Standard Protocol for Advancing in Agility School

[wildo]

Just curious. At the end of my last class, we started talking about the fact that our 8 week course is coming to a close shortly (2 more weeks, though we started talking about it because someone thought it was next week). Anyway, the instructor asked each individual person if they would be renewing for the class again. I said I would be, of course, and asked if that would be "Beginner II."

Well, no, it won't be Beginner II- it will be the second round of Beginner I. Apparently there is a committee (school owner, instructor, and perhaps some other instructors) that will decide when we meet the requirements to move onto Beginner II.

This was a bit shocking to me. I expected that when our 8 week session of Beg. I expired, the next logical step was Beg. II. You know, I don't have anything bad to say about this school- I've truly loved class so far, and Pimg is doing great-- but I'm a bit peeved to find out at the end of the session that there is a list of things we should have been focusing on. It would have been nice to know that up front.

Anyway- my question- Is this how most agility schools work?

________
In case you are curious, here is our requirement list to move to Beginner II:

1. Ground work- Dog handler team can on the flat execute:
   1. Post turn
   2. Front cross
   3. Rear cross
2. Dog can:
   1. Stay at the start line through distractions and move out given cue.
   2. Follow handler's hand and hand signals. Dog stays with and is attentive to the handler.
3. Jumping:
   1. Dog/handler team can execute a one - three jump sequence at 4 or more inches below competition height with a reward at the end.
   2. Dog can clear jump set at 4 or more inches below competition height with handler at either side, in front or behind dog. Dog can clear jump from any angle.
   3. Handler can call dog over jump
   4. Handler can send over jump from 3 feet in front, to the side, or behind the dog.
   5. OPTIONAL: Dog/handler team is beginning to be able to execute post turns, front and rear crosses with one, two, or three jumps
4. Tunnels:
   1. Confidently and accurately complete straight, curved, and s-shaped tunnels
   2. Confidently and accurately completes closed tunnel/chute
   3. Handler can send dog to tunnel and chute from 3-5 feet and from different angles
5. Contacts:
   1. Dog understands and can execute from the side, or as part of a complete obstacle performance, one or more correct contact performances. Dog can stay in contact performance position until released at a given cue.
   2. Dog/handler team can confidently and accurately perform contact equipment- 4ft A-Frame, 8ft dog walk, and low competition teeter.
6. Weaves:
   1. Dog/handler team can perform accurately, confidently, and enthusiastically 6 weave poles with guide wires or weave-a-matics at 8 - 12" spread.
7. Handler can direct the dog and the dog /handler team can accurately and confidently execute a short 3-5 obstcale sequence including jumps, tunnels, and contacts.

To be fair- some of these are entirely unrealistic. For example, we are learning 2x2 weaves- so the entire section on weave poles needs revisited. Since there is also an Advanced level class happening at the same time- we haven't even gotten to see a dog walk yet. My instructor knows this. She's going to talk to the owner about revamping this list. Still- I think it's a good indication of what they are looking for in order to "graduate" to the next level.

Have you guys had similar experiences at your agility school?? I'm not complaining- just saying I was caught by surprise on this...

[JakodaCD OA]

In the clubs I've been in, the instructor usually is the one to determine whether the dog/handler should move on to the next level.

The requirements you've listed for "beginners" is in my opinion unrealistic especially when you have a beginners II.

Beginners, dogs are not expected to be "perfect", and the beginner classes I've done, are more foundation work, contact work, certainly not expected to do 6 weave poles perfectly.

Beg II is usually proofing those things worked on in beg I plus.

Unless a dog is REALLY REALLY green, I would see no reason to keep anyone from advancing to Beg II.

Altho you like the classes, it sounds like they are pushing dogs to fast to be 'perfect'?

From the videos I've seen of Pimg I would say you should definately be advancing.

[Rerun]

Glad I didn't sign up for this school and kept looking....they did not disclose this over the phone, and in fact said they do not tell you which class to enter and that it's to be up to the individual owner what level the dog is at and if they are ready to advance.

Sounds like a good way to make extra money, IMHO, by forcing you to retake the same course. If you retake it, do you then have to go back to all the basics while newbies in the class catch up?

[TaraM1285]

That is a lot to know after your first eight week class! At our school, an instructor decides whether you move on to the next level, based on your skills in what was taught in that class. Which instructor will decide is always known ahead of time and is always one of the owners.

Learning six weave poles in eight weeks, especially if people are only working on them in class is completely unrealistic, IMO.

Do you know what they teach in Beginner II? What is the overall progression of your classes?

For an example, our progression has been the following, these are all 6 week classes:

Foundation 1 Agility (May-Jun 2010)
Foundation 2 Agility (Jul-Aug 2010)
Foundation 3 Agility (Sept-Oct 2010)
Handling 1 (Nov-Dec 2010)
Contacts & Weaves (Nov-Dec 2010)
Handling 1 (Jan-Feb 2011) (We could have moved on to Handling 2, but it filled before I got registration in)
Contacts & Weaves (Jan-Feb 2011)
Handling 2 (Mar-Apr 2011)
Contacts & Weaves (Mar-Apr 2011)

Some people do repeat Foundation classes, but usually it's because they missed multiple classes in a session or they feel they're not ready to move on.

Many people re-do handling classes, or even come back and take them over because they work tough jump sequences (Serpentines, Threadles, 270s, etc.) with different handling options. People also continue Contacts & Weaves for as long as they want. The school told us this ahead of time, that most people have to repeat the class. They don't do any contacts/weaves in Handling 1 and I think they use them minimally in Handling 2 and 3, so I will continue to take it as long as we are in the Handling classes so I can work full height equipment and 12 full poles.

After you finish the handling sequence (1, 2, and 3), you can take Pre-Competition Handling. Once you start earning legs towards your titles, they have a number of different classes for the different levels of competition: Novice Competition Handling, Advanced, Masters.

I actually feel like this progression of classes has prepared us enough for Novice level courses in either AKC or USDAA now, but I'm taking my time on competing. We MAY enter a trial this summer.

Sorry for way too much information! I just wanted to give you an idea of how another school is run.

[AgileGSD]

The club I'm in has some requirements such as this for Beginner 2. At the club I'm in, your dog has to be able to do straight weaves to move out of Beginner 2, so most of the dogs take Beginner 1 several times. I wish they were even more strict on certain things, like not allowing dogs to move on who run off or run around while doing the course. In our club Beginner 2 is where dogs start to train for entry level competition. Agility is not something all dogs (or handlers!) progress through at the same speed and classes tend to be set up to teach specific things. Moving on before your dog masters the criteria for Beginner 1 sets you up for failure in Beginner 2. So IME such requirements and repeating of classes until you and your dog meet the criteria for that class is pretty common and reasonable

[Cassidy's Mom]

Where I took classes with Dena, they didn't have anything written out about the specific requirements for advancing to the next level, but it was totally up to the instructor, as I think it should be. All they had there was levels 1, 2, and 3, and Dena took Agility 2 twice. The instructor said that our group was more like 2-1/2 because all the dogs in her class had taken Agility 2 previously. Since then they've added an Agility 4 class.

The instructors also determined whether or not a dog had the necessary skills to sign up for agility at all, which I also think is fine. The prerequisite was Family Dog 2, or an equivalent level 2 OB class somewhere else (in this case you'd have to make an appointment for an evaluation and demonstrate that your dog had mastered the skills taught in FD2). Dena had taken Agility Basics, an alternate level 1 OB class, but she'd also taken two previous classes, Sirius Puppy 1 and 2, and did well enough in AB that she was one of two dogs in her class to get instructor approval to skip FD2 and go straight into Agility 1.

I would have no problem with an instructor deciding whether or not me and my dog were ready to advance to the next level.

[BlackPuppy]

Originally Posted by JakodaCD OA

In the clubs I've been in, the instructor usually is the one to determine whether the dog/handler should move on to the next level.

Yes, same here. And it really annoys me to be in the same class with all the newbies when my dog only had one minor problem area.

So... I take a beginners agility class with equipment and when it's over, I spend months working on my own until I consider another class.

Like I said, I hate standing around in class being bored.

...and I always leave the weave poles for last. In CPE there aren't even any weaves in the lowest levels.

[Emoore]

Originally Posted by JakodaCD OA

In the clubs I've been in, the instructor usually is the one to determine whether the dog/handler should move on to the next level.

This has been my experience as well. Cash and I had to repeat one class.

[wildo]

Thanks everyone. I figured this was probably a standard practice, but I wasn't sure. I think the most frustrating part is to get the requirements list at the end of the class. Had I received it at the beginning, we could have been focusing specifically on those requirements. But whatever... At least I know now.

I'm certainly not looking to "breeze" through to the "good" stuff, but I do want to be rewarded for our hard work and progress through advancement. Knowing now that this is a pretty common outline for advancement- I'll bring up my concerns with my instructor. I guess I just wanted to see if this is a pretty common experience.

[MaggieRoseLee]

Since most of us go to classes forever.... I'm on year 6 with Bretta Lee and almost year 2 with Glory B................ the progression isn't really as clear cut with a set group of (for instance) 8 week classes that clearly and rapidly progress up the line. I don't even know what my classes are called to be honest, just show up when my instructor tells me to and work out the details!

There are a set of SKILLS that are needed before some of the higher levels, but what those levels are and the breaks are vastly different. Truthfully, the longer you go the more you'll see (if the classes are good) that the skills the DOG needs they are getting and on a one piece of equipment at a time, they probably excel.

The issues and problems and SKILLS end up being much more about US as we progress with agility over the months. How we give information in a timely manner to start sequencing, while having our dogs understand and continue with their performance on the equipment. It's amazing to watch a perfect 2on/2off fall apart. Or the weave poles.... and it's stuff WE are affecting.

Where I'm training now they just recently tried to help with this by assigning Level # to classes. So if I want to change nights or add a class, I can look at the Level of the class and know if we are set to go (or not) depending on the level I'm in. https://morrisk9campus.com/agility_levels.asp has the breakdown but you'll notice how vague it is. Level one takes forever, the middle ones not so long, then you are in the highest level forever!!!