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Old 12-25-2012, 09:52 PM   #61 (permalink)
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Actually, yes they do. I read a study on it a couple months ago. As well as them reacting to "fair play". It was all pretty interesting.

I had to look that up. Very interesting. I knew about the "fair play" deal. You have to treat them equally. I know if I give something to one without doing it for the other, I get the stink eye.
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Old 12-25-2012, 09:52 PM   #62 (permalink)
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Savage- VERY nice pack you have there!
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Old 12-25-2012, 09:55 PM   #63 (permalink)
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Savage- VERY nice pack you have there!
id really like to keep it that way.
I just wish it was the way things were a few days ago, just all the dogs playing and having fun, noone trying to kill the other one. Everyone friends again. etc.
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Old 12-26-2012, 10:41 AM   #64 (permalink)
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So we have an appointment at the Vet today with Nala.
My wife did some research and believes it could be a thyroid issue, a tumor of some kind has been tossed mentioned on several occasions. I guess bloodwork would reveal either of those symptoms.

Currently we are keeping Nala downstairs, pretty much by herself and no interaction with the other dogs. I will probably walk her some today if i can.
Is this advisable? She doesnt have to stay in a kennel all day or anything like that. Or would it be better to briefly bring her up here and put her in the kennel? I dont want her to stress anymore than she does or than GSD already seem to do.

Nala has always been an 'antsy' dog. She obsesses over simple things like I have mentioned before. If you pet another dog she will come running to nuzzle the other dog out of the way. Certain people she is ultra excited to see, my sister who originally rescued her is one. Nala will go berserk when she comes over tackling and licking and just generally wants to love her to death.

Any further advice until we find her a home? completely separate from the other dogs until then? My wife is still considering a muzzle. Give me more feedback on why this is bad.
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Old 12-26-2012, 11:09 AM   #65 (permalink)
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If you pet another dog she will come running to nuzzle the other dog out of the way.
Guarding behavior. She's insecure. Stop her from doing that.
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Old 12-26-2012, 11:26 AM   #66 (permalink)
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My wife isnt sure if she trusts the GSD now. Its just a trust thing now I guess.
Have you tried sharing all this great feedback with your wife, seeing if perhaps her perspective changes a bit (like yours has, evidently). Seems to me like rehoming the golden would be a lot easier than the GSD with "aggression issues"
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Old 12-26-2012, 11:34 AM   #67 (permalink)
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Have you tried sharing all this great feedback with your wife, seeing if perhaps her perspective changes a bit (like yours has, evidently). Seems to me like rehoming the golden would be a lot easier than the GSD with "aggression issues"
ill have her read the thread today, she was at work last night when the bulk of it was posted.
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Old 12-26-2012, 11:42 AM   #68 (permalink)
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I think dogs get jealous, and some females take jealous to a whole other level. I call it the Green Gene. They have a lot of the same emotions we do, they are are canine emotions, which are different, maybe more raw, more simple, deeper, stronger, and some dogs have a much harder time not reacting to their emotions. Fear, anger, jealousy, grief, loneliness, excitement, contentment, playful or happy, and others.

people conceal their emotions, dogs only do so if they have been trained (usually replacing that emotion with fearfulness, and training them not to respond to fear normally). If a dog who is fearful or angry growls, and is beaten for growling, they may just cower or go to the next step.

I am really up in air about anger. How much of the anger that we see, even in dog fights, even in the dog that started the fight is not anger but fear? A dog sticks its hair up, and barks and lunges like a nutcase, growling, snarling, snapping. Basically the dog is saying get the heck out of here! But jealousy turns into anger, turns into rage.

A dog that rages without jealousy, I don't know, that seems like it might be a problem with how they are wired or a disease of some sort affecting their brain.

I don't know about fair play either. Some of my dogs are let out in the field to run, some are not. Sometimes I come home with bones for five of them, the rest of them do not get bones. I don't get the stink-eye, the bone-receivers do not get the stink eye. Mostly the girls are anticipating and hopeful that I will get to them and give them a bone. If I say, "That's it, that is all I have," They will turn and go back to whatever they were doing. And Joy will start working on a plan to relieve a bone-receiver of their prize. (Somehow she always succeeds too -- and they are in separate kennels!) But there is no animosity, so I suppose the dogs do not resource guard treats or food. Good.

It is funny though, some of them will cry and bitch when I pay attention to a specific bitch. Odie will bitch and moan if I pay attention to Jenna. Ninja will bitch and moan if I pay attention to Heidi. It is seriously interesting. I am sure letting those pairs get together would be a mistake. On the other hand, Tori shows her werewolf teeth toward Jenna and Jenna doesn't give her the time of day. The same with Ninja. Ninja broke free of a crate while I was moving Jenna and her pups from one kennel to another, and Jenna grabbed her by the muzzle and held her down. I grabbed the puppies and put them in a kennel and then dragged Ninja by the tail into another kennel got the gate between and finally got them separated. Ninja was hurt and angry. Jenna wasn't even shaken up. I put her back in with her good sized pups, and no problems. Jenna is three years older than Ninja, but they are both mature bitches. I think there is something not quite right with Ninja.

But yes, canine emotions are very interesting, and as for jealousy and love, if it looks like jealousy or love, and it acts like jealousy or love, than I don't see the problem with using the terms, so long as we maintain the understanding that these are dogs and not humans.
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Old 12-26-2012, 11:58 AM   #69 (permalink)
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I agree Selzer. Something else i just thought of, after nala attacked bella the first time, they were separated for many hours. then when they were back together they played and everything like normal. I remember seeing Nala take her chin and put it on Bela's back and push down trying to get her to forcefully sit/lay down. I had never seen her do this before. She has even tried to 'hump' Bela before all this happened too.

I think she is obsessed with Bela she interacts with her differently than all of our other dogs. Im starting to wonder if the yorkie attack is even relative at this point. There are a few consistent themes but alot of unknowns.
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Old 12-26-2012, 12:19 PM   #70 (permalink)
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Sometimes you have to read a whole thread to be able to read "between the lines" and pick up on what is really going on.

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My wife isnt sure if she trusts the GSD now. Its just a trust thing now I guess.
Let me go out on a limb here. 3 dog pack, everyone is fine. New cute Golden introduced as a puppy. GSD sees its share of attention drop, gets antsy, still gives the pup a puppy pass. Wife loves on the new pup, her attention to the not-so-cute-anymore GSD wanes (not intentionally). Wife develops preference for Golden. Extremely perceptive GSD picks up on this. Meanwhile, Golden continues to grow and mature and becomes not a puppy but a more mature bitch. First incidents with GSD jealousy begin, just small things, but wife gets more defensive toward the GSD, "trust" issues develop, GSD (extremely sensitive and perceptive!) senses these, and sees wife "consoling" Golden over the big, mean GSD behaviors. GSD dominance assertion escalates to attacks.

Am I close?

Rehome the Golden, roll the clock back to the household you established for the pack as it was before, and restore the relationship between wife and the GSD.
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