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Old 12-03-2012, 07:05 PM   #11 (permalink)
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is it worth re-training yr dog for the unlikely occurrence that you will meet two complete nutters in the dog's lifetime. dogs bark - nothing gorundshattering there. did yr dog strain at the end of the leash snarling at the guy?, did it chase the guy up a tree just missing him with its fangs? i would not re-wire yr dog over this, jmo.
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Old 12-03-2012, 07:14 PM   #12 (permalink)
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That is really scary with the guy actually getting his gun out. Here it would be considered illegal to threaten a person like that - after you had already controlled your dog and was speaking to him especially. I know you take full responsibility for it all and I applaud your attitude but don't worry yourself too much. Your dog knew the guy was a cookie short of a dozen I think and reacted appropriately for what he felt. It's great you have such a solid recall. I shudder to think what could have happened. I do carry concealed but my number 1 rule is never take out that gun unless I plan to fire it. I do not believe in threatening people. There are some people out there that should not have concealed permits. Glad it turned out okay. Now about that skijoring - sounds like fun but we have no snow.
^This is very well said! I think Teri has the right perspective on this. It seems quite irresponsible to brandish a deadly weapon, even if you have no intent of using it. I mean, I have come close to pepper spraying a dog and then didn't have to because the owner regained control, but I have never waved the canister in the owner's face afterward. And that's not even a deadly weapon.

I think your plan for training sound excellent, and try not to be too hard on yourself. The man overreacted. For someone who claims to have 8 dogs, you would think he would be a bit less afraid of them, no matter what his history with being bitten is.
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Old 12-03-2012, 07:34 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Report this guy.

It is not illegal for a dog to bark at someone three times. If Your dog would have done that to me, I would have spoken to the dog, not come unglued.

That guy threatened you. Showing you his gun was a threat. It is NOT legal to flash a gun at someone in order to intimidate them.

I respect your desire to make sure your dogs are good citizens. However, I wonder what this guy might have done had you NOT had your dogs with you.
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Old 12-03-2012, 07:49 PM   #14 (permalink)
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is it worth re-training yr dog for the unlikely occurrence that you will meet two complete nutters in the dog's lifetime. dogs bark - nothing gorundshattering there. did yr dog strain at the end of the leash snarling at the guy?, did it chase the guy up a tree just missing him with its fangs? i would not re-wire yr dog over this, jmo.
My understanding was that the dog was off-leash? And the dog running and barking, that can be scary, especially for someone who has had a serious dog bite. The fact that the guy has been bitten seriously makes him all the more likely to be bitten again. This could be because his own actions might make dogs more reactive in the first place, or his fear of dogs since his bite might make dogs more apprehensive of him. Either way, a dog running loose and barking in such a manner that it is directed toward a stranger, is cause for that stranger to comment or expect an apology.

This yayhoo went overboard though.

And, sometimes we think we got our dogs at the next level, and then they surprise us, and we have to take them back a few steps and work more with them. If we are running radio-controlled cars, we could have a 100% certainty what reaction will follow each action. But with living creatures we cannot ever achieve 100%. I personally do not think that the answer is to always keep every dog muzzled, caged, or tethered to us. I think at some point, when we are in the high nineties, a part of our training can be off-lead work around other people.
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Old 12-03-2012, 07:57 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Did the guy threaten you with the gun or just take it out? Point it at you, for example?

I too would feel threatened by a dog running at me barking. Wouldn't let them get too close before some reaction is needed on my part. If you do let them get too close might mean a bite.

Maybe a leash is the answer - so you do have control of your dog and the other folks can see that.

I don't know about others, but I assume that an off lead dog is out of their owners control (based on my experience!) until proven otherwise.
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Old 12-03-2012, 08:00 PM   #16 (permalink)
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i missed the off-leash bit, i thought they were pulling a sled or something. my bad.
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Old 12-03-2012, 08:01 PM   #17 (permalink)
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I would call the police.

I actually approve with concealed carry. We have it my state too. Gun enthusiasts do not like people being idiots with the privilege.
Couldn't agree more.
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Old 12-03-2012, 08:05 PM   #18 (permalink)
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And, sometimes we think we got our dogs at the next level, and then they surprise us, and we have to take them back a few steps and work more with them.
So true.
Yesterday I read about a Malinois K9 who got run over by a car because he ran into traffic when the officer let him out of the patrol car for a break.

I may be overly cautious, but I don't see ever being able to let Hans go offleash, no matter what. He is an animal, and they simply don't reason. They can be highly trained and they can learn a lot, and they can amaze us with their intelligence and capabilities, but at the end of the day, they are still animals ruled by drives and instinct.

The person you ran into was trying to get even and scare you because your dog scared him. If the incident happened as you say, in a run by, there was no need for him to say and do what he did.

I don't believe he has 8 dogs. Actually, I hope he doesn't.

I'm sure your Mal barked at him because she got the creep vibe.

Hope you don't run into this guy again, and I am glad nothing really bad happened.
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Old 12-03-2012, 08:05 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Thanks for the responses, I was afraid I might be lambasted for letting my dog bark at someone- I have already beaten myself up over that again and again.

I think it is worth training for 100% (or as close as possible) control over my malinois. She is a strong dog with a bit of reactivity which is normal for the breed but not something to take lightly. People also carry guns when hiking, for bear protection. There is no reason I should risk this happening again and not being so lucky. If we turn a corner on a trail and encounter someone acting strangely unexpectedly, I still want to have a 100% recall on my dog. She may have been reacting to the guy being sketchy, but doing so made me less safe, not more. I need to be able to control her in this type of situation.

Skijoring is really fun- I will post a recent video. We haven't had much snow in town yet, which is why we travelled to the remote area to skijor. I don't think I'll be going there again anytime soon.

The guy pulled the gun out of his chest holster but didn't point it at me. This was during the conversation post-encounter. That was enough to shake me up pretty good.

I think half of the problem was that we startled him. He was walking along on a remote trail and was suddenly being barked at. Had I called out, etc. he may not have had quite as severe a reaction. I have been yelled at when skijoring for passing someone too fast- even though I have bells on the dogs' harnesses and also yell out when I see someone to let them know I am coming by. And this is when the dogs do nothing wrong and just pull silently in harness. So, trail-user conflict was probably part of it. Those can get ugly even without a barking dog being involved.

Also, my malinois looks scary when barking- her teeth are very white, she has a black face and muzzle, she has pointy ears. She looks like a typical vision of a vicious police dog. She never charged the guy or remotely tried to bite him, but she was trying to look scary, I'm sure, and apparently succeeded.

I'm still feeling shaken up, but it is always good to have motivation to get out and train, especially at 0 degrees F.
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Old 12-03-2012, 08:12 PM   #20 (permalink)
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I think the dog sensed something too. I don't think that barking a few times at someone would constitute that person pulling a gun. It scares me to think how many crazy people are allowed to have guns if this guy is allowed I'm happy that everything turned out okay
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