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Old 02-24-2013, 05:59 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Here's a couple more links:

http://www.tufts.edu/alumni/magazine...imal.htmlhttp:

http://fearfuldogs.com/techniques-fo...red-dogs-feel/
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Old 02-24-2013, 06:34 PM   #12 (permalink)
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when my dog was a pup we use to visit the Vet 2 to 4 times
a week for treats, petting, mock exams and socializing.
i wonder if you started going to Vet for training and socializing
would it help? how old is your dog?
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Old 02-25-2013, 10:50 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Thank you all so much for the replies, seeing my dog react so aggressively was an upsetting experience.

Russ is two. When he was in his first year we did a lot of dog walks and he 'met' dogs and kids. He did well, he liked playing with dogs over in the park by my house. I took him to a dog park and he hid behind me, so many dogs was over whelming so we didn't do that again until recently.

Russ blew out his shoulder and was on low activity for a few months, hoping to heal his injury. This when he was about a year old. He walks fine now but will limp a bit after a long hike.

He was neutered and they found a hernia which they also repaired. I didn't pick him up until after work. Being there all day and hurting might of had a long term affect on him, I wish I had taken the day off and picked him up earlier. Having low activity might of caused trauma, too.

It might be best to switch vets, they did have an emergency and therefore the wait but now there are too many triggers there. It is a 'bad' place to both of us now. Starting fresh with a new place would give us both a fresh start. Russ also has an ear infection, his left ear is red inside and dirty. They took a swab and he is on ear drops to clear it up. Wondering if this could of made him more aggressive towards people, who knows. I wish he could talk.

I was watching a Caeser video where he is dealing with an aggressive dog. He would put his hand in front of the (muzzled) dog's nose and say SHHHHH and touch the dog on the side. Maybe something to try with Russ? What do y'all do if your dog is barking and growling at a person or another dog? What action do you take?
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Old 03-01-2013, 09:31 AM   #14 (permalink)
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I went to my vet with my 7 month old GSD Dante and it was a horrible experience. All the employees were making direct eye contact with Dante and talking to him like a baby which set him off. No lunging, just barking. We go into the exam room and the Vet, and I can't believe I actually saw this, opened the door on the other side of the room and made direct eye contact with Dante and then started talking to him like a baby. Dante at first was puzzled. He was sitting next to me and you could see the wheels turning in his head. After about 5 seconds of the Vet displaying this kind of behavior Dante started warning barks. At the exact moment he did this the Vet closed the door and came back with a muzzle. I was beyond furious!

EDIT: And I forgot to mention this. After the exam when Dante and I were at the counter paying, a nurse walked right next to me and Dante to give me his prescription. She made zero eye contact or verbal contact with Dante and he didn't do anything! I actually thanked the nurse for her approach. Wish the other employees would take notes from her.

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Old 03-01-2013, 09:44 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doggiedad View Post
when my dog was a pup we use to visit the Vet 2 to 4 times
a week for treats, petting, mock exams and socializing.
i wonder if you started going to Vet for training and socializing
would it help? how old is your dog?
And the Vet allowed this for free?

EDIT: Does anyone know how to make Threads show up form first to last? Clicking on a Thread and having to click on the last page and last post to start from the beginning is very annoying.

Last edited by Rodimus80; 03-01-2013 at 09:51 AM.
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Old 03-01-2013, 10:29 AM   #16 (permalink)
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And the Vet allowed this for free?

EDIT: Does anyone know how to make Threads show up form first to last? Clicking on a Thread and having to click on the last page and last post to start from the beginning is very annoying.
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Old 03-01-2013, 01:01 PM   #17 (permalink)
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I used to go in often and weigh the dogs to get them used to the vet visit. Now I don't. I am sure this isn't true of all dogs, but for me, if I am frustrated or nervous, the dog will have a rougher time of it. If I am confident, the dog manages the situation perfectly well regardless of vet-socialization, smells, wait-time, etc.

When I would take Cujo to the vet, he was fine, never acted afraid or anything. When my dad took him in, it was always reported to me that he was scared. Hmmmmm. My dad was raised Christian Science and has a fear/discomfort of anything medical.

There are three approaches to undesirable fear-based behavior:
1. Coddling, telling the dog it is ok (even though it is clearly not ok), petting, hugging and otherwise comforting the dog.

2. Ignoring the behavior. Standing your ground and letting the dog carry on until he gets over himself.

3. A quick correction, "Eh! Cut that out!" accompanied or not by a leash correction.

And it just depends on the dog. Some dogs will take that coddling to mean that they are truly about to murdered and be twice as terrified. Others will find comfort in the reassuring presence of their owner, but it will do nothing to help the dog build its own confidence level. I think it is likely to prolong the scene and have other scenes similar to it with some dogs.

Ignoring the dog's behavior and letting it work it out, will reinforce the fact that barking, whining, scratching, reverse sneezing, and otherwise acting up will not get the dog what it wants -- outta there. The dog will come through the situation alive and may be less concerned and worried about the whole thing on the next visit.

A simple, firm correction might bring immediate results. "Oh? You don't want me to bark? Ok." And that MAY be the end to it. On the other hand, if there is deep fear going on, and the dog continues to be in deep fear, just is not expressing that, the dog might be pressed beyond its threshold without letting you know it is getting near its threshold. But I think most dogs are perfectly ok with a correction for something like this. They are not murdered, the next time they come in, it is old hat, and the correction just cuts short the unpleasantness during that visit.

Whenever my dogs have endured something unpleasant at the vet, like getting the hair plucked around a wound, or getting shots, or getting an injured limb examined, I ask the vet or tech if they could give my dog a treat at the end of the ordeal. They always do. It is not like the dog looks forward to getting a treat, but I make sure that the visit ends on a happy note for the dog.

Over and above everything else though, I use a no-nonsense approach, and my dogs all go in without a struggle, without fear, I can put them on the scale and get their weight, I can hand them over and tell them, "Go with her." And they will. They do not growl or bark or carry on. And I really think it is because I am not over there exuding fear pharamones that my dog can smell a mile away.
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Old 03-01-2013, 01:07 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Much appreciated.

Actually have a Obedience Trainer coming tomorrow morning to evaluate Dante. He runs Kanine Command of Buffalo which would be easy to find on a Google search. Looking forward to a experienced dog handlers assessment.
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Old 03-01-2013, 01:52 PM   #19 (permalink)
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I went to my vet with my 7 month old GSD Dante and it was a horrible experience. All the employees were making direct eye contact with Dante and talking to him like a baby which set him off. No lunging, just barking. We go into the exam room and the Vet, and I can't believe I actually saw this, opened the door on the other side of the room and made direct eye contact with Dante and then started talking to him like a baby. Dante at first was puzzled. He was sitting next to me and you could see the wheels turning in his head. After about 5 seconds of the Vet displaying this kind of behavior Dante started warning barks. At the exact moment he did this the Vet closed the door and came back with a muzzle. I was beyond furious!

EDIT: And I forgot to mention this. After the exam when Dante and I were at the counter paying, a nurse walked right next to me and Dante to give me his prescription. She made zero eye contact or verbal contact with Dante and he didn't do anything! I actually thanked the nurse for her approach. Wish the other employees would take notes from her.
About a year or so ago, I was in the office with one of my crew, and the vet was telling me about a recent seminar that she had gone to. The speaker was discussing how to handle dogs and saying not to look them in the eye. The vet on the other side of her nudged her and said, "makes it pretty hard for me" His specialty was eyes.

Vets have to look at the whole dog, including looking into their eyes. I understand the whole staring in the eye is a challenge thing. I think it is an excuse though for embarrassing behavior. Don't get me wrong, when Milla and Ninja were puppies, there was this vet tech that had a high, screechy voice, that always made those two in particular ready to turn tail and run all the way home or dismember her. Looking back, that was an excuse I was using for the dogs acting like buttheads. Other dogs did not freak out when she squealed at them.

People acting fearful around your dog can set some dogs off. People look into a dog's eyes to see if they are going to attack them. It is not the best thing to do, but people do it. Ya gotta wonder what these dogs are thinking. Scaredy-person looks into the dog's eyes which can be read as challenging it, and the dog can smell the fear and says, "Yeah? Really??? I'll make mince meat outta you, Wuss! Bring it on!"

I think that mostly the dog is in a strange place, their owner is a little on edge, maybe from the bill, maybe from concern about whatever reason they are there, maybe because they are worried about how the dog will act, and maybe because they know they are out of their depth and are relying on the vet and staff to get it right about their critter. On the vet/staff side of the game, there are people out there that are afraid of GSDs. They have been bitten and they don't want to be bitten again. And whenever a GSD comes through the door, there is another potentially dangerous dog and clueless owner. So they have distrust, anxiety going on as they look at the dog, and they may make tentative motions. So the dog reasonably thinks that he is in some horrible place where these awful people are planning on doing something terrible to him, and his owner is either in on it, or isn't going to be any help whatsoever. "AaaaaarghhH!!!! GET ME OUTTA HERE!"
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Old 03-01-2013, 02:38 PM   #20 (permalink)
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I see your reasoning and understand it. But I feel the Vet should've at minimum told me he would be evaluating my dog. Just my 2 cents.
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