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What "lines" are WGSDs from?

5K views 30 replies 16 participants last post by  Whiteshepherds 
#1 ·
Are they American lines or??:confused:
 
#3 ·
Working German Shepherd dogs?

Lines... East German/DDR, West German, Czech Republic are the main three.
 
#7 ·
Whites were among the very first GSDs, so they have always been around. But in Germany they were selected against after a certain point.

Americans, however, continued breeding whites. I am not sure if there were many breeders in Germany who bred whites, so I want to say that Whites are an American line GSD... but distinct from American show lines.
 
#8 ·
Good question! (Ignore my previous answer... LOL)

I always thought the white German Shepherds didn't look like GSDs in structure, unless you had one born of two coloured parents with correct conformation. It is indeed true that there are white dogs amongst the oldest shepherd dogs (among other colours such as brindle) - Greif von Sparwasser was white!
 
#19 ·
I always thought the white German Shepherds didn't look like GSDs in structure, unless you had one born of two coloured parents with correct conformation.
Really? There are so many beautiful ones with no standard colors going back 3,4,5 generations. I think the lack of markings and solid color create an optical illusion especially around the head/muzzle. I notice it in the solid black dogs too, neither is easy to get a good picture of.
I do think there's something different about the long stocks but that includes all colors. Their ears look different to me among other things.
 
#10 ·
There are whites coming out of Europe (though they have a new name) so they are not all American lines. I have not paid attention to the lines of the ones coming out of Europe so don't know if they have been separate for many generations or if there are some familiar names there.
 
#11 ·
There are whites coming out of Europe (though they have a new name) so they are not all American lines. I have not paid attention to the lines of the ones coming out of Europe so don't know if they have been separate for many generations or if there are some familiar names there.
I think you are talking about the Berger Blanc Suisse (BBS).

Berger Blanc Suisse - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
#13 ·
don't some people register them as a separate breed, i think an "alpine shepherd" if they are from two registered alpine shepherd parents but can not be registered if they are a mutation from one or two non-white sphepherds??

don't know where i heard this, prolly wrong.
 
#16 ·
As long as both the sire and dam carry the white masking gene white pups can be produced ... I think the white gene has been almost completely bred out of a lot of the colored lines (or they're a well kept secret).
 
#17 · (Edited)
I didn't read the whole story, but figured this was one of the best places to start History of the White Shepherd, American White Shepherd Association, I never really thought about the question before. Does anyone know if Max's book mentioned the White German Shepherd? What about the Total German Shepherd? I would think that old Shepherd dog breeder's would be amongst the first to even have them, since most farmers don't care about type or color but, workability on the farms.

I wonder if anyone of the Shepherd breeders would remember or have been told where the white Shepherds came from? It says on the site provided above that Ann Tracy had White Shepherd Dog's. Also, this:

"The first reported AKC registration of white coated German Shepherd Dogs were from a litter whelped March 27, 1917 from the Stonihurst Kennels."
 
#21 ·
I didn't read the whole story, but figured this was one of the best places to start History of the White Shepherd, American White Shepherd Association, I never really thought about the question before. Does anyone know if Max's book mentioned the White German Shepherd? What about the Total German Shepherd? I would think that old Shepherd dog breeder's would be amongst the first to even have them, since most farmers don't care about type or color but, workability on the farms.

I wonder if anyone of the Shepherd breeders would remember or have been told where the white Shepherds came from? It says on the site provided above that Ann Tracy had White Shepherd Dog's. Also, this:

"The first reported AKC registration of white coated German Shepherd Dogs were from a litter whelped March 27, 1917 from the Stonihurst Kennels."
The color white is one of the original colors of the German Shepherd Dog when it was developed in Germany.
 
#20 ·
Regardless of what some people want regarding breed separation, the dogs are still GSDs!!! And I'm willing to bet that the majority of breeders who support breed separation breed dogs which are registered with AKC or CKC as GSDs (some may be dual registered as White Shepherds or German Shepherds with UKC).
 
#25 ·
Thanks for the explanations White....

It will be interesting to see what happens ... hopefully it won't take another 40 years or so to get it resolved :)
 
#26 ·
My main concern with seperating them out is that there are many "pet" or BYB bred dogs that carry the white gene and could produce white puppies from colored parents. Would they be regitered as GSD's or BBS's?
 
#27 ·
My main concern with seperating them out is that there are many "pet" or BYB bred dogs that carry the white gene and could produce white puppies from colored parents. Would they be regitered as GSD's or BBS's?
How did they do it in the past with breeds that started as one breed, then were categorized into separate varieties? Like the Belgians? They are considered one breed with four varieties in Europe, while over here they are four separate breeds (I'm counting the Lakenois, not sure if they have AKC recognition at this point). I'm sure that a longhaired pup has popped up in a Malinois litter in the US, is it simply registered as a Malinois with a coat fault? Or as a Tervuren? And if the latter, what is the process? I can see there being pros and cons to each, it could certainly open up the gene pool for Tervurens for better or worse.

It would be a cumbersome situation if you had a white pop up in a well-bred litter; the WGSD people would no doubt want to get their hands on those bloodlines and have the pup registered as their own.

In a BYB litter, it probably doesn't (and shouldn't) matter what the offspring are registered as, since they probably shouldn't be breeding anyway. :crazy:
 
#28 ·
If a Mal shows up in a Terv litter or what ever they are considered a Terv with a fault. They are separate breeds in the AKC. So, if the WGSD is made a separate breed any white pups born to GSD would be in the same situation they are in now. A faulty color in the breed still able to do performance events, but not show in conformation. A separation by variety would have made much more sense.
 
#29 ·
In a BYB litter, it probably doesn't (and shouldn't) matter what the offspring are registered as, since they probably shouldn't be breeding anyway. :crazy:
They might be, and sold as "rare".
 
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