New here with an aggressive German Shepherd

Nutro · 07-20-2011, 11:23 PM

Yes I know we're a crazy family for having this many dogs.

I rescued 4 dogs over the course of a year. They were all puppies and are currently aged:

Black and Tan Coonhound - 1 year old (First adopted)

Catahoula Leopard - 1 year old (Second Adopted)

German Shepherd - 1 year old (Third Adopted)

Blue Gascon - 6 months (Fourth to be adopted)

They are all female except the Gascon. They're all around 70 pounds but the Gascon is closer to 80 pounds, so they're all puppies with some weight on 'em.

The Shepherd is out of control now. She is attacking all of the other dogs for no real reason. I don't mean being playful and fighting, I mean full blown fight. I just had to run into the living room and pick up the GSD and push her to get her off of the Gascon.

There was a pile of 5-6 rawhides on the floor and the Gascon went over to smell them and she attacked him.

Some of the dogs are afraid to enter the house if she is near the door and she won't let them in or out.

I've tried a shock collar, I've tried smacking her, positive reinforcement etc

Now my Gascon is bleeding because she got his ear in the fight but he put a whooping on her as well. I checked her over and she seems to be fine. The fight lasted about 10 seconds.

My last GSD was 14 years old and well trained and an excellent dog. This one just does NOT listen and WILL NOT learn anything AT ALL. I've taught her basic commands such as sit, come and that's about it.

Her normal routine is first thing out the door, run over to the shed in the back yard and try to catch some mice that live under it. She then runs the perimeter of the back yard looking for anything. Then, when the other dogs come out, some playful wrestling and chasing whoever has the toy or rawhide. Sometimes, this will turn into a fight.

One of her abnormal traits is to SCREAM like I'm hurting her when she has a leash attached and we step out the door for a walk. She absolutely FLIPS out and SCREAMS and YELPS so loud the neighbors several blocks away come out to see who is being murdered in the street. I doesn't seem AS bad when she has a full harness on but if it's a regular collar, or a choker, she goes crazy trying to get away from you while letting out her blood curdling screams.

I'm looking for some help and guidance as I just don't know what to do.

Thanks,

Daniel

Mrs.K · 07-20-2011, 11:26 PM

don't adopt the fourth dog then. It might sen her over the edge. Trust me, I have vast experience with that and adopting a fourth dog to the pack will not make things any better. Learn how to manage the three you already have.

For now I'd say rotate them in the crates. Have the two others out while she is crated and her out while the others are crated.

sagelfn · 07-20-2011, 11:29 PM

It is not uncommon for females to HATE each other. There is a saying "males fight to breed, females fight to breathe"

Another issue is you have 4 puppies in a large pack. Trying to figure out their roles.

Did you adopt these dogs from a shelter/rescue or purchase them?

Have you consulted a trainer or behaviorist?

Do not EVER hit your dog. You train. You give a fair correction if needed. If anyone needs hit you hit yourself.

Nutro · 07-20-2011, 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sagelfn

It is not uncommon for females to HATE each other. There is a saying "males fight to breed, females fight to breathe"

Another issue is you have 4 puppies in a large pack. Trying to figure out their roles.

Did you adopt these dogs from a shelter/rescue or purchase them?

Have you consulted a trainer or behaviorist?

Do not EVER hit your dog. You train. You give a fair correction if needed. If anyone needs hit you hit yourself.

I assure you when I say smack, I mean a quick tap to the rear to correct. I don't HIT my dogs and never have.

All 4 were Rescues/Adoptions

I previously had a GSD and another Lab/Dalmation mix. They lived long and happy lives (14 and 15 years old) and they recently had passed. We grieved and thought finding some new family members would help.

We started with the 2 pups first then one day I was at the rescue to get some paperwork and I saw Liberty (the GSD in question) and I immediately wanted her in the family so I signed the papers, paid the fees and took her home.

KSdogowner · 07-20-2011, 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nutro

One of her abnormal traits is to SCREAM like I'm hurting her when she has a leash attached and we step out the door for a walk. She absolutely FLIPS out and SCREAMS and YELPS so loud the neighbors several blocks away come out to see Daniel

I second what Mrs K said. There needs to be stability in your pack before adding another dog. I think the important thing is to recognize the personalities and needs of the pack you already have and base your decision as to whether you add a member or not on that evaluation. You have a GSD that was obviously abused in some form. A major sign is how she reacts to a collar and leash. I would not try to force her to wear the collar. She is a wounded soul and needs your patience to work with her to overcome her fears. So I would be gentle with her. She probably does not feel secure in the pac and is on the defensive. All this can be corrected with positive reinforcement, training and patience, patience, patience. Meanwhile, I would keep the dogs separate when you are not able to be right there with them.

KZoppa · 07-20-2011, 11:42 PM

it sounds like you added 3 dogs into your family without really giving them a chance to adjust to a new home on top of adjusting to you. You just threw them together before getting to know them and their quirks. Please keep in mind GSDs are a dominant breed and sometimes dont mesh well with other dogs. Best advice i have for you is remove temptation. No toys, no items of value available unless the dogs are crated with doors closed. Training. When your shepherd starts to zero in more than would be normal or okay on one of your other dogs, discourage, distract, redirect. All else, bring in a GOOD private trainer.

**Samba** · 07-21-2011, 01:03 AM

Every dog is different.... some do wll in pack situations and others do not. Having high value items lying like chewies about would result in my girl taking no prisoners! There has to be close supervision. Nothing worth fighting over out and about. My favorite GSDs have not been great "throw them in a pack" kinda dogs. I have to watchnwhongoes with who. The queen bitch here stands alone and she wants no other dogs about generally.

With so many young dogs, how is the individual training goingbwith each one? I have 5 hete now and not all do well turned out together. It is huge to take that many dogs in close together.

BR870 · 07-21-2011, 08:42 AM

Just wanted to say glad you came over. I directed the OP here from another forum.

The "screaming" while on leash is an odd behavior, and very well could point to abuse or psychological trauma. However, I knew a poodlemix who did similar, and she was not abused. She was fearful/submissive though, so... We used to call it her Gollum act... You know, "it burnz me..."

Forgive me, not thinking straight this morning. My 3 year old son has pneumonia and we've been in the hospital all night...

**gsdraven** · 07-21-2011, 08:57 AM

That is a lot of young dogs (and mostly girls!) that probably have very little prior training. Although your intentions seem good, I would hold off adding any more dogs until you have your current ones to a point where you trust them completely and feel they are more or less trained the way you want them.

You need to take away high value items (rawhides, toys, food) when they are all together. I would feed everyone in crates or as spaced out as possible. This may be a forever thing, it may just be until they are settled in together. Each dog needs separate training, exercise and socialization. Not saying you do this but letting them play together is not exercise and will only strength their bond with each other, not you. You need to set clear rules, boundaries and expectations with all of them. I would read up on NILIF (Nothing in Life is Free) and implement if you don't do it already.

You also may have to accept that the GSD may just not be able to get along with the other females and that you will need to crate and rotate or find her a more suitable home.

Have you contacted a trainer to come in and assess the situation?

BR870 · 07-21-2011, 08:58 AM

Also, lemme second the suggestion looking into Nothing in Life is Free or NILIF (being an ARFCOMMER, I am sure you will agree with the premise).

This will help establish your dominance and make clear to the pack that you are on top...

As I mentioned on the other forum, Leerburg.com is a great resource and has a number of articles and videos that are worth watching...

Leerburg | Directory of Information on Dominant and Aggressive Dogs

07-20-2011, 11:23 PM	#1 (permalink)
Nutro New Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Austin, Texas Posts: 3	New here with an aggressive German Shepherd Yes I know we're a crazy family for having this many dogs. I rescued 4 dogs over the course of a year. They were all puppies and are currently aged: Black and Tan Coonhound - 1 year old (First adopted) Catahoula Leopard - 1 year old (Second Adopted) German Shepherd - 1 year old (Third Adopted) Blue Gascon - 6 months (Fourth to be adopted) They are all female except the Gascon. They're all around 70 pounds but the Gascon is closer to 80 pounds, so they're all puppies with some weight on 'em. The Shepherd is out of control now. She is attacking all of the other dogs for no real reason. I don't mean being playful and fighting, I mean full blown fight. I just had to run into the living room and pick up the GSD and push her to get her off of the Gascon. There was a pile of 5-6 rawhides on the floor and the Gascon went over to smell them and she attacked him. Some of the dogs are afraid to enter the house if she is near the door and she won't let them in or out. I've tried a shock collar, I've tried smacking her, positive reinforcement etc Now my Gascon is bleeding because she got his ear in the fight but he put a whooping on her as well. I checked her over and she seems to be fine. The fight lasted about 10 seconds. My last GSD was 14 years old and well trained and an excellent dog. This one just does NOT listen and WILL NOT learn anything AT ALL. I've taught her basic commands such as sit, come and that's about it. Her normal routine is first thing out the door, run over to the shed in the back yard and try to catch some mice that live under it. She then runs the perimeter of the back yard looking for anything. Then, when the other dogs come out, some playful wrestling and chasing whoever has the toy or rawhide. Sometimes, this will turn into a fight. One of her abnormal traits is to SCREAM like I'm hurting her when she has a leash attached and we step out the door for a walk. She absolutely FLIPS out and SCREAMS and YELPS so loud the neighbors several blocks away come out to see who is being murdered in the street. I doesn't seem AS bad when she has a full harness on but if it's a regular collar, or a choker, she goes crazy trying to get away from you while letting out her blood curdling screams. I'm looking for some help and guidance as I just don't know what to do. Thanks, Daniel

07-20-2011, 11:29 PM	#3 (permalink)
sagelfn Crowned Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Illinois Posts: 3,748	It is not uncommon for females to HATE each other. There is a saying "males fight to breed, females fight to breathe" Another issue is you have 4 puppies in a large pack. Trying to figure out their roles. Did you adopt these dogs from a shelter/rescue or purchase them? Have you consulted a trainer or behaviorist? Do not EVER hit your dog. You train. You give a fair correction if needed. If anyone needs hit you hit yourself. __________________ -Brandi Sage 6-5-09 Facebook

07-20-2011, 11:42 PM	#6 (permalink)
KZoppa Crowned Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Maryland kinda missing CO Posts: 13,803	it sounds like you added 3 dogs into your family without really giving them a chance to adjust to a new home on top of adjusting to you. You just threw them together before getting to know them and their quirks. Please keep in mind GSDs are a dominant breed and sometimes dont mesh well with other dogs. Best advice i have for you is remove temptation. No toys, no items of value available unless the dogs are crated with doors closed. Training. When your shepherd starts to zero in more than would be normal or okay on one of your other dogs, discourage, distract, redirect. All else, bring in a GOOD private trainer. __________________ The more people I meet and talk to,the more I love my dogs and their intelligence. www.krystalscollarcreations.weebly.com Riley GSD/BC 1/10/05 Zena GSD 6/1/03 Shasta GSD 5/5/10

07-21-2011, 08:42 AM	#8 (permalink)
BR870 Master Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: Baton Rouge, LA Posts: 828	Just wanted to say glad you came over. I directed the OP here from another forum. The "screaming" while on leash is an odd behavior, and very well could point to abuse or psychological trauma. However, I knew a poodlemix who did similar, and she was not abused. She was fearful/submissive though, so... We used to call it her Gollum act... You know, "it burnz me..." Forgive me, not thinking straight this morning. My 3 year old son has pneumonia and we've been in the hospital all night... __________________ Rob Ezra von der Rennbahn Princess Abigail "Abbie" Kai (RIP) Loki (RIP)

07-21-2011, 08:57 AM	#9 (permalink)
gsdraven Moderator Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Mont Co, PA Posts: 4,623	That is a lot of young dogs (and mostly girls!) that probably have very little prior training. Although your intentions seem good, I would hold off adding any more dogs until you have your current ones to a point where you trust them completely and feel they are more or less trained the way you want them. You need to take away high value items (rawhides, toys, food) when they are all together. I would feed everyone in crates or as spaced out as possible. This may be a forever thing, it may just be until they are settled in together. Each dog needs separate training, exercise and socialization. Not saying you do this but letting them play together is not exercise and will only strength their bond with each other, not you. You need to set clear rules, boundaries and expectations with all of them. I would read up on NILIF (Nothing in Life is Free) and implement if you don't do it already. You also may have to accept that the GSD may just not be able to get along with the other females and that you will need to crate and rotate or find her a more suitable home. Have you contacted a trainer to come in and assess the situation? __________________ Jamie Raven (GSD) - December 8, 2007 Kaiser (GSD) - November 2009 Lead The Way Life's Abundance

07-20-2011, 11:26 PM	#2 (permalink)
Mrs.K Crowned Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 6,375	don't adopt the fourth dog then. It might sen her over the edge. Trust me, I have vast experience with that and adopting a fourth dog to the pack will not make things any better. Learn how to manage the three you already have. For now I'd say rotate them in the crates. Have the two others out while she is crated and her out while the others are crated.

07-21-2011, 01:03 AM	#7 (permalink)
Samba Administrator Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: USA Posts: 6,447	Every dog is different.... some do wll in pack situations and others do not. Having high value items lying like chewies about would result in my girl taking no prisoners! There has to be close supervision. Nothing worth fighting over out and about. My favorite GSDs have not been great "throw them in a pack" kinda dogs. I have to watchnwhongoes with who. The queen bitch here stands alone and she wants no other dogs about generally. With so many young dogs, how is the individual training goingbwith each one? I have 5 hete now and not all do well turned out together. It is huge to take that many dogs in close together.

07-21-2011, 08:58 AM	#10 (permalink)
BR870 Master Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: Baton Rouge, LA Posts: 828	Also, lemme second the suggestion looking into Nothing in Life is Free or NILIF (being an ARFCOMMER, I am sure you will agree with the premise). This will help establish your dominance and make clear to the pack that you are on top... As I mentioned on the other forum, Leerburg.com is a great resource and has a number of articles and videos that are worth watching... Leerburg \| Directory of Information on Dominant and Aggressive Dogs __________________ Rob Ezra von der Rennbahn Princess Abigail "Abbie" Kai (RIP) Loki (RIP)

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