Can fear aggression be overcome??

[onyx'girl]

Today I was walking both dogs- Onyx was on a gentle leader, Kacie on prong. Two sibling mixes, chow/bullies (about 60 lbs) came running up from a house that my dogs have heard barking from, but never saw the dogs. My dogs were fine- no fur rise, barking and so were the others. Then the owner came up and the guy put his hand right at Onyx, she didn't do a thing, but sniff his hand ! I was really surprised at this as she was focused on sniffing the dogs and didn't even pay attention to the human as he approached. The whole time I was saying " good puppies" and stuff in a happy voice. There was another guy and a 8 yr old child at the driveway, she was fine, no hackeling at anyone.
The guy apologized for dogs off leash, I said no problem, good test for mine! Onyx was fine with him petting her.
It must have been a fear stage a couple of mos. ago, or the gentle leader is what calmed her. maybe she was reacting to my calmness, or the other dogs lack of aggression. I didn't have treats w/ me or my clicker at this time, so I couldn't re-direct focus with that approach. I was very proud of both Kacie and Onyx during this experience)

[onyx'girl]

Update: 5/08 Onyx and I joined a new SchH. club http://www.schhmi.com/
that meets2x a month at Taking The Lead where I went for the private training. When we got there a pup charged her and Onyx was ok, but a bit nerved up. Other dogs were in crates, barking in their vehicles. Bitework was done first, as one of the members needed a breed survey done. Onyx was very uncomfortable with this and wanted out, so we went outside, she was freaked out when a dog started barking from his crate and tried to get the H out of there. We did go back in and she settled when we started doing basic ob and playtime. All the dogs were GSD's, about 6.
The next training was cancelled due to severe weather, and we missed the last one, as I was in SC. So it has been 6 weeks since we were there, went last night and Onyx remembered it as we went down the drive, she started shaking,& acting anxious. Went inside and let her sniff around opposite side of the room of the others, to calm. We were working on the CGC and Onyx did very well, she let stranger approach, stand for exam and when I left the room for the 3 min, she was ok. It was a positive night and she left with a wag in her tail. She was on a no-slip collar and was fine w/ it.
I know she isn't SchH material,or maybe the tracking and ob only, but being around great trainers and knowledgable people will do nothing but help her, IMO I am also going to the local Kennel club for the CGC training class which starts next week, I think she is now ready for larger group training. So if fear aggression can't be overcome, it can be managed)

[WiscTiger]

Yea that is great progress. I am glad you are learing that managing is the key.

Val

[Ben8jam]

Wow. That was quite a read!!!

So, um, what's the outcome? To shock or not!?

Have to admit as someone new to this debate, I have to go with the side of Lou. Purely because he's been able to factually back up every but of rhetoric that had been thrown around. **removed by Admin**


A lot of knee jerk reactions. Any method can be abused. My dog was a rescue who had been beaten over the head with some kind of pipe. Bloody welt on her head when we got her. So should all blunt objects be banned from society? The first trainer we hired brought a choke and preferred to hang our dog from it until she submitted. No lie. That was traumatic. So where are the anti-collar debates.

Let's all just agree that WE will do whatever is best for our dogs. And no one will abuse any technique. I know you are all coming down hard on Lou. But remember he is a dog lover too. And I her his dogs are pretty darn happy.

Peace and namaste

[onyx'girl]

Welcome Ben8jam
Lou Castle is the E-collar guru for sure...
Just an FYI~ we aren't allowed to talk politics here so don't be surprised if your first post gets edited by the admin or mods.
In the case of Onyx, I didn't go with an e-collar. She matured and mellowed, but still has issues with small kids and the vet doing anything with her. In those cases I use a muzzle or crate her when kids are around. I did take her to a class based on the book Control Unleashed by Leslie McDevitt. That was a turning point in managing her.
I'm not against using an e-collar, but for this case it wasn't needed.

[Ben8jam]

Thanks for the update! I just came back to ask how Onyx was doing. Didnt realize this was over two years old!!! Oops.

Glad to her she's doing well(er).

[debbiebrown]

fear aggression can definitely be managed through the right conditioning, being a good leader, and trying to keep the dogs from repeating reactive behaviors.....learning your dogs triggers and thresholds is a good start.......

i also think a very helpful exercise is teaching your dog to get behind you.........so you can use this in unexpected situations and take control so your dog can relax..........