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-   -   Help! Advice on aggression toward other dog? (http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/aggression-good-bad-ugly/438929-help-advice-aggression-toward-other-dog.html)

AnaleighK12k14 04-15-2014 09:50 PM

Help! Advice on aggression toward other dog?
 
Today my 2 year old gsd bit my 14 week old puppy in the face. He had to get 4 stitches near his eye. Fortunately, the eye itself is untouched and the vet thinks the wound will heal nicely with little scarring. So with that issue dealt with, the focus becomes he to prevent this from happening again.

I wasn't home when this happened, but according to my husband, it was and instant reaction to him trying to play with a toy ( his toy, not hers). He said it happened very quickly without warning. I have only seen her be aggressive about food and never to this extent before.

They will be separated until his laceration heals, so I have some time. Anyone dealt with this? Any advice? Will she adjust to him, or is this going to be an ongoing or worsening thing ( her patience with him had definitely grown thinner over the past few days)?

Any and all advice is welcome. I feel terrible that she did this to the little guy.


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gsdsar 04-15-2014 10:09 PM

Puppies are obnoxious. They need to learn boundaries. The push and cajole and pounce and annoy. Your adult dog was done and clearly told her so.

Whenever your pup and adult are together it's your job to monitor and interject common sense. If your puppy is ignoring signals from the adult, then you need to step in and make him respect.

With my pups, if they are getting annoying, and my older dogs started getting annoyed I would remove the puppy. The older dog needs to learn that YOU have control over the puppy, that YOU will intervene and that YOU have their back. If they don't believe this, than they will correct the obnoxious heathen the way dogs do. LOL!!!

Always be vigilant. Pups need to learn to respect. It's up to you to enforce the " we will not be obnoxious" rule!!!




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glowingtoadfly 04-15-2014 10:24 PM

You aren't alone! Right now my older female has taken it upon herself to correct my recently brought home nine month old male a few times. Needless to say, he has a few scratches on his muzzle because he wasn't listening to her signals and I didn't move quite fast enough to crate him before discord erupted. We are trying to stay on top of it and curb the puppy boisterousness too. Good luck!

Chip18 04-15-2014 10:24 PM

Some info here on multi dog households
http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum...-problems.html
And this:
How to Socialize an Older Dog with a New Puppy

That was not an accident, the older dog has no tolerance for the younger dog.

You can't allow them to be unsupervised, and "only aggressive" about food?? Is a whole nother issue!
It sounds like you already had a dog with "unresolved issues" and now you've added a puppy?

12 to 15 months assuming the pup survives and you'll be needing this info:
Leerburg | How to Break Up a Dog Fight Without Getting Hurt!

Unless things change!

Best advice is to find a qualified trainer and work with them, you had one dog with unresolved issues and you've now added a puppy...not good.

selzer 04-15-2014 10:26 PM

It sounds like he just lost his puppy license.

It also sounds like your female has some issues that need to be dealt with, Strong NILF with her and I would probably watch them closely until the boy is much larger and stronger.

So leadership/NILIF; management/separate & supervise all interaction, you control the toys; training/up the training on the bitch, and start training on the pup; exercise/ I would increase the exercise on the bitch.

You control the toys. I would have them separated when playing with toys for now.

It's too late now, but I think that bitch would have had a seriously strong reaction come out of me when she did that, I mean within seconds, she would have been yanked off her feet and taken through a door and left her crate or kennel until the boy was back home and settled. Then I probably would have ingored her for a little longer before bringing her out. I wouldn't have liked to see a bloody cut on a youngster like that.

She would get over the correction way too quickly anyway. But I would have felt better, having done it, and then I could implement boot-camp for little bitches who think they own the castle and everything in it.

glowingtoadfly 04-15-2014 10:32 PM

We try to keep the toys put away unless we are working one on one with the dogs. Lately we have had some toys out but we are starting to rethink this as balls are high value items at our house, and there has been growliness from our older girl when the puppy approaches her when she has a ball. We started out with no toys anywhere and they took it upon themselves to play tug with socks. LOL

AnaleighK12k14 04-16-2014 05:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by selzer (Post 5382689)

It's too late now, but I think that bitch would have had a seriously strong reaction come out of me when she did that, I mean within seconds, she would have been yanked off her feet and taken through a door and left her crate or kennel until the boy was back home and settled. Then I probably would have ingored her for a little longer before bringing her out. I wouldn't have liked to see a bloody cut on a youngster like that.

She would get over the correction way too quickly anyway. But I would have felt better, having done it, and then I could implement boot-camp for little bitches who think they own the castle and everything in it.


That's actually exactly what my husband did.


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AnaleighK12k14 04-16-2014 06:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chip18 (Post 5382665)
Some info here on multi dog households
http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum...-problems.html
And this:
How to Socialize an Older Dog with a New Puppy

That was not an accident, the older dog has no tolerance for the younger dog.

You can't allow them to be unsupervised, and "only aggressive" about food?? Is a whole nother issue!
It sounds like you already had a dog with "unresolved issues" and now you've added a puppy?

12 to 15 months assuming the pup survives and you'll be needing this info:
Leerburg | How to Break Up a Dog Fight Without Getting Hurt!

Unless things change!

Best advice is to find a qualified trainer and work with them, you had one dog with unresolved issues and you've now added a puppy...not good.



Just to clear a couple things up:
1. They have never ever ever been unsupervised. I know better than that. I wasn't home but my husband was home and he said it happened fast, out if nowhere while he was watching.
2. I did not bring a puppy home to a "dog that has unresolved issues" knowingly. We have never seen this side of her. And when I said I've only seen her be "aggressive" about food, I only meant that she was growling at other dogs that went near her food. She had never ever bit any dog or anything or even come close prior to this.
3. She isn't intolerant of him. She actually was totally excited when we brought him home and instantly loved him. She has always liked other dogs.


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selzer 04-16-2014 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnaleighK12k14 (Post 5383721)
Just to clear a couple things up:
1. They have never ever ever been unsupervised. I know better than that. I wasn't home but my husband was home and he said it happened fast, out if nowhere while he was watching.
2. I did not bring a puppy home to a "dog that has unresolved issues" knowingly. We have never seen this side of her. And when I said I've only seen her be "aggressive" about food, I only meant that she was growling at other dogs that went near her food. She had never ever bit any dog or anything or even come close prior to this.
3. She isn't intolerant of him. She actually was totally excited when we brought him home and instantly loved him. She has always liked other dogs.


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But this was an extreme reaction. 4 stitches to a 14 week old puppy is not good. Bitches are interesting to say the least. I love them, because they keep me guessing, and they have really interesting personalities. But, and this is what is important, some bitches have the green-gene.

Don't do a google search on that one because it is my way of putting it. They can be jealous. The resource they often guard is their human. And they seem to have this jealousy much more often with other bitches, and we term it Same Sex Aggression. However, it doesn't have to be another female.

If a female is noticing that the puppy is getting lots of pets, lots of treats, lots of toys, lots of attention, where before she was getting it ALL, now the puppy is not a playmate, but something she would prefer to go away.

So often people want to get a pet for their pet -- not saying that happened here -- but it happens a lot. It is fun to watch two dogs running and playing and happy with each other. And yet, sometimes the dogs would prefer to be onlys. And how do you know that?

Well, I don't think you can. And I don't necessarily think that this has to be permanent. Your bitch needs to never do again this thing. She got strongly corrected, and by implementing NILIF within the household, and making her earn privilages, and being totally fair and consistent, and exercising her mind through training, you can have that two-dog family.

I am not quite sure about hierarchy with dogs, whether it makes more sense to determine which dog is alpha and back the alpha up, give her the treats and toys first, reprimand the puppy when she seems edgy around it, let her go through doorways, get fed, pets first. Or if it is better to take the leadership position and allow neither dog seniority or canine hierarchy. And I don't buy the humans into the pack order at all, and all the dominance stuff. But, I do believe dogs do work out order amongst themselves, and trying to make it be what we think it ought to be, will often have bad results. I know, not very helpful. But maybe some truly knowledgeable person will show up and give their wisdom from their experience with ironing out dog-dog issues.

Good luck. I hope this is the last of this sort of problem that you all experience. Sometimes a good Come-To-Jesus moment does do it with dogs.

AnaleighK12k14 04-16-2014 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by selzer (Post 5384977)
But this was an extreme reaction. 4 stitches to a 14 week old puppy is not good. Bitches are interesting to say the least. I love them, because they keep me guessing, and they have really interesting personalities. But, and this is what is important, some bitches have the green-gene.

Don't do a google search on that one because it is my way of putting it. They can be jealous. The resource they often guard is their human. And they seem to have this jealousy much more often with other bitches, and we term it Same Sex Aggression. However, it doesn't have to be another female.

If a female is noticing that the puppy is getting lots of pets, lots of treats, lots of toys, lots of attention, where before she was getting it ALL, now the puppy is not a playmate, but something she would prefer to go away.

So often people want to get a pet for their pet -- not saying that happened here -- but it happens a lot. It is fun to watch two dogs running and playing and happy with each other. And yet, sometimes the dogs would prefer to be onlys. And how do you know that?

Well, I don't think you can. And I don't necessarily think that this has to be permanent. Your bitch needs to never do again this thing. She got strongly corrected, and by implementing NILIF within the household, and making her earn privilages, and being totally fair and consistent, and exercising her mind through training, you can have that two-dog family.

I am not quite sure about hierarchy with dogs, whether it makes more sense to determine which dog is alpha and back the alpha up, give her the treats and toys first, reprimand the puppy when she seems edgy around it, let her go through doorways, get fed, pets first. Or if it is better to take the leadership position and allow neither dog seniority or canine hierarchy. And I don't buy the humans into the pack order at all, and all the dominance stuff. But, I do believe dogs do work out order amongst themselves, and trying to make it be what we think it ought to be, will often have bad results. I know, not very helpful. But maybe some truly knowledgeable person will show up and give their wisdom from their experience with ironing out dog-dog issues.

Good luck. I hope this is the last of this sort of problem that you all experience. Sometimes a good Come-To-Jesus moment does do it with dogs.


I know it's not good. But getting rid of either dog is not an option I want to pursue. So I will need to figure something out. Once I re introduce them I will start with no sharing of toys at all. I have separated them at the first sign of annoyance from either dog but I will do so more intently. I'm not sure if I would have seen it coming or if my husband missed something.

I will say that there have been absolutely no issues of her guarding us, so I am genuinely hoping that removing all objects from the situation and preventing her from being pestered too much by him will help.

I know it is not good.


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