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Please help us. Dog turned agressive

29K views 156 replies 49 participants last post by  AshleyD 
#1 ·
We have a two year old male GSD. We got him when he was about ten weeks and has been in our home with myself, my wife and our 17 year old son. He is the most loved and loving thing you would ever see. My work takes me away for weeks at a time and he spends every minute of every day with my wife. She walks him four to five times a day. She takes him to the field by the house three times a day to play catch. She feeds and cares for him like he was another child of ours. He is our baby.

Since he was old enough to bark he would defend the vehicle and the door very aggressively. We have had a difficult time having friends of our son stop by for this reason. He is very intimidating and very loud. Although to this point it was all more bark than bite, he is avoided by all but one or two of our son’s friends.

About three weeks ago he started growling at our son. It was like just one day he wouldn’t want him in the same room with him. The dog would hide from the boy and he was visibly shaking. We tried to have the boy feed him some of his treats and the dog just would growl at him. We separated the two and it has been hit or miss ever since. Sometimes he would be fine and loving on the boy. Other times he would growl and move towards the boy.

Fast forward another two weeks and he has started the same behavior with the wife. He will love her by kissing her and licking her like only these puppies can do and the next minute growl at her. Several minutes later he would sit next to her and lick her face then start growling at her again.

We LOVE this dog. He has NEVER been mistreated. He is loved, well fed and well exercised. Up until a few weeks ago I would say he is well adjusted. Fiercely protective of the home and when he is in the car but obedient and well behaved.

Now for the bad news. The dog bit our son. Fortunately it was not a bad bite but it wasn’t a nip and he did intend to do harm. He has been to his vet and there appears to be nothing obviously medically wrong with him. We are urgently trying to find an animal behaviorist to meet and hopefully give us an idea of what may be happening. The problem is that there are no openings in our area. My schedule keeps me away for weeks at a time. I cannot leave my home with the dog alone with my wife after he went after the boy. Our choices are limited. We will not rehome the dog and pass this problem onto another that may mistreat him for this horrible behavior. We do not want to put him down as it is an unthinkable thing to do if there is a chance we can figure out what is wrong. I am afraid the unthinkable may be what we need to do.

If anyone can give us information that will help us and our puppy please help.
 
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#33 ·
Who is the breeder of the dog?

Assuming that the breeder has a lot of experience with GSDs, he/she may be able to give you better advice than an Internet forum.

Sometimes, people are reluctant to go back to a breeder because they would have to admit mistakes they made raising a puppy or even physical/mental abuse that has been done to the dog.
If the breeder is a reputable one, they should be willing to take the dog back and rehome it.

Sometimes, families and dogs are just not a good fit for each other. Most times, it is not the dog that's the problem.
 
#34 ·
Has a vet checked the dog? Blood work? X rays? was his behavior secure adn confident from the beginning? I have known of a few animals with physical issues that caused behavior changes....

Lee
 
#35 ·
No blood work or xrays. He has been to the doc but vet did nothing short of saying we need to get him to a behaviourist immediately.

Our vet has seen Sieg since he was 10 weeks. He also had GSD in his family for years.

It concerns me he has not wanted to do any blood work however.

Something I forgot to mention...on Friday, the first day of his aggressive growl to the wife, but before, he jumped our 5-6' fence. He has never done this. Luckily, after alerting the police, etc., he came home. I was gone, my wife thought we'd lost him forever. This was a first.
 
#36 ·
can you confirm here on the thread that you were able to access my private message to you. no need to comment, just acknowledge...sometimes new people are unaware of how the private message feature works. thanks.
 
#37 ·
I read your post this morning, and have been thinking about this all day. I'm very disturbed about something like this occurring with a beloved family GSD. I have been thinking about what I would do in your situation. First of all I want have a talk with your son. It stood out to me that the dog was looking at him hiding and shaking. This happened overnight, yes? Why do you think that could be? And why do you think he says he doesn't remember if anything happened?
Second of all, I would call your local police K9 unit and ask for a veterinary recommendation from them. I would want a vet who is very familiar with the GSD breed and who would know what to check for health-wise.
All of a sudden he is fearful, aggressive, and trying to jump the fence. Something is not right with this dog in the head, and it doesn't matter what the reason is. At this time he is dangerous, and perhaps he needs to be boarded somewhere while you get down to the bottom of what is going on. I wish you the best of luck, hope you keep us posted on what is going on with your dog.

Sent from my Verizon iPhone
 
#40 ·
I do not think this has to do with him being intact. It would not be like a lightswitch going off. That screams medical to me and not behavioral. There are many conditions this could be, and where to start would be the full blood panel. I have heard thyroid, vitamin B deficiency, etc.

The blood work can also indicate if there might be other issues.

It probably won't show if it is epilepsy or what seems to be closely related, rage synrome.

There is a possibility of a brain tumor or brain swelling due to encephilitis or meningitis.

Vaccine-related issues can take months to appear, and veterinarians do not generally want to consider the possibility. I am not familiar with the meds that you have him on, so I guess that is another possibility.

A physical problem can be as simple as giving him a thyroid pill, and it can mean the dog should be released from his pain. But if it is physical, then all the behavioral, leadership, dominance stuff and removing the testosterone will simply not help whatsoever.

If it is behavioral, then a misdiagnosis on the type of aggression can be fatal. I think that I would definitely get second and maybe a third opinion with a vet, but trying to go along the behavior path, I think you want to be very careful who you work with. You will definitely want to go with someone that you can find excellent references and referrals.

I am sorry you are going through this.
 
#41 ·
I completely agree with Sue (Selzer) I do not think this is just a spoiled dog trying to dominate the family. I don't think neutering will have any effect on this. From what you have said he does not seem to be resource guarding or fearful and it is not normal for a GSD, no matter how spoiled to turn on family members

The fact that one minute he is aggressive with family members and then the next minute fine with them also seems like a medical issue to me.

I am very sorry you are going through this too. Have you contacted the breeder to see if any of your dogs litter mates are having similar problems? That might be a good place to start.

I encourage you to rule out any medical cause before going to a trainer or behaviorist.
 
#42 ·
i just have to say that is an educated and well thought out post sue. thank you for sharing that point of view with the op. my response via pm was hurried and assumed that the medical issues had been already appropriately addressed.
 
#43 ·
I didn't read all the posts but you may want to buy a dog mouth guard?? as long as he is going through this phase. Like the kind police dogs sometimes wear. Secondly, I have a feeling that your dog is trying to dominate your son. One of my dogs tries to dominate little children because my other dog, my cat, and I all totally dominate him. Have your son be very firm with him and even pin him on his back if he gets aggressive. My dogs sort of give in if I lay on top of them when they are aggressive.

I have dog-sat a GSD that was legitimately scary as F! In fact, he almost attacked me when I tried to put him in his crate and this dog was way powerful. I immediately became very aggressive/dominant myself and coerced him into his crate. His owner couldn't believe that he looked at me like a burgler wearing a strip-steak necklace, it is the only time I thought "this is it" face to face with a dog. It could have been really ugly.

So sometimes GSDs just are stubborn unless the dominance of the relationship is clearly established. Your dog is probably testing his boundries with all close parties.
 
#44 ·
I didn't read all the posts but you may want to buy a dog mouth guard?? as long as he is going through this phase. Like the kind police dogs sometimes wear. Secondly, I have a feeling that your dog is trying to dominate your son. One of my dogs tries to dominate little children because my other dog, my cat, and I all totally dominate him. Have your son be very firm with him and even pin him on his back if he gets aggressive. My dogs sort of give in if I lay on top of them when they are aggressive.

.
No, No, No. Don't do this.
 
#45 ·
err warning - "Have your son be very firm with him and even pin him on his back if he gets aggressive." this could result in a kid with some big holes in face that he wasn't born with - forget the ceasar milan stuff, thats best left for dominating non-dominant spoilt pets, not dominant dogs...just sayin, hate to see a kid get bit from some internet advice.
 
#49 · (Edited)
I meant pin him down while the dog was wearing a mouth guard. It works for me but I am not really scared of my own dogs so that could explain my bravado. Plus it always ends with me kissing their noses anyways.

Don't take my advice (even though it works for me)!

BTW: I will say don't ever try to trick your GSD. I once threw a ball and after my GSD started to chase the ball, I tried to run the opposite direction and hide behind a tree. Well, he ignored the ball and chased me down, leapt into the air and sunk his teeth into my arm. I would say he is definitely attached to me! ;)
 
#50 · (Edited)
I'm dealing with the same kind of thing with my dog. The way you describe it, like a light switch, is exactly the same thing. One minute fine, then, BAM, insane, ridiculously out of nowhere aggressive biting/snapping, then just as fast as it came on, BAM, gone, and he's just fine.

His problems showed up almost immediately after a rabies vaccine, and then tapered off after a couple months; now the problems only show up every few months. This last time however he did bite someone bad enough to need stitches. I don't know if I can really blame the vaccine or not, but the timing is suspicious. Did you notice ANY altered behavior in the weeks following his last rabies shot?

Rage syndrome or some bizarre form of epilepsy are what I'm thinking too (for mine and yours), but I run into the same problems you do, there - it's pretty much impossible to test for those. If it is epilepsy, the seizure only triggers every few months, making it nearly impossible to catch and definitively diagnose. Even if it is more often (as it seems to be in your case), it isn't often enough to catch on a test.

Has the vet given him a physical? Perhaps something is hurting him, and he is misdirecting the pain? He may just have enough respect for you that it is holding whatever medical condition is causing this at bay - that's why I suspect I don't see this behavior out of my own dog directed at me, but I do see it toward my family. It's not that he isn't bonded to them at all, he is - he's just most tightly bonded to me.

Thyroid is another possibility but I'd think you'd be seeing other symptoms of that too. Are his nails brittle at all, even slightly, has his coat gotten any dryer?

I don't think it is an intact male issue, either. You would see more patterned aggression, it would be normal behavior for him.

I would be concerned about what your son did, too. He says he can't remember, and then all of the sudden this dog is cowering in fear? But was fine with your family before. However if it was something your son did, I wouldn't think the problems would show up with your wife, too...

I wish our dogs could talk :(.

Before yours attacks, does he do the thousand-mile stare? I've noticed that in mine once or twice before an incident. It is like he isn't even there.

One thing you can do is that if you start noticing warning signs - even if they are things that 99% of the time never lead to an incident - is get him into obedience mode. That has worked pretty well for us. Puppy pushups - sit, down, sit, up, sit, down, sit, up, etc. Shake, touch, etc, any tricks he knows. Dogs tend to enjoy doing their obedience tricks, get him in a different frame of mind. Emotions have chemical effects, even if this is entirely a medical problem, there may be behavioral things that are exacerbating the underlying condition.

When you are not around he needs to be crated in a room that your wife and son do not go in. This may be difficult for your wife but this is how things work with me and my dog. He is not around the family at all when I am not around, as a solid 80% of the incidents occurred when I was not present. Incidents may be rare, but I'm not taking any chances.

It is possible having him neutered may have an effect, but I haven't done this with mine because I worry about what kind of effect that might be. I don't know what is wrong with him and making a major hormonal change like that is going to have a many-faceted effect. And it's not like I can just put his balls back if something goes wrong. Maybe try testosterone blockers? I'm not saying that's the sole issue, but until you get a definitive diagnosis you may want to see what might be exacerbating the real issue.
 
#54 ·
Ok, an update. To everyone with sound advice/opinions, thank you. I do think someone in here many threads ago said it best however, some think of themselves as pros or behaviourists or even know it alls. The bottom line is every single dog is different just like humans and there is no way to get inside their heads. This is not a forum for challenging an accusation such as I will most likely find out my son did something to set the dog off. When someone is desperate for help for the love and in the case life of their pet, it would serve all best to assume what the writer is writing is honest so that there is no wasted time.

Draugr, I'm sorry for your case. It is heart wrenching. Our most recent, Seig was loving on us last night before bed and then switch-growled at my wife.

We spent hours on this all day yesterday. His doctor ruled out several possibilities (thyroid, blood work, etc) as he has seen Seig consistently and then more due to an injury, anxiety as a puppy, dry skin...typical GSD things. He has seen him 4x in the past month. I'm going with his vet on this. As far as Trifexis, w/o remembering exactly how he explained it to me, there is a drug in there which is specifically in there to prevent what the suggestions in the threads were concerned with.

He will be neutered this morning ($333) and has an appointment with the behaviourist tomorrow at 11am ($260/hr x 2 hrs + $150 emergency appointment. It's not inexpensive when we are simply guessing, again, no one can know what's made this extreme change happen for Seig. But hopefully it's money well spent. $1000 to keep our family pet would be well spent. $10,000 to KNOW he will be his original personality with no aggression toward his family would be better spent. We are all guessing in this.

A lot of you had great suggestions and really, all of yesterday was just heart breaking thinking we weren't going to be able to keep him (alive). We appreciate the help and of course will update. I'm sure Draugr will only be the first behind our post. Hopefully just a few but it's scary, it's sad and it's so confusing when nothing in his world has changed.

Thanks again for all the help.

Draugr please let us know what you decide to do...what your thoughts are.
 
#61 ·
We spent hours on this all day yesterday. His doctor ruled out several possibilities (thyroid, blood work, etc) as he has seen Seig consistently and then more due to an injury, anxiety as a puppy, dry skin...typical GSD things. He has seen him 4x in the past month. I'm going with his vet on this. As far as Trifexis, w/o remembering exactly how he explained it to me, there is a drug in there which is specifically in there to prevent what the suggestions in the threads were concerned with.
Honestly, I really think you should find a second vet for a second opinion. Aside from the fact that it's worth doing anyways in cases with bizarre behavior, no vet worth their salt would rule out things that can only be dx'd through blood work on the grounds that they've known the dog since he was a puppy. And the complications from trifexis have been pretty well documented. And telling you that it's perfectly OK to take a drugged dog for a behavioral analysis doesn't really make sense to me either.

Because my vet has known my dog since he was a puppy, if I described this kind of behavior to him, he would be putting him through the wringer trying to find a medical cause.
 
#55 ·
Sorry, no, do not know how to view PM. Again, yesterday was a rush to find help/opinions.

Also, it is definitely not a resource/food thing...we used to laugh, like within the last month that we are the only 3 humans in this world who could get down on our knees and kiss the dog while he was eating.

It is an extreme switch. It is not something my son or wife has done (as in consciously aware of). To the extreme he is spoiled. It would serve the thread readers and people who may encounter the exact situation better to believe us when we say that so we can get to the bottom of it. If we want to focus on the person or blame or cause, if anything it would be spoiling.

I agree with another poster---the fact that I travel on/off 30 days every other month I believe could have something to do with this. It began with the son the day I got back from my longest trip at work and with my wife the day before I got back from a small 2 week trip. He may potentially be thinking, "what do mom and brother do with dad?" I have no idea, it's a thought.

We'll update after neutering/behaviourist.

THANK YOU EVERYONE
 
#56 ·
If he is neutered this morning (does the therapist know about this or maybe advised this?). I was thinking that he would like to see him the way he was and not drowsy and in pain from surgery. Just wondering, no criticism here.
I wish you good luck, it is heartbreaking. Please keep us informed as more of us are dealing with this.
 
#59 ·
So we dropped the pup off for neutering. Wife did insist/ask for thyroid test as they are doing blood work regardless.

As far as taking Seig a day after neutering and an altered/drugged state, we'd thought of that and asked the doctors clinician. We were assured it will not interfere with his assessment. With 4 years medical and another 4 years on the canines psyche, we can only hope its true.

We will update.
 
#60 ·
Something triggered this. You say that it all started after he jumped the fence. It is very possible (even likely) that something happened to him after he jumped the fence. Perhaps he received an electric shock or some sort of injury. Perhaps he was injured by a boy who was around the same age as your son. Perhaps he received a blow to his head and now how swelling in his brain. Who knows? The vet should have considered every angle though.

No matter how much you spoil a dog they are not going to all of a sudden start growling at and biting you. Then there is the fear factor and then there is the factor that it is not just one person, it is now two people in his immediate family.

I think you are wasting a considerable amount of money taking him to the behaviorist right after he was neutered.

However, please write _everything_ up in advance, in a timeline and ask everyone in the family to contribute their perspective.

Finally, just because the vet has been seeing this dog since he was a puppy does not mean that he it is impossible for him to miss something.
 
#63 ·
Clarifications:

Did NOT happen after jumped fence. First growled at son 3/12, jumped fence very early am 3/29, then first aggression with wife late 3/29.

Vet did NOT say he could be analyzed fine w/o worry about the drugs after neutering. The behaviourist said this.

He IS having blood work analyzed.

Thanks to all again
 
#64 ·
Oh my goodness Seig, your story has brought tears to my eyes. I can only imagine your heartbreak and frustration at having the dog you have loved and raised, turn so unexpectedly.
I do believe that there is some solid advice in this thread, but I also want to give you credit for the lengths you are going to, to have this resolved. It is clear that this is a matter close to your heart and that you will do whatever it takes. I know some dog owners who would have given up long ago.
I truly believe that you and your dog deserve a positive outcome, and I wish you and your family all the best in restoring the relationship and balance that you knew before.
Please keep us posted.


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#65 ·
I honestly would be worried about having him go through a surgery, under anesthesia when appropiate health testing (IMO) has not been done yet to rule out any medical issues.

My comment has nothing to do with my personal feeling on neutering, everyone does what they feel is best in that regard. But is this surgery absolutely necessary right now?
 
#66 ·
I understand going with what your vet suggests, and trusting in the education, experience, and licensing procedure a vet has to go through to practice.

I would not want to be in your shoes.

I hope that you can find something that will help.
 
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