly. Both. Equally important. The speed of the dogs is in direct correlation to their enjoyment for the sport. And using 'no' for week after week after year of training assures a 'clean' run and perfection on a course. But it's at the expense of time. Our smart dogs learn if they slow way down and make absolute sure (double and triple checking before each obstacle) of where they are going, then they don't get mommy upset and earn those 'no's!!!! __________________ MACH2 Bretta Lee Wildhaus CGC TC TQX Glory B Wildhaus NA, NJ, NF + LOL (still) "*Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much." - Oscar Wilde* Last edited by MaggieRoseLee; 11-01-2011 at 02:36 PM.

11-01-2011, 11:32 AM	#7 (permalink)
Emoore Crowned Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: North DFW, TX Posts: 9,210	In beginning agility there are no wrong answers. Only right answers and right-er answers. You want your dog to keep trying passionately and excitedly without any fear whatsoever of being wrong or displeasing you. __________________ Rocky vom Backyard- 10 years young Kopper vom Felssclucht Bach - 17 months At the Bridge: Cash van der Animal Shelter 2006-2010

11-01-2011, 02:48 PM	#8 (permalink)
Stosh Crowned Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: tyler texas Posts: 8,434	We're about to finish our first agility class- Stosh loved it from the very first night too! He especially loves the tunnel and the dog walk, even though he looks like a big cow up there. It's crazy how much fun they have and all the stuff they'll do just because we ask them to.

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