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Old 01-04-2013, 05:37 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Cindy also trains with Michael Ellis now.


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Old 01-04-2013, 06:27 PM   #32 (permalink)
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Is there a link you can share? Because everything I read on his site had some pretty nasty things done to dogs.


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I figured you'd have it...?? Where did you get the quote for your original post?
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Old 01-04-2013, 07:18 PM   #33 (permalink)
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I figured you'd have it...?? Where did you get the quote for your original post?

Leerburg | Aggressive Dogs Q&A

It's a little past the halfway point on the page.
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Old 01-04-2013, 08:18 PM   #34 (permalink)
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BTW I found the comments on the leerburg site and it's actually someone named "Cindy [a trainer] at Leerburg" who doles out advice, not Ed saying that about the shovel.
Cindy is Ed Frawley's wife or girlfriend - not sure if they're actually married or not.
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Old 01-21-2013, 11:43 PM   #35 (permalink)
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Default What does everyone think of this?(leerburg.com)

Ed is a well respected person in the working dog field. He like everyone I know that has ever trained a dog made mistakes along the way. Myself included.
Regardless, Ed for the most part talks about some very hard dogs. No offense but these dogs are beyond the abilities of the emotionally driven trainer. Dogs that he talks about would receive a one way ticket to the vets from the softer trainer as they would not know how to handle them, never mind train them.
Although I agree those extreme methods can be jaw dropping, keep in mind that he is talking about an extreme dog NOT your typical one that the majority of trainers today handle.
Working Dogs, Hard Dogs, MWD, is an area that is well beyond PET training.
Even if you may not agree/understand his methods, you should respect the fact that he has handled and trained dogs that most would not go within 25ft of on there best day.


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Old 01-22-2013, 02:02 AM   #36 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SFGSSD View Post
Ed is a well respected person in the working dog field. He like everyone I know that has ever trained a dog made mistakes along the way. Myself included.
Regardless, Ed for the most part talks about some very hard dogs. No offense but these dogs are beyond the abilities of the emotionally driven trainer. Dogs that he talks about would receive a one way ticket to the vets from the softer trainer as they would not know how to handle them, never mind train them.
Although I agree those extreme methods can be jaw dropping, keep in mind that he is talking about an extreme dog NOT your typical one that the majority of trainers today handle.
Working Dogs, Hard Dogs, MWD, is an area that is well beyond PET training.
Even if you may not agree/understand his methods, you should respect the fact that he has handled and trained dogs that most would not go within 25ft of on there best day.


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Good point! Until one has actually handled some of these VERY tough hard dogs, then one shouldn't make too many comments!

Many trainers would never want to even try with a dog who potentially might decide that he/she will direct their aggression "up the lead".

And some dogs, no matter how nice one treats them, might just decide that they really do not want to sit or heel that day at that moment.
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Old 01-22-2013, 12:01 PM   #37 (permalink)
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I'm telling ya, codmaster, clicker and cookies is the way to go!
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Old 01-22-2013, 12:20 PM   #38 (permalink)
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Frawley does himself no favors by relating that story but I get the sense he got a lot of self satisfaction out of it...
If I recall he also has a section on his website advising (over and over again) euthanasia for a wide range of aggression and other "unfixable" temperament issues that people come to him for help on.

However I do agree that hard or sharp working dogs with over the top drives require a balanced form of training and tools

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Old 01-22-2013, 02:19 PM   #39 (permalink)
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I'm telling ya, codmaster, clicker and cookies is the way to go!

But what about for the dogs?
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Old 01-22-2013, 03:35 PM   #40 (permalink)
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I'm telling ya, codmaster, clicker and cookies is the way to go!
Clicker and Cookies have their place! If someone can't acknowledge that, than the person is just as ignorant as those who can't acknowledge the necessity of a well placed correction!
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